To avoid lot of off-topic in the flamer nerf thread, I open a new thread about Bolter.
Here the last 3 messages of the thread about flamer
About this, I don’t say this is a bad idea.
However, I would really prefer something like increasing reload than what you propose.
In fact a slower reload would impact more the zealot, you’re right about this. But, the zealot should use it between two melee fights and also when things go bad.
And here, even with increasing reload they could do it.
But restricting moves, would impact badly veteran…
And I think, that’s my personal opinion, that, if we nerf the bolter (something I think is needed but a little), then the nerf should impact more zealots than veteran (i play both).
For the increase, I would say that they should 2-3 seconds that cannot be lowered even with a 80% reload modifier.
There is only one mk of boltgun in the game.
They could split the boltgun into two different mk: one for zealot only, one for veteran only.
Then it can be balanced more easily and individually for the two classses.
Still same weapon family, so the pool of earned blessings would still be shared across classes.
Don‘t know though, if it would even be possible to change a weapon type to two different things, depending on the class that owns it.
4 Likes
I dont get it, bolters are alright, not op.
2 Likes
And that’s your right…
Why do I think Bolter is OP… Well, I consider that Bolter / revolver / shotgun should be balanced between them.
I also consider that the bolter is fine on the power it delivers, and that it should not be changed.
Revolver and shotgun needs more ammo… lore speaking, the Bolter ammo are longer than the ones of shotgun and revolver. Let’s summarize, revolver should have 2 times the ammo of bolter and shotgun 50% more ammos than the bolter.
Shotgun does pretty good damages and has no piercing. However, I think the weapon is fine. But if we compare to the bolter, there is nothing that should incitate you to take a shotgun instead of a bolter.
Regarding revolver, it needs surely that the weak spot damages are increased a little.
Now let’s return on bolter.
- bolter has a full auto mode
- bolter has 15 ammos in magazine while shotgun can have, at max, 11, and revolver 5
- bolter can be used shot by shot… and then can be used to snipe like a revolver
- bolter has piercing ammo, not the shotgun (but revolver has it)
- bolter can kill bullwark and crusher easily… both revolver and shotgun cannot
Now, this being said, I repeat it. I don’t think, lore speaking, that the bolter should see its damages lowered or piercing ammos removed.
Bolter has to remain a bolter.
But game balancing, there are several items that can be changed to balance things and make other weapons more appealing.
I agree that shotgun and pistol are worse than bolter and bolter is fine as is. Bolter has slow animations, which is what makes it balanced. Pistol is supposed to be a quick swap and headshot weapon, kinda like in Tarkov… I think, but it just isn’t good enough in general to be worth it. Only shotgun in Darktide that I thought wasn’t dogshit is ogryn’s mark II ripper gun.
1 Like
Right now boltgun is OK weapon. No perks or blessings required really. They just boost boltgun efficiency further and vet ability makes boltgun ultimate solution against armored targets, while zealot still have to use try a bit harder in such case.
Would be nice to see different boltguns for both: VetSS and ZealotP, one from IG department and another from Ecclesiarchy. Diversity in such case would allow attune both without destroing enjoyment of this holy weapon. Praise The Emperor for such devine tool of redemption!
Reload speed is fine, but it looks too light for personal rocket launcher with 15 rockett propelled HE missiles.
Personaly, original deployment time was really awesome and such buff was unnecessary, but lack of tactical reload core game mechanic is issue here.
As of LMB mode on vet under valley fire it feels like i’m devastator and you already dead. While Zealot is simply killing designated targets. It supposed to be so, it’s okey.
And real problem as i see it - bulwarks. Those meatbags cannot deploy shield to protect 'em self from Boltgun, while still can eat my plasma charge from ultimate weapon.
This is long time known issue. Boltgun in design is pretty correct, but that episode Boltgun vs Bulwark and Plasmagun vs Bulwark is awkward and must be swaped.
Summary: to light to carry and move on with it and Bulwark core mechanics are incorrect.
1 Like
Whats even your point here?
You want bolter to be nerfed because shotguns and revolvers are in a rough spot, is that the logic you are using for this?
4 Likes
no pls topic about nerf power sword 
I will quote what I’ve written
But game balancing, there are several items that can be changed to balance things and make other weapons more appealing.
Here what I mean…
When you read several times that the shotgun is the worst weapon in game when you take it in T4/T5 difficulty… then it means there is a problem.
I suppose you play with a bolter to react like that… guess what… I have a perfect bolter on my zealot and a good on my veteran.
The definition of something OP is " To say that a character, weapon, or skill is OP is to say that they’re so strong that it gives the player an unfair advantage over others . It’s overpowered because it’s better than anything else in the game."
Actually the bolter is in this range… it is better than the other weapons of the game. And that’s why it needs to be rebalanced.
It is not better than only revolver and shotgun… it is better than a lot of ranged weapons in term of damages, versatility, uses, power…
And as I said, and note this is a personal opinion:
Now, this being said, I repeat it. I don’t think, lore speaking, that the bolter should see its damages lowered or piercing ammos removed.
Bolter has to remain a bolter.
But, this doesn’t mean that there is not things that can be tweaked to rebalance things a little.
Why did I took revolver and shotgun as example? Cause it would have no sense to compare a boltgun with a lasgun… however revolver and shotgun are closed to the bolter uses.
Not really, i prefer to use more mobile weapons that dont take an age and a half to reload and equip, i might whip it out on the zealot once in a while, but prefer using stuff like shredder pistols, revolvers and autoguns.
The only thing i can think off that the bolter does better than any other weapon in the game is to deal with bulwark shields.
It also dont make sense to compare it to only a revolver or the shotgun, if you want proper balance you compare overall efficiency, not efficiency compared to other very specific weapons. Yes, a bolter seems strong compared to a shotgun, but how about if its compared to a XII, or a Helbore, or a plasma.
Do i care if the bolter gets nerfed? not really, i barely use it, but the logic you are using to try and get something nerfed seems a bit misguided and flawed.
2 Likes
MG XII : fine to shoot far away, precise enough, lot of ammo.
Bolter can snipe, MG XII have a better magazine. However, you cannot hit a carapace with an MG XII, cannot kill a bullwark with it and cannot clean a room with an auto fire that the MG XII doesn’t have.
Hellbore: versatile, precise, strong vs elites
Like the boltgun. Hellbore has more ammo in magazine, however it is slower than the bolter to kill a crusher… and it cannot pass through the shield of bullwark and has not the full auto of the boltgun.
Plasma: good against single target
Boltgun does it also… but can be also an horde cleaner.
From my point of view, Boltgun can get on same result of these guns…but has more uses at the same time.
Edit: (I’ve forgotten to add)
I don’t try to get a nerf for one gun… I push for more balance between guns.
But I am ready to listen to arguments what is the weakness of the boltgun if we compare it to other weapons.
1 Like
God, will nerf whiners ever stop? The Devs just said they will take a look at the Flamer because of the metaslaves and tryhards constant screeching, and we already have threads about nerfing the Bolter, the one weapon everyone was extremely happy about because and I quote MilkandcookiesTW and the majority of big YouTube Warhammer content creators “The Bolter actually feels like a Bolter”
Now of course because tryhards think everything needs to be a drag to give their empty lives meaning, including a PVE COOP powerfantasy horde shooter, obviously the Bolter a tool of total annihilation, NEEDS to be “muh balanced!” with a revolver, and the Powersword, the lightsaber of 40k need to be unable to slash through multiple rotting zombies because the same tryhards literally can’t cope with the fact that their Vet teammate is able to do that.
What irks me the most is why you people don’t go and play Souls like games where you literally have to be a min maxxing troglodyte to win, why make this game worse for the rest of us?
i’m bad at games so pls don’t balance the game or i will struggle to clear t1 difficulty
As stated i feel like more than anything yall are on a different planet as far as bolter balance goes since you are acting like the gun the size of a microwave shouldn’t be this powerful. Even having 2 bolters on the team matches tend to not to be a cakewalk unless said person is using a god roll bolter (in that case good for them i guess).
I’ve honestly had easier times dealing with mauler and shooter swarms as a vet with the mg12 over the bolter because it’s far easier to line up follow up shots, keep my ability going, and reload with designate shooters than it is to keep that chain going with the bolter and maybe pop a free reload once every other room. The the zealot it’s mostly an emergency “oh no” button that has the downside of being extremely cumbersome to pull out and use in an emergency vs the revolver or shotgun which is an instant draw and gets far more mobility based skills and combos. I don’t know if you are playing with specific premades or what but almost every match ive been in has people eating all the ammo for their own ranged stuff minus the one match i had with 3 psykers and me as a zealot.
You are seriously comparing apples to oranges trying to balance it around the shotgun or revolver since as has been stated in the thread those weapons haven’t even gotten a proper pass. Compare that to the auto guns, las guns, and even the hellbore and you will see notable ups and downsides, i feel like you are just picking the worst two options and complaining that the bolter goes a generally better job killing things while completely ignoring any other point with it.
This gets annoying when people are constantly asking for nerfs on things because every time fat shark does a balance pass (even if they claim it’s a buff) there is a good chance that they overdo it and make a weapon completely unusable or tunes it into line of just being another pew pew nerf gun that doesn’t feel any different from anything else.
You may Ask for a mobility nerf but you may get -200 points of damage. Not to mention as stated in the previous thread it’s easily enough to say “this will preform like this and go like this every time” when you are just standing around the meat grinder shooting things but no real proof of it being a cakewalk in an actual match. Even then trying to balance things like this now seems pointless when they are likely going to add another difficulty and who knows how it will actually preform there.
4 Likes
That’s not true, for some of my arguments i said “if conditions are good”. You are saying like noone tried bolter, it’s an absolute lazy cakewalk cmon. I see less people playing with flamer because it makes runs boring, same thing will happen with bolter, if not already.
As it’s happens in a natural gameplay when roaming enemies just chilling.
Don’t forget that devs also have ingame metrics, they can see pure numbers and get to conclussion like “winrate for bolter runs is 90%, they take ~5 minutes less, and bolter has 70% of overall team damage”
So how did that work out for the Ogryn “buff”?
So the point is not to nerf the bolter, but to buff underperforming weapons?
If we are talking about vet, there are other good weapons available with several upsides compared to bolter.
I’d say bolter should have the fastest TTK of mixed groups (it’s a bolter), and plasma should win out on carapace/bulwark (it does kind of win out on crushers but it’s a pain to deal with bulwarks).
2 Likes
I don’t try to get a nerf for one gun… I push for more balance between guns.
But I am ready to listen to arguments what is the weakness of the boltgun if we compare it to other weapons.
I have several setup (will speak only of my zealot)
- Combat axe (BM+Headtaker) / Boltgun (nearly perfect Shattering Impact + Pinning Fire)
- Combat axe (BM+thrust +15%) /Flamer (Quickload + Blaze away)
- Combat axe (BM+headtaker) OR Combat axe (decimator+headtaker)/ Revolver (Hand-Canon + surgical) OR Shotgun (I test it actually)
- Worst… Combat blade (executor/mercy killer) OR Tactical axe (BM+Headtaker) / Agri Brauto ( Speedload + Fire frenzy)… I keep it cause I like the gameplay…
- This one is for penances… so it changes often
Well, let’s say it… If I want to make an easy run… Flamer or boltgun is the ones I will use. The third is the one I like. But, let’s say it… it makes the run harder…
As a zealot, I will use ranged weapon from time to time but… it depends mainly of the team.
If the team is always behind (team of veteran by example), I will be less in melee (toughness regen not good when you re not in coherency).
If there is an other zealot or an ogryn, I will use less ranged weapon.
But most the time… it is a mix… you shoot when you are not close to the enemies, and melee once you get in melee range.
So yes… I tried Bolter, flamer, revolver, shotgun…
Do you want I talk about my veteran (weapons are, actually: MG XII, Bolter, Plasma gun, shotgun, revolver)
And then you will need buff all other weapons to not suck again?