The ramped up difficulty is only for legend end events? I know this is a legend ending thread but are FS only buffing the end events on legend or is it across difficulties? If you get pummeled and die at the end of recruit due to a small buff in enemies it’s still a buff to the end vent that prevented completion. If it’s only legend that gets the buffs then you’re right, but there’s nothing in the store to tempt people enough to drop difficulty to farm the shillings yet.
I have to agree with people, most end events are just overtuned. Convocation finale is still a massive pain in the dongliz and even when my team is quite good it’s normal for almost everyone to die.
The current shift is also on the tangent set since 2.0 of “players need to work closer together” and a considered move away from Dodge to victory™ in 1.6.
Stagger was quite a tidal-shift for people to adjust to, and definitely in Fort BiltongBurger whenever a PUG moves as a mob to the cannonball and back again it works. If someone yomps into the distance to res, or LEEEEEROOOY JENNNKINS off the ball on their own then it’s often wipe time.
Forcing more co-op play might be the eventual aim, but it’s a bit of a brutal way of making people work together when you powerslam new players to Legend into the floor with plague monks and SV.
You can be literally carried by players or bots through legend maps with books - so yeah. Besides, that’s my opinion about so-called legend able.
I agree with this. So this Froh’s criteria of challenges kinda strange as there are no other bounds in game rather than power restrictions that prevent you from playing legend. If you take that as criteria of legend able that still won’t help to define difficulty because apart from gear and char level there is also skill involved.
I think there is no conspiracy involved. The game becomes super boring as soon as it becomes easy. Also, most of the events were buffed long before Lohner’s shop was implemented.
The main problem is that FS doesn’t know how to make difficulty interesting rather than throw shittone units into players.
If you can beat a run with 2 grims using bots, you’re legend able.
Bots being capable too sometimes doesn’t change that really, it’s a 4 person game. You don’t need to TS to say you’re capable of doing legend lol
There’s no need for any more arbitrary criteria or just a vague feeling of it, if someone’s primarily playing legend and regularly wins their runs, they’re capable.
1 Like
So if i’m an ib and i play with my friend who is a god shade and i just block push 24/7 and i keep winning then i am legend able?
These are the cutest. A puppy that with blind trust follows you and has a look you can’t say no to.
In all seriousness, now reading this whole thread from the beginning, it’s just going in weird circles and nobody’s opinion is not changing.
I can throw mine in the mix too. I think Legend end events are overtuned if you compare them to their Cata counterparts and keep in mind the avg players on each difficulty. There are plenty of QPs that are a breeze until the end event where your team is caught pants down and monks end the whole thing. On Cata it’s more consistent in that the events are not such high spikes in difficulty, which imo is how it should be. More difficult is fine, but a sudden spike that overwhelms you after 20 minutes in to the mission, and given it’s pretty much unheard of that a QP would say “ok let’s try that again, but this time x y or z”, makes me think on Legend they are not in a good place.
What comes to bots and Legend-able, you can manage Legend by doing pretty much nothing though you need to have some understanding of how the bots play to make that happen. They can handle most situations just fine if allowed to and not put into a situation where they get surrounded easily. But at that point I am sure you already understand the mechanics decently enough to be “Legend-able”.
Interesting.
After I saw someone’s reply here,I want to watch his game stream in Fort and Convocation.
With rules,yes：
1.Legend public match,no friends,meet 3 strangers.
2.no glitch position.
3.no career recombination,dont force your teammates to change their careers or their minds.
4.dont command your teammates how to survive,because maybe they dont wanna listen to you.
5.carry 5 books.
*.you can use microphone,but if you dont,I think it will be much greater,just imagine your microphone is broken,ok？
Let’s see he should or shouldnt be in legend.Very fun isnt it? 
Please, stop with the emojis, before someone shoots themselves.
Sorry to trouble you.
I left one emoji,hope you like it.
tenk you men tenk you tenk you
I think it goes without saying that if you’re just getting carried by someone that you aren’t beating the runs yourself. To use another game as an example, someone with a 50% winrate in a rank in overwatch is absolutely capable of staying in that rank (even if people throw tantrums about them anyway). Someone who’s only got a 50% winrate because a mate’s boosting them isn’t in the same situation.
Though if you’re able to get away with that same godbreaker strat in pubs I’d say you are legend able, even if maybe not the most useful of possible players.
The problem is that it’s hard to know who gets carried and who doesn’t. And you are plenty capable of getting away with that if your team doesn’t suck, even if you are a godbreaker some situations are much harder to clutch as an ib, depending on loadout and situation. My point being that it’s hard to define.
I can see what you’re saying, but I don’t think it needs to be more complex than just “can regularly beat pubs or runs with bots”. There’s always exceptions, but I think it works fine.
This whole thread reads like people just not wanting any challenge what so ever. My idiotic opinion is that Events throwing Elite, Berserk, and Shield mobs at you is a generally good move to get people to take a sniff of cata in their nose.
Once upon a time people were rambling about the big difficulty leap between champ and Legend. That there is nothing in champ that prepares you for the next difficulty. Those events we got now either make you adapt and learn, or break your neck. They are the perfect proving ground. If you think you are doing well at them, you might aswell gather your courage and try cata.
The only problem with that is that it seems like Legend player only plays for loot and every second they spend not getting a vault is the worst sh_t they ever lived through. Now ofcourse those might shout: “I STILL NEED REDS!”, at me, but those should keep in mind that there is mainly talk about Fort and Convo event being really hard. Thats two maps out of twentyone. I think we can afford two harder maps, especially since both events require only positioning, shoving and killing specials.
hahaha,look at this.best joke today form a CATA player.
I play CATA too.And I finally finished Weave 1-120 with my friends last month.
I feel really shame for you.
I mean yeah, that’s a big part of why legend is played lol. People who are used to legend and want a challenge play cata (or modded, depending on the person), and people who are still getting loot or just want to grind for a red play legend.
Clutching events is fun sometimes, but it’s a pain when you’re just looking to do some standard legend runs, particularly when the RNG can be so ridiculous in terms of giving you the loot you need. Adding more RNG by having some maps just being arbitrarily harder sounds like a bad idea in my books.
People would probably complain less if you didn’t have players with hundreds and hundreds of hours (if not more) still missing a bunch of loot.
That’s even just ignoring the perspective of someone who’s new to legend and is just going to get absolutely stomped by those maps, harder than people usually do when they make the change from champ.
If people want to get used to cata they should just play cata, trying to force it on people is just going to cause frustration and honestly I don’t think it’ll help much at all.
1 Like
Or people just avoid playing them. When I play alone I tend to go to games via the browser and certainly am not joining some specific maps for various reasons, one being high risk of host quitting / disbanding after Convo / Fort wipe. If not that, then obviously you either learn or don’t learn, there are very little options as you can’t choose the difficulty per map section.
I play Legend for the enjoyment of it when it’s not a full premade team, and even then I enjoy Legend to spend very relaxing time with friends. Cata is not as relaxing and Champ is way too easy. For me Legend is just right for the most parts, not too easy that it’s boring (random lobby or a team not playing seriously at all. Obviously at this point it is too easy with a good player and two bots), and not too punishing even when **** hits the fan. Casual is the right word I guess.
I don’t mind loot, but it’s not the reason why I spend time on Legend. Hearing from people I have bumped into on random games it seems even newer ones with little to no reds don’t care that much, but is a big positive to get any kind of a vault. Can’t remember when someone got salty because someone lost a grim.
But they are not harder maps, just the end event is. Equal on the difficulty compared to almost any other mission, except when it spikes hard at the end. If the whole mission were like that I’d probably have a better feeling about it. Then the coming wipe would happen sooner rather than after 20min and wouldn’t be a similar bummer if the goal is to finish successfully and/or get loot. In that way it would also work more toward your vision of missions that prepare you for the next difficulty - now it’s almost the opposite as people are not prepared in any way and just get frustrated.
Which is what you do on any mission at any point to varying degrees…
Fort & Convo don’t seem to me be that much about positioning when you compare to for example regular Cata gameplay. I feel on Cata it is much much more important to keep positioning well in regards to many things, but on Legend Convo end event it’s mostly to know that dropping down is a good idea and don’t get too separated for too long (losing line of sight is fine for a while, but on Cata that can punish a lot quicker, on regular missions again) and to pay extra attention to specials and to drop down to handle one if needed, alone usually. On random team Legend Fort I’ve yet to see any meaningfully good positioning other than keeping to a group. I don’t see much importance in positioning relative to enemies, they can be handled almost anywhere if the group sticks together. Best if someone shoots the first Monk wave from the cannon, can turn the whole event to a win by just doing that.
While I see your point in having missions to prepare for other difficulties I can’t agree that these end events work as that. It is just completely different.
Like said previously, a mission wide harder difficulty is ok (which it is on every one when you jump up to the next diff), but having it spike so hard and sudden is not fun / helpful. I don’t know how these two are on Champ, but on Cata the spike is mild and the harder difficulty level is spread on the whole mission. At some point Righteous Stand was a ridiculous spike on Cata and not many liked it at all. That style is not consistent with the rest of the game, but you could argue that it doesn’t need to be / not intended to be. No idea what the devs spend the most time when tuning events, but it looks like Cata is more balanced in this sense than Legend.
1 Like