I wouldn’t do orange to red, but give more option to spend scrap and orange dust for sure, like rolling your wanted stuff but with x5 cost and 50 orange dust or something like that. With how few orange dust you use at all its gonna hoard (same like jewel/weapon/scrap parts).
Or just craft random deeds from orange dust
Faster way of obtaining red would make that game way faster to have no goal to do.
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What about converting orange to blue and green…?
P.S. I have impression, that some people playing 1-2 character from 15. In this case, yes you will not need much of dust, red items, e.t.c.
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What do you mean “from 15” ?
And I really dont have that much hours into game ppl already said that they have 2 times more. Rolling weapon to prefereds stats its around 60 dust and 10-15 oranges or less. What do I have to do with all that scrap ?
Subclasses. Some sublcasses need quite specific breakpoints to reach.
There’s no such thing as easy or difficult when it comes to rolling the dice.
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…but introducing a way to reliably craft them does make it so there is such a thing.
Now it’s just a matter of whether or not it’s easy, or difficult, to attain the things you need in order to craft them.
And I’m in favor of it being hard to get them, because they’re still supposed to be the best loot you can find.
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Crafted reds should drop skins or there should be the dupe lock. But orange into red might devalue veteran items
You know, if they just kept the Contract Board thingy from Vermintide 1 the ridiculous random loot box nonsense and getting the items you actually cared about wouldn’t be an issue.
But it’s current year and we have to have loot boxes. Players love loot boxes and random rewards.
Said literally no gamer ever. I feel bad for the new generation. They’re going to grow up with these game progression systems and think they’re normal. God, even CoD4 had a good progression system. Level up, weapon unlocks, get kills with said weapon, which in turn unlocks things. Easy and simple.
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Nope, not insane at all, long time players have shittons of dust just laying around so with such a rate in place we´d easily deck out all 4 characters with full red gear in a heartbeat with 0 effort.
I still have about 100 chests of both legend Champion and Emperor class left that i havent bothered to open.
aaaand the picture got odd but clicking on it and viewing it on imgur shows what i mean.
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I personally own most of the reds already, got around 40 red dusts just laying around from random trinket drops and over 3k yellow dust so where i stand from i just find it highly pointless to add yet a other way to grab easy reds.
The 50/1 ratio sounds perfectly fine to me not to mention the orange dust is the least used one when it comes to rolling stuff (at least for me it is).
@Frostysir, @hgjw
great point, you two, I don’t need it, so others don’t need it too.
It is used in conversion to blue. And if you don’t have reds, you will be rolling orange, and thus you will spend substantially more dust to reach acceptable properties.
Great at no point did i say “Because i got 5 million dusts others should also have have 5 million dust too”
Seriously ? I started this game when stuff like red drops were just a myth for most people and things like dust conversions were just dreams. I’ve still never had such issues in terms of item rolling.
Again all of this is from my pov but i’m still curious how anyone who has any decent hours in this game is suddenly running out of green/blue dust nowadays to have to turn yellow into those.
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Testing different combinations. A lot.
Which the math can nowadays be found in spreadsheets, reddit or heck even in this forum. Sure as i said i’m not going to pretend to know how you spend your dusts but for me personally i could currently roll about 100 perfectly rolled items by just using my blues/greens alone so there is that.
From my pov 10/1 in terms of reds seems insane and too easy.
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Thats not the point though.
The problem is that it would make things too easy for anyone who´s been playing for a while, think about it.
As long as you stack some 50 orange dust you have enough for 5 red which becomes an item of your choice instantly.
500 dust? 50 red dust or 10 red items of choice.
And 500 is a number that the majority of decently long time legend players can easily bring out.
So the rate has to be higher, much higher than 10 to 1, which 50 to 1 is.
Orange dust converted to red turned to items.
500/50 =10 =2 items.
Now it might seem expensive however with the current system RNG is a huge factor, you can easily get 10 useless or even duplicate reds in a row from the chests, it takes 50 such “wasted” reds to produce 10 reds of choice.
And to get 50 reds? Its 220+ legend emperor chests with a rate of 22% chance.
Now your idea seems fine if one assumes that every orange item turned to dust gives 1 dust, however the items can and often give more than 1.
I broke 3 items at a time 3 times and i got 5 orange dust per time, so i´ll assume the breakdown of 3 items have the yield of 3 to 6 and the middleground being 4.5.
With your system it would then only take about 11 legend chests of any quality to get a red item given that they all give orange stuff, for 10 red items of choice you´d want 110 legend chests.
So your idea would directly cut the amount of chests down by half, which is a rather major jump wouldnt you agree?
Furthermore to those long timers with 1000+ orange essence this kind of change would kinda be like a slap in the face, why would they have to grind so badly for chests to get a RNG chance at getting the item they want then suddenly a newbie friendly change comes along and makes all that pointless?
The bad luck protection from getting 5 bad reds is already good enough, the droprate is also already pretty good, 1 in 5 legend emperors have a red generally so the system is generous as long as you actually just play.
It takes effort sure but it yields in the end.
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Things that are problematic for some aren’t so for others, but that goes both ways. In this case the other way is the players who have accumulated lots of materials already, and could thus produce several, even dozens of Veteran items immediately. They need to be taken into account if the kind of conversion you suggest is done.
Your request isn’t unique, by the way. There was a thread of decent length about exactly the same issue about a month ago. As I made long post about my thinking, and a few more messages as clarifications and further thoughts, I won’t bother retyping (or even copypasting) everything but instead just give you a link.
As a TL;DR though, the problem isn’t really in the items but in the annoying crafting system (which is the only thing giving any real worth to the Veteran items in the first place). Make that better, and/or give an additional way to work towards chosen red weapons, and the problem likely goes away.
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Exactly this and you put it way better into words than i could.
I personally do not have problems of alternative means of getting reds or heck even the red skins but the challenge and ease needs to be properly balanced.
Aaaarghh. Where have you’ve been? I made similar calculations as @swpz.
And his topic even more convincing IMO, especially this:
(is it possible to quote from other topics?)
Regardless of conversion ratio, we need reliable source of items with top properties in game where breakpoints have significant impact on gameplay.
I kind of disagree with that too. Well, the impact of the Veteran items and maximum rolls, to be more precise. Nearly all of the breakpoints can be reached reasonably through Exotic (orange) items too; I know of only one or two that actually need stacked, maximised Properties to reach (and they play on the way the actual percentages stack, so the end result is slightly higher than simple numbers indicate). I also think they aren’t necessary except maybe for very few builds and weapons. Yes, many things feel nicer and smoother when certain breakpoints are reached, but they’re never (or nearly so) necessary, or even impact gameplay hugely.
As I said, the culprit here is the annoying and tiresome crafting system that forces a lot of RNG on us and doesn’t mitigate it in any way. The scarcity of the red items, and the perceived need for them, is a symptom only.
I’d be all for an improved crafting system, or a (separate) way to slowly work towards reds you want, but I think allowing us to craft Bright Dust would only serve to reduce the value of both Exotic and Veteran items.
1 Like