Bad example, from bad logic.
following your logic Kerillian’s weapon wiould be beffed too and everyone will be happy. Asides from moaners like yourself that will find out that one weapon is by 1% better than others and it will deprive them from sleep.
also Kruber’s halberd was always OP as much as i remember. Tho you had to do toight combos to unleash it’s power.
The funniest thing to happen is when knowing you are on a team that is so good that the AI Director throws a tantrum on a standard Damnation mission, then ramps it up to Auric Maelstrom, and then I get cornered by a gauntlet of Maulers, Bulwarks and Crushers lmao
I’d say this herd behavior with echo chambers is the real problem.
Simple example^ Everyone was moaning how OP was power sword on release(It was a good weapon but not OP by any means). What happened? Anti-fun brigade and jealous zealots(Who was mad that any other class is capable of fighting in melee) whines about it till it was nerfed. Amount of powered strikes was reduced from 2 to 1. It was nerfed. Now power cycler is mandatory and… everyone says how power sword needs a rework, because even constantly powered psword would be like B+ tier weapon.
What changed? Nothing. Just more people have played the game and discovered mobility issues.
Then flame damage nerf happened(Tho nobody whines about how OP flamer was, while it was capable of deleting chunks of horde with single left click). People moaned how bad it is(Because it gutted flamers, flame staffs and infernus blessings). What happened then?
Flame damage was made viable again. And now people moan about how broken it is.
And same with plasma, not OP but any means. Was just barely validated with cleave, because it was trash on release. It needs slight readjustment with damage buffs and cleave nerfs. Now here we have mad crowd that want it to be like infantry lasgun, but worse(Yay, go back to mk12 lasgun being the most used vet weapon).
People aren’t really interested inbalance or fun in the game. They want to be mad, finding one sarficial goat after another, no matter how suitable this goat is.
This, this so very, very much.
I remember doing Havoc when it came out, I jumped what difficulty levels I could, then did a couple 40’s before eventually getting a win. Each one was a nail biter, and the one I finally won the team was in lock step, everyone did what they could, the Veteran was getting every ammo drop and still barely keeping up with the enemies he needed to deal with. I on my Zealot had to ’ clutch up’ a time or two, reviving half the team from the pylons on multiple occasions with chorus after desperately getting one team member up so they could get the rest while I stunned. We got through by the skin of our teeth with a vet, a psyker, and two zealots, it was exhilarating, and while I couldn’t say I wanted to do that anxiety inducing of a fight until next weeks rotation, I knew said next weeks run would be that much fun and I was excited for when I had the energy for it again (and am happy I did all my Havoc runs at 40 in the first iteration of Havoc, because holy heck *points at the rest of my ‘essay’).
I did a Havoc 38 yesterday with 4 arbites and we walked through the mission with one down/death, 3 missions later (they where going for True Survivor and I figured I might as well help) we got through without anyone dropping below half health. No conservation of ammo, no needing a ‘specific team comp’, just tripping over everything, everyone gets one hit of the ammo crate (or sometimes one person gets 2 since another wasn’t using it as much), and nobody died despite similar stakes and level of enemy spam.
I would like someone to tell me why our team, being this heavily separated, should be at these health levels after dealing with a captain, a hexbound deamonhost, and a gunner/elite wave on top of that (the two other team mates not shown are behind me/in front of the little room area pushing forward/keeping the enemies completely at bay by themselves):
There was a point shortly after this Kenndrik here was the target of a successful summon of a Deamon Host (since the other guys where pushed so far up we couldn’t get to it), he’s fine though, don’t worry about him, just slowly walking backward with his shield, he’s fine:
And the clips just do not stop.
I unfortunately didn’t get one during the first run of the night where I was completely separated from the team, stuck in a wave, Captain hammering me left right and center, and I just activated Castigator stance, stuffed a Concentration Stim into my bones, and walked back to my team in two Combat Ability casts. While not the same, this clip is similar in nature:
My man’s Judge-Mortis gets completely cut off, separated by a beast of Nurgle and a whole host of ragers and bulwarks, a death sentence for most other classes, with an Ogryn likely getting trappered or dogged because he got pulled out of coherency.
Na, he’s fine, a lil health loss and some corruption, doesn’t really matter to much.
I truly think high havoc is just Auric now at this point, granted one has to bring Ogryn/Arbite OR the best builds possible on the other classes, but like, come on. Balance is generated via a character having to pick between having damage OR surviviability, but we are rapidly approaching the point where everyone gets both. Veteran used to be ‘one of the more broken classes’ at the point where shout was released and all their talent nodes just gave them ludicrous amounts of stats and damage. Now they are literally the ‘base line’, and my friend group talks about how Veteran is like ‘the most balanced class’ of all of them, just because their survivability is conditional and it’s balanced by their incredible levels of damage output (Psyker woudl be a close second but Inferno + Perilous Combustion Exists so haahaha), said output just being the norm now.
This game is rapidly approaching the point of being ‘solved’ even more heavily than the ‘golden toughness days’. Now you don’t even need a source of it, just walk in with 4 Arbite’s and you get True Survivor/Havoc Forged for free with little recourse. I was anxious when starting the night wondering what might come at us given the stories I’ve heard about the ‘new havoc 2.0’. By the end of the night I was going off on my own scrounging for ammo scraps because ‘why not? the wave can’t kill me anyway’, and just playing it like Auric Mortis Trial.
I know I complained about not having build variety in high havoc, but this is not the way I wanted it solved. I wanted more weapons to be able to do comparable damage and maybe a talent or two giving a bit more DR/Emperors Fading light toughness and health debuff to get removed along with the ammo reduction. But this? Making everyone so overstated to the warp and back that everything below havoc 40 is a cake walk? No, stop, we’ve all said it before and we will continue to say it.
HAVOC SHOULD NOT BE THE BENCH MARK FOR BALANCE!
It should be the place people excel and do high ranks of because they are good and using the best, with MID TIER HAVOC (20-30) maybe being considered a bench mark. If you balance around Havoc 40, you kill the game, and that’s already happening. Please, FS, stooppppp. I don’t want this game to be another Destiny 2, that I shelve because it’s functionally unplayable as you just throw VFX in front of you and ignore all the game mechanics because you just auto win for pressing buttons. please, there’s still time, I beg of you there’s still timmmme.
but maybe the power creep is a sophisticated scheme to finally introduce plague marine and great unclean ones as horde enemies 
imagine a corridor full of just one green fat belly, rest of the unclean is the next castle, mario 
one could argue even havoc isnt the mark for how botched it is now 
onward varlets, sky’s the limit
Uh yeah, thanks for the insight papa-sweatlord tanner
Yeah this, average player still struggle in auric I love the contrast between the crying on forum and solo q with randoms… sure arbites need some nerfs don’t worry it’s coming, go touch grass
power sword is/was blatantly op.
He continued to say that he prefers buffs over nerfs because everything in VT2 is viable. Me saying “why do you think that is?” didn’t convince him either. So we agreed to disagree
No one cares if a weapon is 1% better than others. We care when something is so far and above everything else that it kills the fun for players who aren’t also using the same thing. By your logic, being able to 1-shot every enemy in the game would be fun because you’d feel OP in this non-competetive game. Challenge? Bah! Who needs it. Players just want to feel OP right?
the current powersword requires a specific mandatory blessing to even work, it was busted on release but at this point , dont think so.
specially when the arbites shockmaul exist
Who the hell is out here destroying havoc 40 but theyre actually malice players? I cant even beat a havoc 25 with randoms without someone rage quitting or everyone dying the moment two bosses spawn in. Ive seen an influx of noobs in auric missions but thats always a thing and bound to happen after the update. If havoc 40
Is that easy I guess I need to spam havoc 40’s till someone lets me in cuz i refuse to believe malice noobs with 30 hours played are pubbing havoc all the way up to 40 but my teammates are horrible and we lose 90% of our havoc games.
Sticking with your team in havoc is completely different from regular games. In havoc the moment a team splits between a mixed horde and two bosses the runs over. In regular missions it is often within your best interest to get away from your teammates and im often off on my own opening crates or not standing in that bubble theyre about to let a pox burster into.
you don’t see how profoundly entitled this comment is?
you’re blaming other peoples egos, and in the same breath claiming ownership of the entire game space, regardless of your desire to engage with it.
You are quite literally trying to tell people how they should play. Do you not see your complete lack of self-awareness here?
Tell me you’re a veteran main without telling me you’re a veteran main—always crying to nerf other classes but staying quiet about the OP stuff in your own class. Typical.
there are a couple of Arbites builds that can literally just w key their way to victory, it’s super dull and falls apart if anything breaks their mouse 1 rhythm.
Just needs toning down a little
What is it with all of these unsubstantiated ad hominems? Y’all could do to at least READ what I’m complaining about before you start swinging…
No, wrong
Base game has just become too easy
idgaf about validation, i wear cyber falcon title and beta helmet for lulz
Hello, Vet main here
Please nerf plasma gun and dueling sword - both weapons are op with a too little skill floor
Recon Lasgun is also a contender, but here I’m of the opinion that other guns should be buffed to Recon Lasguns level (Infantry Lasguns and Infantry Autoguns, all other guns are legit fine)
And yes, please add +33% cooldown to golden toughness modifier on shout like with the revive thingy
And yes, add an internal cooldown of lets say 10 seconds to demolition team
Those are the two broken vet abilities - and they are broken because they are spammable (more than they should be)
regarding buffs
get rid of first row of tax nodes on vet tree, buff other operative modifier nodes A LITTLE
(+7.5% ranged damage instead of +5% for example)
there, fixed it; vet doesnt need more
(ARGUABLY +25% ammo and +25% toughness COULD be placed higher up in his tree)
can you please go your way now again so that we can continue speaking about the whole arbites / ogryn kit / weapons which make what’s op about vet look like literally nothing in comparison ? Heck we don’t even talk about crit spam piety zealot anymore because poor fella has become mundane in comparison.
yes the plsama gun is OP and what are you an arbites main that doesnt want their precious new class to get a nerf