NEW Topic - CONTINUED discussion - Fatshark needs to LISTEN to customers

This part reminds me of the Hagbane. Was almost universally seen as terrible until some people eventually pointed out its value, and now it’s great.


If you can’t clear Legend now (it’s already a joke again after the stagger buff) then that simply means that you, just like MANY others, were getting heavily carried on Legend before and were never ready for it to begin with. Why is everyone so obsessed with throwing their playtime around like it’s some kind of an ultimate argument? It means nothing whatsoever. If you can’t clear Legend with 3600 hours in the game it only confirms what I’ve said.

Melee frontline, stagger and horde control were all already important before. They’re just more important now.
The result? Anyone who was half decent before still cruises through Legend just fine and their playstyle is nearly identical to the old - meanwhile people who were just a burden for their team before (because entitled to playing on a higher difficulty) now weigh 10x more.

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OMG… someone that can spell realize :D, but can you spell “lose”? Lol those two words are my pet peeves… How can gamers not spell “lose”.

Sounds very elitist - and in my opinion… inaccurate. Let me explain why.

Saying legend now (yes, after the stagger resistance nerf than was NEEDED) is the same as before would be incorrect. It isnt. If you play as much as I do, you would know that. I am assuming you do, so you should

I dont typically get carried, but I sure used to when I first moved from champion to legend. But this isnt the point to my response…

Its that legend isnt legend. If you say it is the same as it was pre 2.0 then either you dont know, or are just being ‘elitist’. Let me explain what elitist is…

I have a friend on my list who is an ‘elitist’. He is friendly enough, but I never play with him. He invites me to games, but I have no interest in playing with him. The reason is because he only wants to show you how good he is. He will talk about how great he is and when he needs help because he missed a dodge, or gets a lag spike, has nothing but excuses for how ‘badly’ he was playing. HE couldnt get ‘carried’ could he? Gaming experience does NOT equal arrogance. This is a TEAM game, and when you fail, you fail as a TEAM. ONE fool who thinks he can solo the map is all it takes to wipe a run. Difficulty aside, and pre 2.0. Rage quitters are all either elitists or noobs. There isnt much in the difference either imo

Btw, the ‘elitist’ I am talking about has 2300+ hours in the game. I have played with em, and he is a decent player. But WITH him on my team, its not a team of 4. Its more like a team of 3 with an extra rushing ahead to pad stats and pull a ‘j_sat’ on everyone. (EDIT: after reading this, I should clarify, I only mension j_sat for his play skill, not that he isnt a good team member. I have no idea - have never played with him) NOT the kind of team member I am looking for. So an elitist is one who thinks HE is the one who carries the team, and in my experience, its the other way around. Guess who has nothing but excuses when he falls flat on his face? Yep. You guessed it. The elitist.

But the elitist isnt interested in the GAME. He isnt interested in TEAMWORK. He is just waiting for the sweet scoreboard to come up and gloat about how high his numbers were

And its at those times when I take the time to enjoy myself. I like to point out damage taken. And usually, when all is said and done… he has the highest number there too lol

Anyway. You sound very elitist. My favorite thing to do is to call out those types. I hope I am wrong

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Elitist seems to be your favorite word but sadly you forgot to look up the actual definition first.

It’s you who’s apparently against playing on Champion because there’s something wrong with that in your head, not in mine. I see 5 difficulty levels for 5 different types of players. You just see the highest two because you’re too insecure and entitled. I mean you said it yourself, Champion is Legend. If you were having so much fun on Legend before then play Champion now. You literally solved your own problem already in the original post.

And whoever you see “rushing ahead” might simply just have an understanding (unlike you) of what pacing is and why it’s important here, especially on Cata where pacing is easily the most important thing for clearing it comfortably.

If you don’t understand the basics and struggle with why pushing is (always was) a crucial part of the combat after 3600 hours while others might have a full understanding of all these mechanics and concepts after 150 hours it doesn’t make the game bad, it doesn’t make others elitist… it simply makes YOU a bad player… and that’s okay.
Have you ever done any sport? I mean it’s not like everyone is always on the same skill level or like the amount of hours they put in directly translates to how good or bad they are… not even close. Videogames are the exact same thing, understanding of mechanics, decision making, muscle memory, that’s it.

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@Voidq I will just say it. You are rude. No charisma, or respect. And you offer nothing constructive to this discussion - your last response from me

EDIT: This thread may have run its course as I have a troll lol

I’ll check in on this later.

Keep posting on topic responses regarding your experiences with 2.0, the stagger to damage model, how you feel about it!

But please, for gods sake! Dont feed the TROLL!! @Voidq is what he goes by… lol

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And you are the prime example of internet arguemaster - whenever you run out of arguments, complain about how rude others are and how much it hurts.

This is constructive though, right? Just like everyone else can’t even point out what’s bad or give any logical reasoning whatsoever as to why it’s bad. Just scream BAD and add your playtime to feel better and act like you’re the authority on “difficulty” or something.
The sheer lack of anything of substance clearly tells me that you simply want the game to be easier, not better - just easier. But it’s hard to find arguments for that without feeling less worthy… or something, I guess. Because YOU think that YOU should be able to clear Legend comfortably. Screw others who actually like challenge, just call them elitist while it’s you who wants every difficulty and every game mode to cater just to YOU, right?

And of course the good old “Fatshark listen to us, EVERYONE hates this” and yet last time I checked it was like 43% negative WoM impressions in the community poll - that makes you the minority, in case you didn’t know.


I just joined 5 seperate games. All legend pubs. All fails. Fail was within the first few waves each time. So ignoring troll comments, I have a question…

What is your fail/success rate now post 2.0 on legend? I am looking for honesty, not a long self massage lol

Difficulty is worse than I am even giving credit for…

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Aren’t you being dishonest when saying 43% is minority of 3 choices there given with highest percentage to boot?


Not technically dishonest but intentionally misleading yes, seeing as it was 43% negative to 34% positive.


Dont feed the troll - he is hungry lol

Anyway, yeah, 5 fails on legend. They were pubs and honestly kinda new players, but still. Left last one alive on hagstalker using a glaive each time. Each time was a beastmen horde (tho one was slave rat horde with chaos spawn, so at least THAT was a hard situation) and honestly… difficulty is DEFINATELY MUCH higher, and may not be the problem here… maybe its the thing I dont wanna admit

Its just not as… fun to me

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He’s not troll per se, his views are something I don’t agree with and had interaction outside of the forum.

43% negative and as I’ve very clearly stated - talking about the people who are so outraged by the “new” combat. Many of them have already tried claiming around here that EVERYONE hated the combat and yet clearly 57% of the people who cared enough to vote were either happy with the update or not bothered by it at all = not unhappy or against it.

Not to mention that people in general are way more likely to be casting their vote or throwing a review out there when UNHAPPY so I myself am surprised the numbers are anywhere close to each other given by how unable to adapt people are and how just about any update in any game always gets flak because change = bad.

That vote was about initial impressions, not liking/dislike the combat however.

Stagger was at 59% dislikes.

Yes, there’ll always be people that blindly dislike or like a new update, but I’m seeing a lot of both here - people automatically hating and people defending it equally automatically. Change isn’t automatically bad, nor is it automatically good.

There’re also a lot of people who like or dislike it based on actual reasons.

iirc the BBB caused a bit of a stir at the time it came out too, but most people ended up deciding it was for the better in the long term. Even so, it was a lot less controversial than WoM has been.


The eternal tug-of-war of Karens (I made a suggestion, why didn’t you implement it?!) vs Elitists (Git gud, everyone needs to play my way to have fun).

I’m a very simple person. Post 2.0 I wasn’t having fun playing Legend. 2.0.4/2.0.5 I’m having fun again. Looking at the forums to get a pulse on why that might be is useful, and seeing changes to address those concerns without knee-jerk reactions is reasonable.

With the amount of customer protection available on Steam, I can only blame myself if I bought something without doing enough research on what I’m paying for.


And I can word that 66% didn’t like it care for changes, which is more than your 57%. Don’t think you have right to count ambivalent people into your side.


Yet they never give those, ever. They get offended instead because it’s just easier and all they can produce is “its just bad, dunno why, revert everything FS” - is that supposed to be constructive?

Melee stagger being extremely important was always a big part of why the game felt completely different if you had at least one good teammate you could push with and cover each other’s back.
So arguably, it was a good habit to have considering it made every encounter so much safer and easier to deal with for everyone around. Anyone who played anything above Legend before knows this. Wouldn’t a mechanic (stagger dmg) that, in theory, should push more people towards understanding this be a good thing? Strange tooltips aside.
Meanwhile you could also watch 3 bad players just blatantly wipe to a harmless Skaven horde because all they did was stack atk speed and crit and kept dodging backwards from enemies. It’s not the difficulty level’s fault that they never learned the basics but felt compelled to queue into Legend 24/7 and just ragequit after each death instead of learning anything from it.

[quote][quote=“Voidq, post:138, topic:35210, full:true”]
Yet they never give those, ever. [/quote]

You’ve already been confronted for dismissal of other people’s points.

Could you please stop trying to be right without being correct?

But of course, give us at least one or two logical points as to why the “new” combat is so much worse. Explain what is so fundamentally wrong with it and suggest a solution.
I hope asking for anything of substance isn’t too offensive but I’m not really sure at this point.

Hell you can straight up copy those from those other people’s posts because I must have missed those.
Unless of course you see “I hate most of the new changes” as a valid point or anything even remotely close to ‘constructive’.

I’ll do that tomorrow at best, have no interest disrupting my sleep schedule.