Hey guys! first time posting on forum cuz I had a thought and wanted some feedback on it. I Have alil under 1400 hours in Dtide and I wanted to give Vtide a chance since it came from it and I never tried it. My friends said I would hate it cuz of how different it feels but I carried on with it. After playing it for about 70 hours my question to you guys is why did Fatshark change Dtide so much compared to Vtide in terms of Bloat of everything? I oddly like Vtide more cuz of the lack of toughness and theyre not just raining 300 specials every corner on you. I was actually shocked when I first got to cata and you can just die in 2 hits out of the blue. To me Vtide feels like left for dead and Dtide feels like im in DragonballZ. I dont dislike Dtide clearly due to my hours but like I said I was just curious why did they decide to move to make it so mmmm dopamine infested? It actually feels like two different companies made the games.
Ratclick is easier in base difficulties, with better overall balance (Outliers include Sienna, Elf and WHC) but is dramatically harder mechanically to get actually good at.
darktide got hit with way more unchecked powercreep whereas VT didnt have as much. it had plenty but not nearly as explosively wild as darktides was. systemwise, toughness was to account for the much larger presence of ranged enemies, which thp didnt quite hit the mark compared to vermintide. the earliest patches of darktide more or less were much more similar to vermintide in terms of overall intensity of enemy v player, but lots of reworks and changes ended up raising the bar consistently for both sides so now its very much just a theme park of “wow look at all of these enemies being exploded”
On a note less focused on power creep, VT2 has a bigger focus on melee with primarily ranged combat only really being accessible to specific careers, and even then only for sniping elites and specials (still REALLY fun though).
VT2 also has a more relaxed and “traditional” pace compared to DT. Endgame DT demands nonstop vigilance and is constant action while VT2 gives breaks, but that doesn’t stop it from being difficult on high difficulties. Teamplay is also more emphasized since individual players and careers are weaker and have weaknesses that need to be covered.
In terms of progression, they did one or two patches to make getting to a good place in progression a bit quicker, but I think it’ll still take a couple hundred hours to get all the loot you want.
EDIT: Fell victim to “read the title and first sentence and nothing else”, woops. Everyone laugh at this user.
Vermintide 2 to Darktide did the same sort of things that Vermintide 1 to Vermintide 2 did.
Gave way more tools for the players, and increased the amount of enemies, as well as the “random bull****” factor.
sprinting and sliding makes darktide the easier game
vt2 = needs have a good understanding in kiting and blocking and pushing, cause it matters more there, specials are way more threatening than dt ones.
assassins are deadly because they pounce so fast and you have a very tight small window reaction to push / dodge them. packmasters more harder than trappers, then you have the constant pressure from leeches. blightstormers zoning out players etc.
in dt you can just spam dodge and slide dodge 24/7 and never really ever block
i concur it’s 100% that vt2 just never got the same power creep. in darktide you’re so powerful that you’re killing mass amounts of enemies without caring what they are and sometimes even without caring where they are. you can just send a psyker scream and it kills like every non elite through walls in a gigantic cone. many types of gameplay in darktide involve not actually caring what is infront of you and not needing to care. you have stuff like gigantic wall of fire flamers just blinding you while killing and infinite cleaving every enemy indiscriminately.
try ignoring what sort of enemy is infront of you in vt2. you’ll go down within minutes, every time
it’s not only that but in darktide the player is capable of removing every threat before it comes into melee range. honestly usually even before it aggros. patrols in darktide just get wiped out instantly, the equivalent in vt2 takes some potions and a few bombs. in darktide you got the potions built into your talents and the bombs built into your kit (regenerating usually)
Yea one thing that has really blown my mind is certain weapons just can’t even hurt armored units to the point where you actually rely on other players as oppose to just building attack of said debuff and killing everything. It’s been an eye opening experience.
Yea I’ve had one assassin team wipe me and my bots 3 times already pouncing me near cliffs. It’s crazy!
In its earliest days, DT featured a smaller overall enemy count; bosses and Crushers were genuine threats, and Gold Toughness didn’t even exist. Back then, a mere graze from a Flamer’s fire or a Captain’s shockwave would instantly shred your toughness. This forced players to constantly think about their positioning and movement, demanding a high level of skill that made the game feel very similar to VT2.
The lead combat designer from that era has since left Fatshark. Whether that’s the direct cause or not, it was around that time when the combat style of DT clearly shifted, resulting in rampant player powercreep accompanied by a massive influx of enemies. Personally, I don’t mind DT having more enemies than VT2, in fact, I think it suits the game better, but they have clearly taken it too far. While recent balance patches have made some progress by reducing Crusher spawns and nerfing Uncanny Strike, the adjustments are honestly nowhere near enough. They need to rein in the player power creep while simultaneously dialing back the overall enemy density.
Due to its extreme difficulty, Havoc mode has degenerated into little more than a “Gold Toughness Bubble Inferno Simulator” for more than half of the playtime. The gameplay has devolved into low-skill spamming.
You can still play dtide like this in the current day and it helps the game be more fun! Off meta comps usually have individuals each having weaknesses in their build that they rely on allies to cover. One of the big problems about dtide is that meta builds often make classes into well rounded master of all trades who all compete with eachother to kill everything.
Yea I was watching vtide2 beta footage of the troll hp regen and it was like 30-50 sec and it took the entire team fighting or he would full heal. It looked amazing!
Yea after playing Vtide some I hope they keep the games separate in how they play. I’m really digging the less is more of Vtide a lot. My issue I’ve had with dtide and most games with talents trees is to me the trees feel no different then Vtides. There’s so many options but mathematically like60% of the trees are pointless and not even from a meta perspective.
It’s true, I honestly like the base combat in VT1 the best of all. Vermintide 2 is awesome, all the careers and talents and general mayhem of so many enemies… but man, that VT1 combat is just so satisfying. Still go back to play it from time to time.
Some of it is new devs, but I think the bigger answer is they didn’t want to just make the same game again, they wanted to try new things. I can respect that, but I agree I don’t like how it affected Darktide combat.
Another thing to keep in mind with older verm2 footage is that the temporary health generation talent was a level 20 unlock.
There was no way to “undo” damage taken, the only healing options were the few health potions and healing kits you’ll find throughout the map.
Yeah - I think the differences in gameplay between the games has more to do with the powercreep than with increased emphasis on ranged combat.
After powercreep - though it may really be part of it - I’d rank the relative lack of interdependence between characters.
Yea at the moment I can’t get off the game I’ve been on like 8 hours a day it’s so fun!