Because I’m of the mind that it should either be eliminated completely, or severely reduced to the point that its impact is negligible. It may be important for a competitive multiplayer shooter, but not in a cooperative multiplayer shooter like this. It’s making ranged play more trouble than it’s worth, I feel like I wouldn’t bother wasting my time trying to outgun an NPC and just charge it to force it into melee instead, which is more effective anyway.
You can completely negate the flinch with volley fire
and reduce it with deadshot feat
no reason it should be removed, theres a reason the sharpshooter class exists
So it might shock you to learn that there’s actually more than just veterans in the game. Getting shot in the face apparently makes you unable to pull your trigger on your grenade launcher and instead soak a sniper shot to the face. (And your legs also totally stop working so you can’t even dodge)
It’s stupid as hell and if nothing else is just a complete anti fun mechanic.
If you get flinched with a ranged weapon up it replays its entire ready animation. I hope that’s not intentional. Like knock your aim, reduce accuracy, whatever, don’t lock me out of using my weapon.
Try using cover?
All you really need is to dip around a corner for a second.
Or just dodge the very obviously telegraphed ranged attacks and then shoot immediately after.
Tell me you haven’t done anything above malice without saying it.
And if you have, I want your version of the game, because literal hordes of ranged units is very common.
Even a single regular scab/dreg can wipe out your entire toughness bar in a volley or two.
Do enemy hordes make walls disappear?
I still disagree with you, ive played above malice
other classes like ogryn are supposed to do a melee focus not a gunner focus
you want to shoot stuff play a sharpshooter
literally the purpose of Ogryn is tank not offense
Except it also totally screws you over in melee as it flinches you out of dodging/blocking. Combined with a single scab/dreg targeting you without toughness and you’re going to get your teeth kicked in.
Go play ogryn or zealot some and get back to me.
Also see scenarios like the clip I specifically linked. If you’re not still shooting things as ogryn/zealot you’re a terrible player.
inb4 “Just use a shield”
Do enemy hordes give you the ability to shoot through walls? The only way you can reasonably try to deal with it is by constantly dodging back into cover the second you poke your head out for a tenth of a second.
As far as i can tell youve never played with a team that does their jobs, or used a mace and shield
you should try it sometime
perhaps play with people who kill things
also a little tip ranged enemies will stop shooting when you get so close to them, you have a charge ability try it
Lol. I literally just edited in “inb4 just use a shield” while fixing a typo which is a band aid on the problem and still doesn’t fix flinching the second you take a volley from anything if you do anything but hold right click.
If the game isn’t playable/fun unless you use a specific weapon then the game design has already totally failed.
I’m not going to bother debating this further as you’re making it abundantly clear you haven’t tried ogryn because you’re saying some really ignorant stuff. It’s also getting beyond the scope of the point that the flinch sucks for everyone, not just ogryn.
Its a beta, theres going to be loads more weapons and sub classes
I think before you sit here and scream about removing a fundamental feature of a game you wait a bit to see what else is behind the curtains
There are no more sub classes on release. (Per Fatshark) To my knowledge ogryn is only missing a stun baton and a two handed club. (And that could be wrong, a friend mentioned it to me and I haven’t personally verified that)
I don’t even want reduced accuracy. When you run in to a dozen shooters with half a dozen gunners that suppress the entire area, the people you rely on to eliminate those targets are suddenly completely useless because even a stray bullet causes obscene flinching making it nearly impossible to hit the target. I guess the only saving grace here is that the AI is so braindead and extremely focused that once it chooses a target, it will very often only attack that target until death (even when they decide to duck behind a wall). Some others with a bigger health pool will break off and pick someone else, but the problem of getting closer to shooters to do that is not always the wisest (or even possible) option.
Sometimes, there’s just no cover nearby. Take the Smelter mission for example at the end. There’s a lot of spots with cover sure, but most of the ending arena is very open.
While many spots may have a small box or some railing to hide behind, they’re not really good in some cases as well.
Take for example some of the railings you can find throughout the maps. Many have a small space under the panel that you can be shot through.
Cover barely even works in this game to begin with. Large obstacles or walls can work, but a lot of the stuff you see the AI duck behind is completely useless for the player.
I want you to take a good look at the Twin linked Stubber and Ripper gun and learn what a Gunlugger ogryn is.
If there's a class focused on primarily being in melee, it's Zealot.
While Ogryn has a lot in their kit to help push forward, they don’t have perks that provide a bonus for being close to an enemy. I think instead the ogryn is there " To protect the little uns" because everything in his kit is more about causing massive amounts of stagger and disruption to opponents and clusters of trash mobs.
His grenade gauntlet is also wonderful. We also need to remember that even the Foot knight in Vermintide has access to ranged weapons. We only ever witnessed melee only classes in the Bretonia knight and the Warrior priest towards the games later half.
I think every class should have the capability to perform each " task " just some are far better at it than others.
Melee flinching is fine. You can dodge, block, swing and push. You at least have a chance of defending yourself.
Ranged flinching and knocking back ARE FREAKING OBNOXIOUS.
Especially on difficulty 4/5 with endless hordes of hitscan aimbots and gunner spam.
Want to tie units up in melee? Too bad!
Because the aimbots fire through crowds of their own units and stunlock you during melee.
Because of the stunlock, every class plays the same, with 90% of matches spent ratting behind tiny pieces of cover, bolter sniping literally 1000-1500 pixel sized ranged units hidden in shadows/cover, every game.
I’m mostly talking about ranged flinching anyway - melee is often the only option you have in this game because it’s so bad. I mentioned why I wouldn’t even bother trying to outgun an NPC because it’s much easier to just run up next to them (most of the time) and force them into melee.
Try running into melee on diff 5 lmao.
With dozens of shooters per wave, any single one of them takes out your shield in a burst.
Did I mention they shoot while strafing too?