Orange dust to Red

Add this option please. I played ~800 hours, at least 90% from it is on legend, and I still have no all red weapons. Moreover, in most cases you need at least 2 red weapons of the same type, one for using, and another for testing builds. Somethimes even 3. And there is players that not playing on legend at all. Yes, for them breakpoints is not so necessary, but still.
Maybe this conversion will be even 10/1 but I think we really need it.

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10/1 sounds a bit too easy, I’d suggest upwards of 50/1.

They’re still supposed to be the rarest equipment you can possibly get, y’know.

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@LordRhinark, 50/1?
this is insane, you still need orange dust for rolling traits and conversion to blue dust.

Yes, but like I said, red equipment should still be incredibly hard to get.

Adding a way to craft them already devalues their worth by itself, as you no longer have to rely on random chance to get them, but now have a reliable way to obtain them.

It should still instill a feeling of accomplishment to get a red weapon in my opinion.

Edit: I’m unsure if I’m mixing things together here.

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Conversion 10/1 means, you need 50 orange dust to upgrade orange weapon to red.
So you need at least 25 orange items => at least 9 games to won on legend? (defenitely more, because you will receive some blues too). It is hard to calculate properly because amount of dust you receiving from dismantling items is random 1-2 (maybe).

Yeah I knew I was saying something completely off. I forgot you need 5 Red dust to upgrade an Orange item.

But it would lead to the same result in the end I think. Whether it’s 10/1 conversion for 5 Red dust or 50/1 for 1 Red dust should take around the same amount of work.

Regardless, you’re probably right. 10/1 conversion sounds much more fair than my suggestion, at least as long as it takes 5 Red dust to upgrade an item.

50 orange to 1 red dust is fair. For example, my wife normally plays champion unless I’m with her. She only has around 20 red weapons, but well over 2000 orange dust. She’d be able to craft a lot. Although I’m pretty much against it. If you want reds, play legend. Otherwise, no. There’s still a really rare chance to get them in commendation chests, I think it’s 1 red in every 100 or something. And low chance for Champ, 4% chance on Emp Champ vault.

As for not having all reds after 800 hours. I’m on 1300 hours and I’m missing 1 red. So yea, they’re not supposed to be super easier to get. Still tho, at 800 hours you should of got a ton of other reds you melted down. I was sitting on 50 something red dust before I crafted a bunch for testing builds. And I’m back up to 50 dust again after 2 weeks of playing.

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She could craft 8 red weapons for 2000 orange dust… I don’t think that’s an ok trade.

I don’t think reds need to be scarce, the light sabers sure but not the reds themselves.

Now all comes back to the garbage crafting argument of course but even then this game in very greedy with it’s rewards in general.

Don’t recall the exact loot rate, but wasn’t it around 20% for emperor legend, and 12% for general legend ?
I mean I only started legend recently, and I got some reds without too much problems, as long as we pick tomes and grim.

Ah, I assumed they would be getting the skins as well. That’s fair then, get reds but no glow skins.

And yea, 20-24% for legend Emp. I can post the data in the min, hold on.

So this is Johns data from 3000 vaults opened,

Rates below,

Peasants and commoners vaults had misleading information or not enough of them to get accurate information.

Merch vault:
680 chests
60 reds
8.8% chance of a red

Solider vault:
679 chests
84 reds
12.4% chance of a red

General vault:
920 chests
160 reds
17.4% chance of a red

Emperor vault:
449 chests
99 reds
22% chance of a red

Now for my data. I only kept track of Emp Vaults as I don’t get enough of the lower ones, Hyper twitch means like 10+ dice per game, even if we lose a grim, you still get an Emp. I open the lower ones as soon as I get them and stock up on Emp ones to open at once. I got a 24% drop rate for Emp Vaults. So pretty close to Johns.

As for cosmetics, you get a hat every 63.11 chests on average and Red weapon every 113.6 chests on average.

There is also question of general/emperor ratio because of Ranald. Moreover let us remember, that game is not work, and even if you playing with your friends, maybe all of you even skilled enough, but you playing for fun and you choosing not perfect team composition, but characters you want to play, so perfect run is 50/50. If you playing with random players, the result will be even less stellar.

About that you seem to be right. Heres how 200h+ of mostly QP looks for me without opening anything. I consider myself fair in skill.
You can multiply that by four to get to the hours stated in the OP and then estimate how many reds you should have got from John’s data.
I came up with about 62 reds from the vaults only - probably another half of that from the commendation and the champ chests.

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I am against being able to craft reds from orange dust, purely because you can get enough red trinkets via dupes from Emperor’s Chest on Champion to be able to craft at least one or two for your favourite character and be able to step up to legend with max stats weapons ,albeit without the skins.

This will require some fairly consistent playtime though, and probably won’t be reached for a while if you’re a casual player.

This whole conversation brings up a different problem, but one that has already been discussed to death.

WHAT the ACTUAL F to do with all the materials. When craftable deeds arrives soon™ people are going to absolutely rinse the whole new system of the rewards purely by salvaging the living tits out of all of their stockpiled chests. -IF- there is some kind of new reward scheme then it will be completely moot as people have obscene amounts of stuff to use to get whatever they like as a craftable deed.

So… in counterplay to all of my own arguments in this post, anything that begins to burn through the heaps of materials thousands of players have stockpiled might be a good thing in that the rudimentary economy of Materials > Weapons /Rerolls is thoroughly broken at the moment, and will stay broken until there is a fundamental change to that economy.

We already agree that red skins are no indication of skill so giving people the option to craft the skins might be fine. Using dust and mats to craft illusions is my preferred method rather than making actual RED weapons - what we have in place has quite a good reward/effort ratio.

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You can craft anything to salvage it and to get dust from it. I am doing this all the time.

And I am thinking right the opposite. I am fine enough to wait until desired skin will fall out of the chest, but I can’t play with build properly if it is not complete, and it will not be complete without items with specific properties, so I am stuck with what I am already have. Why I should wait uncertain amount of time to get what I need?

What I mean is I have thousands of jewelery parts, scrap,dust of all kinds. Spending this to make weapons will not even put a dent in my numbers because I have so many chests just sat there ready to open. converting orange to red I’d have about 20 reds in the time it takes me to click the buttons to covert the stuff.

Top tier weapons for what amounts to a pile of junk.

Red Duplicates are what you need to salvage. Play Champion and always get an Emperor or move up to Legend. This is part of the challenge/reward to earn the builds you want to try.

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We play what ever we want, and of course we play for fun. But we all have around 1200+ hours. So our idea of fun, is hyper twitch with the hardest deeds. Fighting 2-4 bosses at the same time with a horde is more of a challenge and what I consider to be fun. But yea, not for everyone. Still, with boss maps, you can get like 4-7 dice on normal Legend. Full book run with 4 dice is a guaranteed Emp Vault without Ranald.

If you’re good and on a character like Zealot, you can carry the entire run. Don’t even need your team. If you’re only halfway decent, as long as theirs one other halfway decent player, you can normally carry the other two.

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More like 1-5 IMHO.

This will not prevent over players from loosing grim.

huh? Skittergate you are guaranteed 1 dice from Gate keeper, 1 from big rat ladys mount and 3 from her. That’s 5, plus the normal 1-2 bosses. Even without them, that’s 5. On into the nest and war camp, it’s 3 dice if you don’t get any monsters. But not getting at least 1 monster on those maps is pretty rare. Then ofc, you have the 2 dice in chest or from a loot rat. Which again, you should know where all the chests are in a map after 800 hours.

Yea, still though. With 2 decent players, that’s 2 grims and 2 tomes. You can at least almost get a Generals Vault each game. That’s a 18% chance at a red each game. It ain’t much, but it’s an honest days work.

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I mean, if you not playing boss map. I should mentioned it. Edit: more like 2 on the average.

Well, it is not preventing some Bounty Hunter without curse resistance to pick up grim :expressionless:.

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