I don't know how to make the rapier work on legend

Will try it. Thank you.

There shouldn’t 1.2 (lvl 15) modifier. Zealot lvl 15 talents don’t offer damage increase besides crit power. Your previous post was correct 1.2(passive) x 1.15(lvl10) x 1.2(power vs chaos) = 1.66 modifier.
Anyway bear in mind that you have to be very low hp to get 1.2 from passive and have 5 enemies next to you to get 1.15 which is the so called glass cannon build which is very risky and only works for experienced players.

Yup. It might seem like a small thing but it stacks up when you got lots of multipliers. Also note that 10% chaos on weapon and 10% chaos on charm is additive since they are the same bonus.

Whoops, I’m hallucinating again.

I couldn’t reproduce that, however it might be due to rounding.

Could you share a test confirming that math?

No tests, I just asked the dataminers. That was what they got from the code.

From having tried it with WHC, it’s a lot better than on BH. One-shotting SV is one of the best things there is (running 10% vs skaven on charm, deathknell+marking allows you to one-shot with a charged heavy). It’s okay vs hordes, although i find it rather awkward as it doesn’t cleave that well per strike, does low damage and relies on volume to deal with them, might need some getting used to, but it’s just fun to poke with. Additional bonus: No gore when you stab peoples.

Whc is a jack of all trades who can work as a mobile off tank with his stamina and dodge.

For the rapier itself, you can block cancel out of the pistol shot by meleeing immediately

Personally have not done much besides kite, which can be useful for wipe recovery, but then saltz is not my main. He can help keep a flank open and crit headshot is nice when it happens

As a jack of all trades it doesn’t do particularly well vs shields, armor and bosses. Falchion BH on the other hand has all these areas covered, while still being very decent vs hordes.

I’m also not sure about the “mobile off tank” role, and how useful that is for a team unless things go terribly wrong, but you still have a good team mate left who can also clutch.

I guess the falchion BH needs to be toned down, along with some other outliers, so that non meta builds can see a bit more action.

I’m really digging zealot rapier build, though I’ve made few changes to have a bit of a dust discount and took different trinkets/talents. Don’t care much about the numbers, but speed+power boost from missed hp and pleasure from working much better than I would expect with rapier attack speed. Really cool, thx for encouraging me to try it.

WHC does well vs bosses as he gives the team 20% more damage. You can stack power boosts on top of that for even better damage output, up to 138. 5% max if you build him right. He can also 1 shot sv with rapier.

Glad to be of help. There are so much more off meta can do compared to the current ‘meta’ builds and I’m really annoyed that there are people insisting that the meta is the best.

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Raiper is best and worst weapon in this game, i main whc so basicly done all my legends with raiper.

-U must practice headshots
-Than u must know what u can do, what cant
-Then how much time you can stab your enemy before they retaliate, each eneny is diferent
-U must use stab + dodge tactic (like stab holding leftcclick, then dodge back and charge stab and hit again)
-20% speed enchant is must for hordes, to keep them stagered, otherwisec they retaliate
-Only real weakness of raiper is chaos wars, but if you hit head u can still do decent damage
-use slashes on infantry for anything else you need shord charged stabs
-also 20% dodge talent is must
-use offhand pistol not to kill but to Cc enemies

I’d also add three things to that:

  • Do not shoot Blightstormers with it unless you’re hugging them. (First offenses make them start their teleport.)
  • Try to pick between 1-2 slashing or 1-2-3 slashing as they’re easier to headshot trash with.
  • If you see a Globadier, you can stun with the pistol, making for an invaluable save.

I rebound my weapon-special key to V and use it to spam rapier shots if I want to stun something or for a quick stun or kill on assassins crouching (or mid-air), stormvermin and leeches.

A good pointblank headshot on a blightstormer will work a treat as well if you can get that close. Remember that a slash will reset your shot-timer, and while it’s easy to mess the rotation up you can still get some quick shots off while advancing on something. This is invaluable when you want to stunlock Rasknitt during skittergate so he stops the obnoxious lightning.

My only gripe with rapier can be the fact that sometimes fast-blocking after an attack feels horrible since the weapon will be up, the shields will display but you’ll still take a hit from something.

I like the WHC build you posted on the Squirrel discord:

Build name: CritSpam WHC

Build link: http://verminbuilds.com/#aa6d3a250ce3-f452c56327ad

Summary: The CritSpam WHC is an attempt to attain 100% uptime on the ultimate to boost the team’s crit by 20% whenever there is a horde. It also features high boss dps and team damage boosts.

Pros:
+20% crit rate for team
+20% damage vs elites/specials/monsters for team
43% crit chance max
1 hit SV with max charged stab
High ammo sustain with scrounger
Leftclick spam
High skill ceiling

Cons:
Little personal damage boosts
Leftclick spam
Have to headshot to do significant damage
Still bad vs CW

Notable points:
Rapier with resourceful and 43% crit rate allows roughly 3-4 crit hits on average per sec in a horde, or 6-8% CDR per sec. Combined with 40% CDR, this should mean that there almost is no downtime for the ult, and you probably can kill most elites faster by spamming light attacks at their heads. 43% crit rate also means that the volley’s ammo should last a very long time when used during the ult.

Didn’t think Resourceful Combatant was worth it compared to Swift Slaying, but it works quite well. Also never thought about Concoction, since everyone uses Decanter, but it sill gives you almost full ult charge on speed potion, and you can leave concentration to your Sienna/Kruber!

Not sure the 10% CDR though, since you’d need to give up curse resist. Also I do not see the reason why to bring Volley, specially since Crossbow buff. Damage vs bosses and specials seems poor unless you crit. Even with 43% crit chance, ammo is still too unreliable and the ult window too small, which makes it a bad spamming weapon imo. You have Rapier, not sure why you need another horde clear :smiley:

Other than that Rapier seems much more viable since the Falchion nerf which was a needed change imo. Haven’t tried the new Axe or Fail yet though.

The volley has excellent damage vs bosses so if you ult, stun the boss and then unload into his head you should do a ton of damage. High crit rates should allow you to shoot into the horde and recover a lot of ammo when you crit. In addition you have lots of firepower on demand if you need to kill a special or 3.

To me, curse resist is entirely optional. As you get better you’ll find that you don’t really need it at all. This was the case in V1 where towards the end most vets were running around without curse resist and were doing fine.

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I agree but the other options in V2 are kinda lackluster/situational in comparison, where in V1 we’re looking at 1/3rd of our overall perks. I sometimes roll with crit + mvmt or crit + cd anyways but the resist just makes for a pretty decent safety belt. That said, temp health also means your total health isn’t as important as it was on V1 as long as you’re on a job that shreds trash quickly, so its value is really variable depending on the class you’re on.

On IB/FK/merc, where you know you’re always gonna be carrying the grim, I still think curse resistance is pretty vital. With their health + talents and curse resistance, you’re at ~95% of a normal, non-adjusted health pool. Makes losing a grim extremely difficult and gives you more freedom to each hits if needed to max out your tank performance or help the team.

Definitely not mandatory but still the best overall value of all non-crit charm properties in general in V2.

Maybe the 20% monster damage pushes it over the top, since I only have 10% for now, but so far I don’t see it… or I’m really unlucky with crits as I usually only get 6/15 or less shots to crit.

The point is to stack as much damage bonuses for burst damage since they are multiplicative. 20% tag, 20% shrapnel, 20% monster, 20% chaos means a total of ~107% instead of 80% increased damage. Add in headshots, a base damage of ~60+ to monsters and 15 bolts means that you should be doing a good chunk of boss damage in 5s.

Raiper itself is not a issue…its good weapon, if not best in hands of player who practiced alot.

Issue is WHC low health pool, only 100 health, which is rediculusly low for melee hero, and I see no reason behind it, even some ranged heroes got more HP.

Which means:
-U are extremly prone to Friendly fire
-Your worst enemies are rats which you not notice, even single paesant rat can screw your day if somehow sneak out of your sight.
-I also find big issue when one of your mates push rats and some of them somehow end behind you, or they wound rat but not kill it…like hit rat once, then u think this guy is dead, you turn camera and this rat raises and bash you.
-In additonal, WHC is class designed to not take damage at all, which mean u need to dodge alot, dance around your enemies, which makes WHC bad pick with group composition which restrict movement…like u got beam mage and flamethrower dwarf in same group (this group composition will restrict your movement and u are eventualy screwed)
-On 100HP pool any attack your reicive is devastating, and really feels damaging
-You are also very prone to lagg hits… 1 good lag hit can end your day (anyone get lag hit from time to time, but belive me they feel less issue on someone with 125hp or 150hp , than on you with 100hp.
-Because low health pool u cant be confident like other heroes, instead doing damage, u always reeling back in fear that they woud hit you, which ultimatly leads to feeling that raiper deal no enough damage which is wrong. Raiper is good, issue is lays in low Health Pool.

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