Yep. We know this trick now, they promised in the leadup not to do it to us, they did, we’re mad, they wrecked their rep, and now they are trying to do damage control.
Players still need goals though. A fancy hat or toy that does a trick on demand is plenty. Keeping us from experimenting with builds isn’t it.
We were also promised we’d get lots of maps because they were building them in a ‘easy to reuse assets’ way.
Plus all the mechanics we don’t like, or don’t have, or so on. Like why can’t I use the same lasgun on my zealot as my vet? Finally getting shared wallet, need shared inventory.
This almost sounds like you’re saying that FatShark removing the locks would evidently make it so that players would get bored quick and leave the game.
However the in-mission-combat-gameplay-loop remains the star of the show and I’ve yet to see anybody largely claim that they’re tired of it and are leaving because of it.
If a large part of this game was a system that had anti-player mechanics that forced an artificial grind, halting progression towards a goal and making them waste more time doing something other than actually play missions, I would remove it. Yes, removing a large negative aspect of the game would equal to a large positive impact for player satisfaction.
An interesting tidbit from Catfish. I had thought that given the similarity in the Maelstrom mission’s appearance on the board to the Flash missions we saw in the old Mission Terminal Devblog that they were a rebranded version of that mechanic but according to Catfish, the Maelstrom missions are something completely different and Flash missions will be explained and introduced later on.
Interesting, I guess. I wonder if we will later have both Flash AND Maelstrom missions available simultaneously.
I am utterly baffled as to why someone somewhere thinks keeping anything to do with crafting locked is some kind of good idea. I’m dumbstruck this is what’s taken so long to “discuss” internally.
insert Picard holding his face here-
I’m no mathmetician/statistician but I get the feeling changing the probability from 1 of 2 things being locked and breaking your build, to any combination of 2 of 4 things being locked and breaking your build makes things quite a lot worse and QUELLE SURPRISE artificially increases grind time potentially rerolling new weapons you gain.
Someone with maths skills could help me out here.
I’m not sure if this has been mentioned before but #BreakTheLocks.
[edit] - Maybe breaking the locks would take away the main gripe and then people would be able to see the missing content? Keeping things locked keeps the players anger directed at this issue while they finish XBOX and maybe actually make some content.
Remember guys. This is the devblog statement from the november update from last year.
They know what players want, yet they have been delivering the polar opposite for 8 months now.
After months of “internally discussing the issue” we get a tiny change to the locks, which will effectively not have any impact on our chances to actually get the weapon we want (yes it will help with curios).
Who ever made that decision, is pissing in our faces.
I have never seen a developer being so tonedeaf and so desperate to cling onto an obviously bad system that ruins the entire game for the majority of the playerbase and that should have been thrown in the garbage within a month of being released (and should have never been implemented in the first place).
The people in charge of decision making in regard to crafting, should be fired on the spot (should have been fired months ago) for singlehandedly ruining a potentially great game.
But yeah… just put some more sprinkles on the turd. I am sure people will love it.
Sadly, there are enough people who think that this change will actually have an impact, so they might be silenced for weeks or months until they finally notice that they got shafted and nothing changed.
We were promised a feast, but instead we are being fed a single grain of rice every few months, served on a platter made of excrement.
@FatsharkCatfish
Any chance, the people in charge of the crafting system could come out of hiding and publicly explain themselves?
They made a trash system and have been ruining the game for 8 months now, not changing anything despite the feedback of hundreds of players.
They made the system and are seemingly hellbent on keeping it as bad as it is.
They have been ignoring many potential solutions in favor of a system that obviously has no place in this game.
They should be the ones getting the heat.
Have them explain themselves to the community and see how well they hold up, when trying to come up with reasons for why they delivered the polar opposite of what was promised and what people have been asking for on a daily basis since release.
Let’s compare Darktide to a very similar game (gameplay wise): Vermintide 2.
Vermintide 2:
older game and set in the less popular WH Fantasy
makes perfect items quite achieveable with minimal RNG
Darktide
less than 1 year old and set in the very popular WH 40k
makes perfect items basically impossible to achieve due to insane RNG
Everyone hates the darktide crafting system, 95% of the playerbase have left the game immediately (within a month or so) and the game’s population is now lower than the Vermintide 2 population.
Clearly, you are wrong about this one.
In vermintide 2, people actually grind for items because they will 100% get exactly what they want within a reasonable amount of time. And then they keep playing because they enjoy the game.
In Darktide, the grind is absolute garbage (100% rng, 0% deterministic, no pity system, no way to work towards anything) and your cances of getting what you want are almost non existent. Everyone who is in their right mind, gets annoyed to hell by the crafting system and quits the game after a while. Nobody except a few masochists will keep grinding.
Those who still play Darktide, mostly do so DESPITE the awful crafting system driving them away.
Obtaining the items that you want, and slowly completing a build, is what makes the gameplay more fun. Because it allows you to finally play the way you want.
Darktide does not have this. You can not work towards anything and maybe if you are lucky, spending 100hrs worth of currency on items, might give you something alright (but realistically, never what you really want).
What is better?
Having people play the game for x hours, enjoying themselves and getting the exact gear that they want, then returning when ever new weapons or new maps are released?
Having people play the game for x hours, not enjoying most of it, never getting the gear that they want to play with and then never return for new content, since they know that they won’t be able to enjoy it?
Pretty sure the first option is better for every single party involved.
A goal is great.
Winning the lottery is not a goal that you can work towards.
Darktide has no equipment related goal for players to achieve.
Having such a goal is what players have been asking for since release.
Conclusion:
In these regards, Darktide does everything wrong.
Just out of curiostiy: how much of a change can we expect on this front?
I’m gonna be real with you, 10% is really not worth it. If this number isn’t around +25% to +50% I don’t see myself caring about how much of a bonus this actually is.
Considering that the weapon locks still exist, we are going to have to upgrade to purple rarity now to see if an item is bricked or not. Which is why I’d ask for a percentage to make up the difference in upgrading costs from blue to purple. (which would have to be around 40 - 50%)
Just like right now, we will have to upgrade to purple or orange.
Nothing in that regard will change.
But considering how worthless the change to the locks is (in regard to weapons), they might as well reduce the prices of everything by about 99% in order to make it somewhat realistic for players to actually get what they want (although the system would still be complete trash).
If locks are removed, technically you just need 1 weapon of each type.
Collecting blessings is easy… I have close to every blessing I want (for the weapons I like). So, someone like me would only collect plasteel and not use it… when you reach the current cap x5 (new feature in the patch), you don’t need to craft lot of weapons… Hadron can change what you want.
In short, you get a 380 with good distribution, you don’t need a 370…
And you already can test everything you want. Someone was surprised that I showed 6 combat axe that were really good, but all different. In fact, as I already said, on my zealot, I have 9 combat axe and all are different. The purpose was to test things. I must say that I have my 3 preferred… but the tests permitted me to discover new templates.
If you point the weapon shop (normal one), yes I use it every days as I don’t use Brunt’s armoury. Brunt’s burn too many ordos before giving something acceptable. You must be seriously lucky to get a 375+ with good distribution. I never buy something from Brunt’s, except if I wanted to test something (so when I don’t care of the quality of the weapon and just want to see the difference between several weapons MK).
I can say the same… all you bring is “remove the locks”.
And you’re not correct about “all you bring is no to make a good crafting system without locks”
I have one that I would love and described it…
As I said, I don’t think that they would change the DT system to something like that…
And as I don’t think that they would introduce that, as I don’t think they will remove locks, I won’t loose my time at suggesting things that will never happen.
And so, I have think about improvement of the current system, cause, I have no doubt, we will keep it. But we could get tweaks if we push for some that can be implemented without entirely breaking the current system..
Let’s say that the reasons, behind the complains, for removing locks are not really clear. Several says that you cannot get a decent weapon in the current system. As I showed, you can obtain good, and even excellent, weapons in the current system.
I have seen also people that say that you cannot test what you want in the current system. I have 9 combat axe on my zealot, all different. Several are excellent. There are 3 that are good, but not excellent. So, we can test whatever we want in the current system (and as I said, for me the problem is the time needed to be able to test what you want to test).
So, what is the main problem? cause when you identify clearly the problem, you can imagine solutions. In the post #11 I said that the main problems, in my opinion, are the facts you need too much time to achieve something you want to craft and the difficulty to get a good base weapon.
None of these problems have been addressed in the incoming patch.
But, as I said in this post:
Actually, I proposed solutions to the current problem. Part of what I proposed would need a little work. But there are surely other solutions. Feel free to propose them, maybe they could even consider them.
At contrary, partisans of the lock removal only propose the lock removal, do not give a clear reason of the problem they want to address, and as this would implies lot of changes toward the game, they should also propose what needs to change in the crafting system. But they don’t.
Cause, as I said, removing locks would remove the interest in the current system.
You just need 1 perfect weapon. Once you have it, you would be able to change the blessings like you want. And, as you would not need to craft new weapons, you would have plenty of plasteel to rebless weapons before a mission.
So, what would be the interest of having ordos in this system? soon enough, you would not need to buy any new weapon. Soon, enough you would also have collected all cosmetics… and off course, you don’t need a lot of work to get all blessings.
You would end with a lot of ordos, plasteel, diamantine… and no use of them.
So, this means that the system would need to be changed entirely, at least if you want to keep blessings, tiers, resources… and even shop and so the Morningstar level.
Until now, I have seen noone trying to propose something about this. They just repeat “remove the locks”. But removing the locks has a big impact on what is around the missions.
As I said, the best way to remove locks would be to remove the Morningstar and put simple screen where you can prepare freely your char and choose a mission with whatever gear you want. Simple and efficient. But in such system, you don’t need tiers, resources, ordos, shops… the game could seem empty.
Maybe, as I suggested before, you should try to suggest solutions that could be implemented and that can work with the current system.
I must say that I would prefer that they bring us more content, cause actually the game is really repetitive. But, I would also want that they fix the current problems of the crafting. As I don’t think they will rewrite entirely the system, I expect only small changes or improvements.
So, I would not push for a total new system (even the one that I would have loved to see in this game) cause I think that this game needs badly content. On the other hand, the problems that I think is a big no for a normal player (ie time needed to craft something good) need to be addressed. However, I would hate that they loose lot of time to rewrite the entire crafting system as it would delay new content(s).
Try with 375+ weapons (check modifiers)… at this quality, you have lot of chances to get a T4 blessing when consecrating to orange.
Technically you could already see if an item was bricked at the blue level if neither the 1st perk or blessing were what you wanted…
Now that the permutations are opened up, purple is the new floor for being able to tell if it’s a brick or actually desirable…
I agree, this change to locks does essentially nothing but as an observation, we are going to have to upgrade more. Then there is the bonuses from quickplay and other missionboard that can add to what we get for rewards and those values are not definitive yet aka. there is an opportunity there for FS to eliviate more of the grind by making those bonuses make a difference.
Going from 800 to 880 plasteel… well I’d be shocked if anyone says that that makes an actuall difference.
Going from 800 to 1000 or even 1200… well now we can talk about if that’s desirable enough or not.
I’d personally say that 50% is the minimum and there could even be a bonus for how small of a team you que into quickplay with: solo → 2X the bonuses, 2-man → 1.75X → 3-man → 1.35X and 4-man Your 1X. Those values are obviously not exactly what I’m asking for and there even is the counterargument that this would discourage bigger teams into quickplay…
Then again malestorm could have the same multipliers but the bigger the team, the bigger the bonus…
Idk, I’m just spitballing at this point out of copium over the locks still existing
You have been playing since release…
Clearly, it is very easy to get all the blessings…
Now that you almost have all of your favorite blessings for your few favorite weapons, feel free to let us know how many hours of playtime you have by now.
Just so that we can have an approximation for how long it would take to “easily collect” blessings.
There is a bit of a difference between someone saying:
I can not think of a solution, so the locks must stay.
vs.
The crafting system in the current state is bad and the locks are the major painpoint, so they have to go and a better system has to be made.
You keep saying that there is no solution.
I keep saying that there is a solution.
Do you expect me to lay out every possible solution to the problem every single time i talk about it?
It is not my job to tell FS devs how exactly to fix their game. It is their job to figure out a solution to the problems that they brought upon themselves, and that the community points out.
Despite that, i have made multiple threads with comprehensive explanations of 100% complete systems that would solve all crafting problems. So i actually did try to do their job for them.
It would just not be very reasonable to post that complete system every time someone claims that locks must stay.
Do you want me to post a link to a different thread every time, or do you want me to just copy paste the entire post every time?
I do not think that this is a reasonable thing to do.
There is ample evidence that players hate locks since their introduction. Yet the game designers refused to remove them. Players can’t do anything about it. Only game designers can; but they won’t. And now they just doubled-down on them with this announcement.
The ONLY way these proposed changes to the crafting locks would even remotely be acceptable is if it reset the locks on all current inventory but NOPE…I have an extensive inventory and every transcendent item has 2 locks on it, they literally expect us to start over collecting items?
This is garbage tier and there is no insights as to why you all double down on this terrible system…
