[Patch 4.6.4] Pushing enemies knocked to the ground will make them immediately stand up (pre-Patch 4.6 regression bug)

Patch 4.6 had this change:

However, Patch 4.6.4 seemed to have reverted that change to pre-Patch 4.6 behavior. (Hopefully, this reversion is unintended.) Currently, if you push an enemy knocked to the ground by a stagger ult (like the Foot Knight ult), they will immediately stand back up:

Video source: CommissarTyr comments on Vermintide 2 - Patch 4.6.4

It seems that these Patch 4.6.4 changes reverted the above change by Patch 4.6:

I prefer Patch 4.6 behavior where pushing enemies knocked to the ground won’t make them immediately stand up. The “pushes can override explosion staggers” change should be further tweaked or reverted to Patch 4.6 behavior to prevent making enemies immediately stand up by pushing them.

The current stagger overwrite behavior has been reported as a bug multiple times since 2019. Linking some of the bug reports here for reference:

Summary

Low amounts of stagger reset fallen enemies
Enemies changing to much shorter stagger state if hit mid-air after Kruber charge
FK Valian Charge: its stagger effect can be overwritten and and "canceled" by another source of stagger
State of Knight
Several bugs - knocked over northmen frothers, Bret longsword riposte locking, Saltz red crossbow illusion, HM half a stamina shield bug
Valiant Charge
Enemies can have their stagger cancelled on uneven ground
PS4 Footknight ult knockdown is ignored by enemies occasionally
Mauler Skips Getting Up Animation and Strikes Back
https://www.reddit.com/r/Vermintide/comments/szwmpo/lesser_stagger_effects_should_not_override_larger/
https://www.reddit.com/r/Vermintide/comments/tmlejn/did_large_fish_revert_the_best_change_this_patch/

14 Likes

I’m baffled by this change - unless they reverted it temporarily to counteract a bug - nothing about this feels expected. If enemies are knocked down by FK or tossed around by explosions the last thing I expect is for a push to instantly teleport them back to their feet and let them start taking a swing sooner.

I’m also feeling like there’s a lot more jank around ledges, I get the impression enemies are hitting me halfway up if they get lightly staggered during the climb, which I suspect may be related to the last change, but I’m not sure if I’m imagining it or not. It definitely feels like I get hit by climbing enemies where I didn’t used to.

2 Likes

Nine full days. Thats how long it lasted.

Any bets on when thats getting fixed? Days? Weeks? Months? Centuries? Same as last time? Iam sure FK can wait another couple of years for that fix. The imprint he left in the chair at the end of the hall after sitting there for a bunch of years is still there. He can snuggle right into that again.

4 Likes

Why stronger stagger being overwritten by weaker one should be a thing?

1 Like

This bug is extremely annoying while playing as Footknight, but on other careers aswell.
Also I’m not sure if that’s just my perception, but I feel like the stagger issues introduced in 4.6 are not yet completely gone.
Stagger from pushing and from hits even on trash enemies seems to be unreliable during their attacks, especially when pushing right before the enemy blow lands.
I often seem to get situations where I push a group of let’s say 6 enemies and 1 of them somehow manages to land a blow and cannot be staggered until they finish the attack animation.
That said, hordes in general seem to have gotten more dangerous and unpredictable since 4.6, imo most probably due to still lingering stagger bugs >_>.

3 Likes

TBF this seems to only apply to pushing. At least attacks from allies will no longer put enemies upright, so it’s at least some improvement.

To be clear though I certainly do share your disappointment on this. Especially the lack of communication on what was largely the reversion of a long awaited bug fix, and this was not at all well communicated in the patch notes in terms of intention or future plans.

I don’t quite understand why “lighter staggers shouldn’t overwrite heavier staggers” is so hard to implement but I know next to nothing about coding so I guess there are some significant road bumps here.

Fatshark be like:
b1b640z9b3c21

2 Likes

It’s to counteract SotT and Moonfire Bow getting nerfed.

The reason this was reverted was this pretty obvious issue:

If you were fighting a dense mixed horde in melee and you were using a weapon/tool to set up “light” stagger before your attack so you dont get hit back - but at some earlier point one of your teammates applied a stronger stagger to one of the enemies in the horde - that enemy would not stagger from your “light” weaker stagger even if he was right about to finish his stagger animation.

Which means that it was common to push a horde and then attack but because one or more enemies in the horde were coming out of a stronger stagger they would immediately attack and hit you despite the fact that you just pushed the horde.

It was a pain to play quite frankly. If you played during that time and you saw an enemy where you said “i swear i should have staggered him and nothing happened” ^that was the reason why.

edit: as mentioned in the patchnotes this was not reverted for “explosions” whatever that means so yes, its quite possible this still happens on whatever “explosion staggers” are when enemies come out of those.

2 Likes

Yes i alredy knew that, but it’s a shitty solution. Stagger should’t be overwritten, it shoud stack: enemy in stagger 2 hit a second time by lighter stagger or gets it’s stagger 2 animation prolonged/resetted or it goes back to stagger 1 animation once exiting stagger 2.
And normally should be easy line of code to write.

3 Likes

It’s the modding community’s homework assignment

2 Likes

Also enemies hit during climbing animation do not have any stagger applied.
So once they finish climbing/dropping down their stagger value is at 0, so they can often immediately attack once the animation is finished.

1 Like

Does that mean that this Patch 4.6.4 change did not work properly?

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