Vet nerfed to the ground with new talent tree

I had a really decent build for a melee focused Veteran with VoC before this major update, now? Now I’m basically sacrificing way more than I did previously to make it work comfortably in Auric Damnation. Hell, I had a number of builds which worked, sure, I wasn’t the most powerful thing running around Tertium, but it worked, it felt good, I was happy.

Now? Now I’m not so sure.

They’d be better off just reverting the changes, these keystones are utter garbage especially since they’ve just been tacked down at the bottom of the talent tree. Not to say no effort has been put into this, but. It just comes across of, “We don’t know what we want to do, how do we make this healthy for the game?”, I’m surprised they didn’t get more community feedback first, but well, here we are.

Sure having some of the more powerful nodes moved to the top is nice, but then they’ve mostly been nerfed as well as with everything being rearranged so you can’t build in a certain manner. It’s actually more restrictive than it used to be, but that’s mostly going to come down to the fact they’ve shifted major nodes around and with some that are more necessary are deeper in the tree and the more niche nodes that would fit only certain builds are now force-buys tax nodes, it is definitely a major nerf to Vet.

Hell even my current build is likely to just flatout ignore the keystones, because they will force me to overspecialise and I’ll be honest, they don’t really seem worth the investment. I’d be losing out on more important stuff to allow me to survive and contribute to the team.

I don’t see why Veteran has been consistently altered, it’s clear they do not know what they want the Veteran to be, I won’t be surprised if they do another rework after this one is poorly received. Infact, I’m positive most people weren’t asking for this, what Veteran needed was nodes consolidated and their choices to matter more, I don’t feel like I have choice right now, infact, I’m more than likely going to build in a really linear way, ALMOST like how we had BEFORE the talent trees were introduced, way to go.

You’re going to see more cookie-cutter builds just to eek out the most from these trees now.

Plus the keystones themselves, we’ve got one decent one, another that is just ‘Why’ and then one that is just unnecessary cause you’ll already be strong enough on the ranged damage part anyway, so why bother?

Like who the hell is going to use “Focus Target!”, it’s counter-productive, mostly due to the fact if you’re playing fast and hard, you’re going to be pinging every special, yes, but that means the majority of the time you’re only going to apply a 4% damage bonus since you’ll be pinging far too often than the stack refresh, seriously 4%. What the zog is 4% going to do? It’s about as good as that Fireteam Aura, which used to be 3%, but is now 5%? Wow, really big, much power, so funny. Pray to FartShart to hit a breakpoint people.

So do they expect Veterans with said Keystone to not be cooperative and selfishly horde their stacks via not pinging? Seems like it! Since that’s the only way to get any value out of that keystone, if you wait 10s every time when the game has multiple bigguns coming at you. The only time you’d even get the full stacks off, is between waves, so really, it’s ass. Oh and if you apply the ping onto a target you don’t need to? Cool, waste of stacks right there.

“Weapons Specialist” is okay. Can’t really fault it. Just… Why the zog is it at the bottom like the rest of the keystones?

“Marksman’s Focus” just seems like you’d be overinvesting, in all honesty but at the same time has this weird punishment mechanic tied to it unlike the other Keystones and just seems rather unnecessary. Why have a stack degradation condition tied to it, if you can prevent it from just playing like every other Veteran? Seems very over-designed for the sake of it.

I give it a 4 out of 10, Veterans now have to sweat harder.

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I’m sat here with it open, trying to make my favourite playstyles again, and I can’t. The skills are moved around, the new keystones are not worth the investment.

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You know for someone that has gone from this

immagine

to this

immagine

with pretty much the same perk choiches (and sacrificing the keystones)

its pretty easy to tell if i got a nerf or a buff

and dont tell me this is worth with the super buffs the keystone have because i’m just not buying it, i mean just look at it

immagine

this is laughable

immagine

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Laugths in, Stamina, sprinting and recovery when no enemies nearby

Why are so many nodes geared towards being faraway as well as having to run fast
For example, increased aura size is due to you being far away.
Stamina and movement speed. Slow immunity. Ranged kills against enemies near teammates. A “Focus” skills that punishes you for moving.
Lastly a stacking Damage boost afters sprinting

Which sucks by the by.
There is some cool stuff in them but aspects of them are just not thought out.

Cool: Left buffs a ton of weapons and rewards better aim. Right gives a few ammo hungry weapons better ammo economy if you use melee from time to time (looking att you plasma) and the middle is cool for RP builds and bosses.

Could be better:
The left keystone removes stacks while moving unless you keep hitting headshots.
Why not have the stacks stay for as long as you’re aimed?

The middle one gives you a single target that can receive some decent bonus damage but only every so often. Why just have stacks to begin with? Why not apply the bonus to all enemies akin to the single one tagged?

The right ones stacks do not last long enough for most weapons and it doesn’t help with swap speeds at all so certain weapons just get shafted.

1 Like

jfc this talent tree rework is terrible.

Before the patch I was able to replicate my pre-talent tree builds under the new system with a few notable exceptions like reload on ult. But this new tree has gutted every build I had. Half of the talents I was using were moved to inaccessible spots far down the tree where I can’t afford to buy them, half of the remainder were nerfed by a full 50% for seemingly no reason.

And for what? The keystones? Don’t make me laugh. They’re all terrible and even if they weren’t they are so far down a tree bloated to the gills with tax nodes that I can’t afford to buy them and still have a build that isn’t a straight line.

I’m probably going to quit playing veteran as my main over this, maybe the game entirely.

9 Likes

Experiment. Try stuff you wouldn’t normally. Again I can’t play until later this afternoon but it took a bit to find optimal vet builds in patch 13 and 14 and I don’t doubt it will be the same here.

Well thats the problem I assume. From my understanding the keystones are why this “nerf” happened as they provide more avenus of survivability. The base toughness nerf is genuinely a bit upsetting but I’m not going to cry over 20 health.

Are you seeing this???

Same complaints as the rest of us, an independant party just entered with the same complaints.

Come on Drago!

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vet main players never happy :blush:

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The thing is they don’t. Tags with stacks is cringe and useless, they should just copypaste Saltz WHC tag with flat buff numbers.

It’s kinda the same tree with the same problems, just with keystones attached wich doesn’t provide much while take more points. Not cost efficient.

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Ouch, yeah that’s an obvious sign.

Before rework:
dbdce87995b3fdb5948aa68257cae387

After:
5a84c0cc82755936714c54f49362d507

But I’m doing some very funny things with the tree now.

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This is just a repeat of the patch 13 Vet tree complaints.

There is every chance that the new skill tree isn’t up to par. However considering the patch hasn’t even been out for a day I say start experimenting with stuff and see what works and what doesn’t instead of saying that the world is over.

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ye you just sacrificed all weakspot damage and the 25% ammo perk, fair (not)

EDIT

at least weakspot damage still works for melee, i guess it could have been even worse

EDIT

ye i agree, if you go low tech weapons you still get a decent rending build without having to sacrifice too much, but i play OG vet with bolter and power sword, i get nothing from rending

I don’t even bother using a ranged weapon outside of certain specials + maniacs to be honest.
My lasgun I can just spam headshot repeatedly on the things I need it to kill.

I just Chainsword dance around and spam VoC, it just works. Or well it did, probably still does, but yeah.

Like I said, it’s clear they do not know what Veteran wants to be, so here we are.

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The fact that i am just not even considering using keystones is kinda showing for how well thought out this new talent tree is.

I have not had to much time testing out a plethora of builds yet, but from what i can tell it looks like you will have very rigid build options if you wish to push down into a keystone.

I am not gonna lie, so far i preferred the old talent tree.

Maybe someone with more experience making build will be able to cook up something good.

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I’m so mad reading that I just made a really powerful build last night went to sleep and was planning on getting on and playing my vet to level 30 since I was at level 28

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Yeah, but that’s part of the problem, they’re quite literally forcing Vets down a linear path at this point for anything above Heresy+, it’s making the class unfun.

I mean sure, Powersword meta was boring, but we managed to escape that and we had it okay for a while until this rework.

Here’s what I’m using.




As you can see, I ain’t messing with no keystones for this build to emulate my previous one. I’ve lost a fair bit but oh well.

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BRO, survivalist is a must, you are a useless vet without it, please riconsider, all the rest is great, i suggest you shovel with decimator instead of chainsword, with the perks you choose it hits like a truck

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They do have an understanding on what different paths will be for vet
Left, range. Middle, support. Right, melee.

If you just go down each path you become very squishy.
If you mix up the paths then you miss the keystone (which are bad anyway)
tbh the tree you posted is how i have done mine and always done it. Its the only good tree. albeit lacking the survivalist aura

Screw the RNG crafting progression, I cba with constantly being on that copium train, hoping that I’ll finally get two out of four of the things I need.

And nah, I don’t run Survivalist, ammo drops enough and I never have to use my gun much so I let the rest of the gang pick up the drops instead.

1 Like