Make Disrupt Destiny More Like Warp Charges?

[AndiNagasaki]

• Yes, All 3 Changes would be Good…
• Yes, but only the Charge Degradation Change…
• Yes, but only the Charge Percent and Count Changes…
• Yes, but only the Range & Number of targets…
• No, i think the Ability is ok as is.

im liking the Psyker Keystone Ability Disrupt Destiny,
its kinda become my go to since Warp Charges now have built in Quicken which i dont care for.

theirs only a couple issues with it.
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for those who dont know what Disrupt Destiny does.

Disrupt Destiny

Every second, Enemies within 25m have a chance of being marked. killing a marked enemy replenished 10% toughness, Grants 20% movement speed for 2.5s, and adds a Precision Bonus for 15s.

Each Precision Bonus Grants +1% Damage, +2% Critical Damage, +2.5% Weakspot Damage. Precision Bonus Stacks 15 Times.
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First Issue - Charge Degradation!

much like warp charges used to be, when one expires you lose all charges,
making gathering them a chore and keeping them just as hard as Warp Charges used to be.

however unlike brain burst of old, where heads would glow when your Psyker was targeting them.
with Disrupt Destiny charges, other players get no such notification on which are marked targets.
leading to friendlies stealing charges, and Psykers losing full stacks and having to grind them again.

so much like Warp Charges were Fixed i think the same should be done.

Have Stacks degrade one at a time over time

when managing warp Charges, bleed stacks, or other stacks, its abit of a pain to see you have 4-5 stacks and have them all expire at the same time. i would suggest to have the stacks degrade 1 at a time, so if you have 4 stacks of warp they will degrade to 4 to 3 stacks after 25 seconds than from 3 to 2 stacks after another 25 seconds. i feel it will make the flow of battle better rather than losing it all in a single instance.

i would suggest to have the stacks degrade 1 at a time, so if you have 4 stacks of Destiny Charges they will degrade to 4 to 3 stacks after 15 seconds than from 3 to 2 stacks after another 15 seconds.
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Second Issue - Charges!

also to balance out these Destiny Charges i would also change the bonuses they give.
have Each Stack give +2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage.
with each Bonus Stacking upto 7 Times. so the values keep the same but its easier to maintain.

also Change the name from Precision Bonus to Peril Bonus or Destany Charges.
im sorry but the whole keystone feels like it belongs on the Vet not the Psyker.
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Thrid Issue - The Range!

to put it into perspective 25m in the Psykhanuim is.

yes that little blue glow in the middle of the screen is the marked target.

as above often ether i cant get to the target before losing my previous Disrupt Destiny charges.
or another ally kills the target and in so doing i also dont get my Disrupt Destiny charges.

as Suggested by @Vazumongr.
perhaps have several targets available, giving players more options on how to gain charges?
have Disrupt Destiny mark 2 targets(any non-Ogryn / Monstrosity), but only the max range of 20m.
this would insure players always have 2 targets in-between Melee and Gun range.

below is an image of the melee range of 10m.

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Disrupt Destiny(Suggested Changes)

Every second, 2 Enemies have a chance of being marked, within 20m(their will always be 2 active marks) killing a marked enemy replenished 10% toughness, Grants 20% movement speed for 2.5s, and adds a Precision Bonus for 15s.

Each Precision Bonus Grants +2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage. Precision Bonus Stacks 7 Times.

.

how these would work with other Disrupt Destiny Nodes on the tree?

Disrupt Destiny(Max Charge Build)

+2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage, max of 14 Charges 15sec.
+28% Damage, +56% Critical Damage, +70% Weakspot Damage, at max Charges for 15sec.
on killing a marked target +10% toughness,+20% movement speed for 2.5s

Disrupt Destiny(Max Duration Build)

+2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage, max of 7 Charges 30sec.
+14% Damage, +28% Critical Damage, +35% Weakspot Damage, at max Charges for 30sec.
on killing a marked target +10% toughness,+20% movement speed for 2.5s

Warp Charges(Toughness + Max Charges Build)

+4% Damage, max of 6 Charges 25sec.
+24% Damage, at max Charges for 25sec.
on killing a Elite or Special target +30% toughness over 5s,
on Combat Ability reduce Combat ability cooldown by 7.5 per charge.

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i feel this would make the marks more reliable and so easier to gauge their effectiveness.
and in general i feel they would still be distinct enough to be their own vs Warp Charges.

thoughts, comments, concerns
thanks

[raizing]

not specifically related to your inquiry here, but I went into the Psykhanuim and noticed nothing ever got marked. I presume you have to be in an actual game or, like you did, spawn a creature?

[AndiNagasaki]

yes that is true it doesnt work on the enemies that spawn naturally in the Psykhanium.
those that spawn normally have changes that allow them to how damage and such.

i was using a mod, Creature Spawner from NexusMods.
it allows you to clear the normal spawns and spawn any unit in the game.
i use it mostly for testing in a closed environment as it helps remove unknown variables.
the creatures you can spawn in are normal unmodified so they appear with Disrupt Destiny.

[AndiNagasaki]

Reworked Topic please post your thoughts

[Vazumongr]

I think the maintenance of Disrupt Destiny stacks is a bad experience. It’s a shitty feeling to lose potentially 30 stacks because the game decided to simply not mark any enemies for you. However, I disagree with making it like warp charges. I think adding a copy-cat warp charge that just gives different bonuses is stale.

My proposed solutions are to go with one of the following:

• Charge degradation as you mentioned. This eliminates the possibility of losing all your stacks because the game decided to not mark any enemies for 15 seconds.
• Remove the chance to have one enemy marked at a time. Let it mark an enemy every second if one is currently not marked. This removes most of the randomness with maintaining stacks, again alleviating the issue of losing them from without your control
• Allow multiple enemies to be marked at a time, instead of one. This still allows for you to lose everything thanks to RNG, and I think is the worst of these choices, but it’ll at least help ramp up the speed at which you can obtain stacks when you can’t get to the marked target in a quick manner because it spawned 25m away.
• This is non-exclusive to the above, make the marked enemies visible for other players.

I do not agree with reducing the range, as this would make the keystone almost exclusive to melee and reducing build variety. I would agree with having the range be based off what is in your hand at that moment though. 25m by default, 10m for melee weapon.

I do not agree with the idea of reducing the max stacks and increasing the gains per stack. I do not want to see the keystone become a copy-cat Warp Charge. Personally, I’d probably be okay with all the changes I listed above, even if it meant for a decrease in stack count and/or stats per stack. I simply think making changes that allow the player to be in 99% of control of their stack maintenance (still can’t stop your allies from killing all your marks) would turn this keystone into a great experience. But right now, it’s up to the RNG gods on whether or not you can even get a stack, let alone keep 30 of them.

[AndiNagasaki]

@Vazumongr

I think the maintenance of Disrupt Destiny stacks is a bad experience. It’s a shitty feeling to lose potentially 30 stacks because the game decided to simply not mark any enemies for you. However, I disagree with making it like warp charges. I think adding a copy-cat warp charge that just gives different bonuses is stale.

well their would be differences in my example.

having the Bonuses being +2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +6% Weakspot Damage.
with a max of 7 for 15 seconds would drastically change how they work vs Warp Charges.

Disrupt Destiny(Max Charge Build)

+2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage, max of 14 Charges 15sec.
+28% Damage, +56% Critical Damage, +70% Weakspot Damage, at max Charges for 15sec.
on killing a marked target +10% toughness,+20% movement speed for 2.5s

Disrupt Destiny(Max Duration Build)

+2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage, max of 7 Charges 30sec.
+14% Damage, +28% Critical Damage, +35% Weakspot Damage, at max Charges for 30sec.
on killing a marked target +10% toughness,+20% movement speed for 2.5s

Warp Charges(Toughness + Max Charges Build)

+4% Damage, max of 6 Charges 25sec.
+24% Damage, at max Charges for 25sec.
on killing a Elite or Special target +30% toughness over 5s,
on Combat Ability reduce Combat ability cooldown by 7.5 per charge.

.
so in general i feel even with my suggestion,
they would still be distinct enough to be their own.
.

@Vazumongr

My proposed solutions are to go with one of the following:

• Charge degradation as you mentioned. This eliminates the possibility of losing all your stacks because the game decided to not mark any enemies for 15 seconds.
• Remove the chance to have one enemy marked at a time. Let it mark an enemy every second if one is currently not marked. This removes most of the randomness with maintaining stacks, again alleviating the issue of losing them from without your control
• Allow multiple enemies to be marked at a time, instead of one. This still allows for you to lose everything thanks to RNG, and I think is the worst of these choices, but it’ll at least help ramp up the speed at which you can obtain stacks when you can’t get to the marked target in a quick manner because it spawned 25m away.
• This is non-exclusive to the above, make the marked enemies visible for other players.

i agree to all this several times over, great suggestions!

@Vazumongr

I do not agree with reducing the range, as this would make the keystone almost exclusive to melee and reducing build variety. I would agree with having the range be based off what is in your hand at that moment though. 25m by default, 10m for melee weapon.

though i dont agree that your weapon should determine the target mark range.
i do think you may be on to something there,

have 2 targets marked at 2 distinct ranges, one closer to the player one farther away?
have one target marked around 10m-15m, and another at around 20m-25m.
this way players have options of range without having to change their play style much.

@Vazumongr

I do not agree with the idea of reducing the max stacks and increasing the gains per stack. I do not want to see the keystone become a copy-cat Warp Charge. Personally, I’d probably be okay with all the changes I listed above, even if it meant for a decrease in stack count and/or stats per stack. I simply think making changes that allow the player to be in 99% of control of their stack maintenance (still can’t stop your allies from killing all your marks) would turn this keystone into a great experience. But right now, it’s up to the RNG gods on whether or not you can even get a stack, let alone keep 30 of them.

agreed and reading your topic ive changes some of my thoughts.
the reduction would only be by half now.

having the Bonuses being +2% Damage, +4% Critical Damage, +5% Weakspot Damage.
with a max of 7 for 15 seconds would drastically change how they work vs Warp Charges.
see above for the changes.

many good ideas here, im going to add some of them to the topic OP, Thanks!

[Armchair]

One big complaint that I have about the marked target is that it is a very similar color to the friendly player outline color. IMO they should have gone with purple or something. I’m just hopeful that some modder will do fatshark’s job for them and make a mod to fix this.

[AndiNagasaki]

@Armchair

One big complaint that I have about the marked target is that it is a very similar color to the friendly player outline color. IMO they should have gone with purple or something. I’m just hopeful that some modder will do fatshark’s job for them and make a mod to fix this.

I agree, this is also an issue.
Another issue is that a lot of warp abilities cast by psykers also tints Target blue hiding your target.
Such as if they’re being hit by Psykers Flames electricity or other effects.

[Allisary]

@Armchair

One big complaint that I have about the marked target is that it is a very similar color to the friendly player outline color. IMO they should have gone with purple or something. I’m just hopeful that some modder will do fatshark’s job for them and make a mod to fix this.

purple could help with this, or give it a visual effect or pulse?
i feel this is the same issue with the Zealots Flame grenades? not enough visibility on it being yours?

[Ramyam]

This pretty much!

Make it go down 1 stack per 15 seconds, or 1per 30sec with talent yes!
And fewer stacks, 7 like you said, maybe Max 10!! with the talent for max stacks (14 might become too strong with easier upkeep).

And deffinetly make it 2 marked ones within 20, or even 15 meters max!

Always one getting marked 4 rooms ahead behind a pillar/wall and you can’t get to them for a 30sec to a minute, and when you finnely reach them, someone else takes them out before you.

I REALLY wanna play with the Scriers Gaze and Disrupt Destiny, but Disrupt Destiny is just horrible experience currently, just really frustrating, it’s frustrating even with 30 sec timer, tryng to play it with stacking up to 30 just doesn’t work at all.

Also, they could just keep 1 getting marked, BUT if so make it so if ANYONE kills it you get a stack, I don’t wanna feel like I’m COMPETING to kill them quicker then my teamates, I want a COOP not PVP killing race.

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(could be cool to make it somewhat like Veterans marked target one, IF they changed it to only be Specials / Elites? prioritising Specials getting marked Blue, like if the Psyker spends his time finding dangerous enemies rather then shooting lightning, telepathy, and marking them for his teamates, would still get stack if someone in team kills it).

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Also don’t forget you can get 6% warp resistence per stack aswell that I belive most play with that who use Warp charges, it makes it very uniqe compared to Disrupt Destiny, that it makes you able to SPAM Warp based attacks a LOT, especially if you go down the left side of the tree to grab a 3 more, for 5% each.

Making you get 51% Warp resistence! thus you can spam your staffs or blitz abilities like crazy.

That makes warp charges fill a very different role to disrupt desetiny.

[AndiNagasaki]

mostly what @Ramyam said, DD needs some work,
even if the only change the Charges to degrade one at a time it would still be a massive improvement.

[Bababoofa]

For it to go down one at a time might feel good but also it would make it pretty much impossible to lose more than 2 stacks once you max out.

I think best idea would be make them run out like they currently do but make it so it marks up to 10 enemies and enemies are marked every 2 seconds.
That way you get lots of marked targets available to stack your buff and heal you.

[AndiNagasaki]

@Bababoofa

For it to go down one at a time might feel good but also it would make it pretty much impossible to lose more than 2 stacks once you max out.

well they could make it degrade 2 or 3 at a time.
or they could double the bonuses and half the max stacks.

[Ramyam]

Really dissapointed this wasn’t looked at, hopefully in next patch, I mean it’d be fine with just like 1-2 of the changes proposed.

Atleast not drop all 15-30 stacks at once!

simplest fix without remaking it completly, make it so you lose like 3 stacks per 15 sec (30 with talent.

You’d still need to work to keep it up, but not as harsh to lose them all when you fail.

[brosgw]

@AndiNagasaki

its kinda become my go to since Warp Charges now have built in Quicken which i dont care for.

Tangentially related but, I fully agree with this statement. I would use this more if the quicken was maybe its own node. Or replace it with the 6 stacks option, so 6 stacks is base and it quickening is a mile stone some can choose.

[AndiNagasaki]

@Ramyam

simplest fix without remaking it completly, make it so you lose like 3 stacks per 15 sec (30 with talent.

You’d still need to work to keep it up, but not as harsh to lose them all when you fail.

mostly this, we can hope the next patch has this

[AndiNagasaki]

@brosgw

Tangentially related but, I fully agree with this statement. I would use this more if the quicken was maybe its own node. Or replace it with the 6 stacks option, so 6 stacks is base and it quickening is a mile stone some can choose.

this could would as well

[AndiNagasaki]

Added Poll to Topic please Vote!!

[URANUS]

I think this ability is the worst thing that I saw in co-op games.
It should be reworked completely. Designer should be ashamed.

For now it just doesn’t exist to me.

[AndiNagasaki]

that may be abit harsh, it just needs some tweaks