Maybe it’s just that I’m total braced agri simp but I love that gun.
1 Like
Fair
1 Like
But could you do it with only the dog? c:
(Probably yea)
1 Like
Maybe some people said that, but you can’t act like every casual player is saying that. Just like this forums is a minority of the more dedicated players, so is Reddit or Discord a minority, of more casual players or not, doesn’t matter.
Where do you find these masses of people asking for that? Most casual players you meet ingame will stick to lower difficulties, joke around and do light roleplay of their class. They don’t even care about balance that much, maybe Duelling Sword worked well for them or they heard it will make the game easier and started using it.
Portraying casual players as people who want to ruin the game is as legit as claiming there’s a elitist clique out there bent on driving any casual player off the game so Fatshark caters only to them. Both are ridiculous and I feel all this discussion about casuals or elitist a pointless waste of time. We shouldn’t let our biases turn a balance discussion into a digital family squabble.
1 Like
Sorry mate, but this is simply as naive as it is noble.
More power to your hope but the numbers and review bombs aren’t on your side.
And let’s not get into fallacy bickering with the “every casual” claims. No one is saying this. We’re attempting to combat the loud minority that FS has a history of listening to.
There is a noticeable, undeniable uptick in players pushing into difficulties they don’t deserve to be in skill-wise with Arbites. And they come here, or reddit, or discord to defend it and scream “never nerf, it’s PvE.” There is a quantifiable number of players review bombing the game over proposed weapon balancing for DS and PG.
That’s where these masses of people are. The only places the community has to give feedback.
With genius suggestions like “buff everything then buff enemies’ amount/health/mechanics.”
Have there been mass review bombs by players cuz the game is too easy? Or are we here trying to persuade FS to save the game from death’s door? By all means, make me eat crow on that.
Very correct. End of the day, we’re at their whim. Best we can do is try to be the louder voice they listen to. Squeaky wheel gets the grease.
But I’m resigned to the direction they seem to be going. Doesn’t mean I’m going to go gentle into that good night.
8 Likes
The biggest review bomb I can find was 2 years ago, and I entirely disagree with it, but recently the worst it’s ever been was around June, I assume that’s when the proposed changes to Duelling Sword and Plasma Rifles changes were leaked, and it’s still 50/50 on that day. Fatshark should not cave to this because these reviews will stabilize once the game’s past the hurdle and onto better times.
And some people here, while I DO agree with their proposed changes and overall opinions about how difficulty and balance are going, they’re expressing these opinions in a rather condescending way. There’s better way to do it than some of the claims I’ve seen around this forum and even from YouTubers that say “how is this any fun”.
It’s better to approach this productively and realistically. Some people will throw a fit, it has to happen and it’s Fatshark’s responsibility to make it happen for the future of the game. One valid point people who don’t want nerfs have is Fatshark does tend to overstep with their nerfs. They still need to happen but not so significant all at once.
Game needs more common balancing small updates, just throw it out there and see how it goes. Fatshark just waits until the issues festers, people get used to it and then suddenly they decide to change it. Reasonable people like Arbites and new Ogryn because the talent trees feel really good, it’s fun to pick. Compared to going to other classes where you have fun picking half of the tree then scoff at having to pick the other half that’s just boring filler.
I do agree about Arbites, 4 dogs in squad is too much for the AI to deal with. It will be like this for now while the class is still fresh, but I am already seeing plenty of people going back to the other classes. Maybe Arbites allows players to do better if they’re less skilled than say a Psyker, it’s fine to have a more comfortable class though and I doubt players suddenly go from Havoc 20 to 40 just by changing to Arbites, it’s still an effort for your average player.
If Fatshark manages to make the other 3 classes just as fun to build around with, I bet you there will be more diversity in missions. Then they can adjust difficulty properly, not these clown car spawns, and the game should go back to a healthy team effort.
2 Likes
Sincerely not trying to be an A.S.S. but you’re not saying or trying anything here that hasn’t been already.
I think maybe you’ve missed how these discussions tend to start on the pro-nerf side with attempts at reasonable changes and the “never nerfs” come in and ad-hominem and ignore all the attempts people make at keeping it rational, reasonable, and civil like you desire. Feel free to scroll back up if you haven’t already.
Review bomb sizes are relative, of course. That took the game from mostly positive, after a loooong climb mind you, right back to mixed. Over something that didn’t even happen. Sound like voices they’re going to ignore? Sure hope so, but I’ll not hold my breath.
Yeah, we know. We’re begging for it. They say they’re going to. Then they go on vacation.
Show me a pro-nerfer who hates the tree. I’ll wait.
6 Likes
Untrue.
Pro-nerf people start with a sensationalist post exageration of a Class/Ability/Weapon. Another pro-nerf escalates those exagerations further in the replies, some “anti-nerf” comes in and calls on the sensationalism, the anti-nerf person gets ganged on and called names, it turns into a personal insult throwing discussion.
Not saying anti-nerf people haven’t been dishonest or had insane out of touch takes in the past, but portraying themselves as the “Holders Of THE RIGHT OPINION TM” is mostly a pro-nerf crowd signature move.
2 Likes
7 Likes
Is it exaggerated to say that the arbites kill-mutt can duo aurics?
5 Likes
I’ve seen the exact same behaviours from from pro-perf and anti-nerf sides, neither side is free of that. You made this comment earlier "With genius suggestions like buff everything then buff enemies’ amount/health/mechanics.”, does this sound like reasonable discussion or condescending? It’s condescending because you aren’t even considering the idea.
And to elaborate what I mean about the tree. Vermintide 2 had smaller choices that are easier to keep in check (not saying the balance there was always perfect, but just easier to keep in check). Here, since we’re going with this new talent tree model, no matter what you do you will have a multitude of choices that empower the character, sometimes in synergies.
It’s inevitable that some of them will interact in a way that’s overpowered. But at the same time, streamlining the tree makes it more fun. Only two choices here are to keep the trees bloated, more boring but keep our power in check. Or you streamline them, make them more fun and meaningful but also make us more powerful.
It seems that Fatshark’s choice will be to go with more fun streamlined trees, that is currently posing some problems for the balance. In this case I really do not see how to balance this in a healthy way, with no enemy spam, than to empower the enemies preferably with more archetypes that reward mechanical skill. Expand enemy movesets, add more dynamic enemies, make them individually more threatening but also as a group.
I want the same things as you do, a game that makes people cooperate and act like a team, that’s fun. But maybe there’s a better way for Fatshark to do this and please both sides.
2 Likes
I can see now that you’re a hopeless romantic. I admire that, sincerely.
Yeah, I’m not “nice” by insinuating a dumb idea is dumb. But whatever.
I’ll just leave you with this:
Notice all the comment dissection and mud slinging in the thread, if you care too.
Then take a look at this comment, how it was lauded, how I praised it, and then how many interactions it got by the never nerf crowd:
Still all in on playing nice? Probably. Stay hopeful I guess. It’s enviable in a way.
4 Likes
It’s certainly a perspective lacking in realism. After all, you can’t have your cake and eat it too.
2 Likes
I can record a clip of me carrying Auric-Noobs using martyrdom zealot with shredder + Chorus, does that make Shredder pistol OP and broken?
Actually, you can do both simultaneously. That, in fact, is what usually happens.
Another possibility is one cut down the exact center, then consuming the cake.
In the larger sense, though, it’s trivially true, in that eventually all cake is lost. It is inevitable. Whether or not you eat a cake will prevent neither the cake’s decay nor your death. So you may as well eat the damn cake.
What I’m trying to say is that, in the philosophical sense, all of you get on my nerves.
3 Likes
You are more than a summoned NPC companion.
3 Likes
Ugh, fiiine. You can’t enjoy both of two desirable but mutually exclusive alternatives. Better?
4 Likes
Actually thanks to quantum mechanics and some manipulation of the space time continuum you can.
4 Likes
Acceptable.
3 Likes