I stopped playing Helldivers after 30 hours. I had a very hard time trying to enjoy it compared to this game - don’t get me wrong, I enjoyed helldivers. The issue I had was the strategems or w/e - at a certain point it felt like I was completely useless and the only thing completing the mission was me pressing buttons in random directions lol
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Ehh…its a cheesy way of making things harder for sure. Unlike melee enemies you are unlikely to be able to see and react to all ranged enemies targeting you. Especially with how busy and often half broken the visual and audio cue landscape is. It’s justmakes certain builds on certain classes so popular and even more overpowered due to their survivability.
I would like ranged units to be slightly less of push overs in general, but Havoc combination of buffs just feels too much for normal gameplay.
I agree. Modesty aside, I had been predicting this for months and months when someone wanted a T6 with enemies with more HP
This is the worst way to increase difficulty (enemies with more HP, taking “resources” away from the player, crazy damage) and simply creates something artificial and unfair
But I guess the super tryharders, the 0,1% of community but even the loudest ones, are happy… so is Fatshark
I wonder why Fatshark didn’t invest this development time in something useful for the whole communty, like more maps, weapons, enemies etc etc.
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Havoc mode favours pre made groups or groups fully coordinated with exclusively optimized builds and extreme cooperation. And it truly succeeded on this.
Testament to all this are all the random and premade teams who have finished rank 40 and true survivor challenge (one of the toughest challenges in the game which requires pure team gameplay).
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Some ammount of artificial difficulty is required or the game cannot be more difficult than it is. You can’t just spam more enemies infinitely. Also lots of people have been complaining that shooters have been too weak since their nerfs near game launch actually. Like lots of people were opposed to those changes. They made shooters and gunners irrelevant as threats. Obviously OOPS ALL GUNNERS spam is bad but shooters being dangerous is good. Have you tried using terrain to avoid getting shot?
Havoc 40 can be beaten with non-meta builds but havoc 40 is a challenge difficulty. Some things arent going to make the cut for most players. Thats good. If you want a balanced gameplay experience go play Auric Maelstrom.
They released 1 new map, 7 new weapons within 3 new pretty unique patterns. And a new game mode. Like what do you want man? Thats actually pretty good for fatsharks notoriously glacial development cycle.
The last patch we got was the train map and the shock mauls lmao.
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I’m not too bothered by buffed shooters. In fact, so far that and the ammo consumption’s been the only features of Havoc my Crew and I have had to adjust our playstyles for. Which is what we were hoping to do going into Havoc. If we’re lucky, 30+ will make us step up more, but from the sounds of it that’s not the case here. Disappointing the meta for Havoc is the same old same old.
Ya’ll remember the days when “High Mobility” knife builds were considered memes? I 'member. Ahem.
What we really wanted was more stuff like “Scab melee only” where we’d have to radically adjust our builds for each mission and strategize. I’d very much like to see a “No Combat Abilities” mission modifier, since that’d not only deliver a swift kick to the meta, but also require everyone to rethink their builds to minimize what are now dead CA/CDR talents.
I wanted real gut-punchers for modifiers.
Instead we got “Cranial Parasites that actually make the game easier”, “Hordes now use the most common armor type”, “It’d be funny if you brought bleed” and “The floor is now soup”. The last one’s pretty good though, and should probably be promoted to base game.
As for the base game itself, I already made my plea in a different post, but I really wanted the other enemies to also, at least sometimes, be serious threats. I suggested a Champions-based system where Elites and Specialists can spawn as upgraded versions with unique features, because right now it’s really just a mode of meat and bullets. If it doesn’t shoot bullets, it’s just meat.
I want to be scared of everything, sometimes. Not one thing all the time.
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They released 1 new map, 7 new weapons within 3 new pretty unique patterns. And a new game mode. Like what do you want man? Thats actually pretty good for fatsharks notoriously glacial development cycle.
Methinks they’re working under the common assumption that game developers are a “One size fit all” type gig, and that the same folks who made havoc could have instead made additional maps or weapons. This is wrong, of course, since the folks working on Havoc are not level designers or environment artists, and they’re certainly not animators.
For some reason, people think that, in some alternate universe where Havoc was never conceived, we’d have gotten more maps and weapons and the like. But in reality, we’d have the same number of weapons and maps, and just no Havoc mode.
A better complaint, is that they should have made Havoc different. It should have been better, or entirely something else (Cough Chaos Wastes Cough). The Darktide team really excels at doing drastic reworks, so maybe releasing an unpopular feature is just the first step towards getting more stuff to rework, since I don’t think they want to rework mission-select or cosmetics.
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Too real, on this forum you’re supposed to flex nonstop and tell everyone how easy everything is
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I think this might be the sore point for me. Can’t speak for others but I’m sure I’m not alone. It absolutely isn’t a balanced gameplay experience, it’s more like playing champion in VT2. My choices are ballbusting shooter balance on Havoc that kinda prohibits me from playing the game with much variety or pisseasy aurics that are just completely trivialized by the current meta stuff.
And I’d almost accept the angle of “that’s just how it is” if not for the fact that damnation used to be balanced perfectly fine as a harder endgame experience.
Basically it feels like everyone’s been asking to address the powercreep but instead what we get for now is a powercreeped new gamemode that’s designed to be CBT but the game is just becoming easier and easier below that. Psykers already shat on auric maelstroms and they just got their toughness buffed. At the same time between the dueling sword and the ability spam and all that, nothing has been changed.
I’m just not a fan of the way there is seemingly no effort to balance aurics anymore, and adding a challenge gamemode that intentionally busts your balls and forces you to adjust is not the solution to that.
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I certainly feel a pressure to.
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Now this isn’t accurate.
Your choice is actually “pisseasy aurics that are completely trivialized by the current meta stuff and ballbusting shooter balance on havoc that’s also completely trivialized by the current meta stuff but with more bubble psykers”
Its not a hard enough unless it makes everyone suffer equally.
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I agree on that although to be fair the skill floor for Havoc 40 is definitely a bit higher than for aurics, even with the meta setups. Not by a whole lot though. I was going to say it forces you to learn how to melee but it doesn’t, you can still just put on an agile DS. It does enforce teamplay
- I agree with you that auric is too easy
- Thats actually because a small percentage of the game’s players are legitimagely too good. Most pubbies still die in aurics
- Yes meta needs nerfs, hopefully we get some
- Don’t play meta in auric unless you want a nap
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The skill floor is way higher. You can barely make the smallest mistakes, even on lower ranks. Havoc is stomping me flat, and I almost exclusively (and quite comfortably) play aurics.
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I guess I meant specifically with the meta setups. With the meta setups, mistake away, doesn’t matter you have gromril armor and invulnerability with 80% uptime and infinite dodges so you don’t even need to learn how to fight a crusher or a horde without dodge spamming.
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I’m sure that’s true aswell, but it’s partially also just too easy when you quickplay and two vets in your maelstrom crutch on bolter/voc setups and the third is a zealot with a dueling sword instakilling everything. I don’t think any of these things are actually down to people being too good, it’s just OP loadouts that act as crutches for bad players who then get to trivialize the highest difficulty with it. In that sense you can play non-meta on aurics if you’re good and don’t need the crutches, but in a good half of games you can still go take a nap because players on the team do it for you. Even just one bolter/VoC vet will trivialize the mission, even if he’s the kind of player who doesn’t know how to kill a bulwark 1v1.
I’ve got a good 1500 hours in VT2 (not a lot compared to some people but yknow) and never felt this way on cata matchmaking (outside of the recent OEB thing) so I don’t think this is something that can’t be balanced properly. I really think a lot of the negative reactions to Havoc are because people wanted difficulty and less crutches, but not fundamentally different balance.
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Will? You’re about a year or so behind the times bub. This has been going on for a while here. The moment ObeseTuna so much as touched “the meta” after “the great patch 13” oh heck did the proverbial feces storm start. Nerf? Oh its fine as long as its those horrible Casuals playing ranged-focused veterans but the moment anyone so much as hinted that it was time to balance certain abusive melee mechanics? Harass, bully, spam-reported, etc.
Sad truth is that gamers as a group are whiny little buttwipes who don’t give two hoots about having fun. Nope, its all about hitting some arbitary (and ever shifting) number so they can look down on someone else and sneer. Nope fun is something that can’t be had because it might detract from the all important race for some sort of status and imaginary power in their lives that are probably the closest to being a literal waste of flesh that you will ever find.
Welcome to the 21st century. Where stupidity and its consequences are not just the norm but celebrated.
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What are you referring to out of curiosity?
I would also like to see more “interesting” enemy buffs. In Havoc and in General.
I listed a bunch in Imagining A Better Havoc Mode (Come Cope With Me) But to summarize a few, why can’t bursters leave behind trails of creep like Burgles? What if muties could buff nearby allies everytime they run into a wall? Changes like that which by themselves are trivial but in Havoc would start to add up overtime.
Having a chance for Elites and Specialists to spawn as Champion variants with such features would be so cool. Might not close the power gap as much as some tactical nerf-strikes, but it would be so cool and that’s worth repeating. And it wouldn’t require much additional work art-wise, other than some SFX that could be copy-pasted so you can tell at a glance that this is a champion version (red glowy eyes, for example).
Development resources aside, we could also use some new enemies. For example, high mobility builds are meta, and folks really hate speedsters running ahead, so why not try and counter that with a challenge by adding a new elite with a need for speed itself?
We should turn Knife users into a New Enemy [Reavers] It might not be a silver bullet, but this would help address reckless speeding on a conceptual level and in a way that’s fun and cool.
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New game mod = same maps with artificial modifiers
Mate, this game has more than 2 years, Vermintide after the same amount of time had much more variety and contents…
…and Darktide is game that starts with less variety!
Fatshark spent most time in things that should not have been at problem at all, like the old crafting system and the old non-existing character building (if only they listened feedback from Vermintide)
New characters, new talents branches, new faction, total new fanciful weapons (not a bigger sword or a half heavy stubber)
People keep asking a lot of interesting missing things… almost everything better than Havoc
IMHO even a simple fourth new weapon (for Veteran) in this last dlc would have been better that Darktide