Does anyone like weapon flinch?

Especially when a firing squad spawns behind you and immediately opens fire. At least after the AI tweaks they switch to melee if they are that close 50% of the time.

I haven’t tried diff 5, but I have a 30 Ogryn and have played a few 4’s, and I find that pretty bad already. I made a Veteran (at 16 now) because the kind of targets I needed dealt with in my Ogryn games were not happening, thinking that ranged damaged would be far more viable in harder difficulties, but now I’m finding that the reduced accuracy and flinching makes it a lot more difficult than I initially thought it would be. With the amount of shooters I ran up against in T4, I’m starting to see a problem emerge.

I just deal with the endless suppression and snipe through it. There’s just no way to move, much less go in for melee when every wave they’re throwing crowds of 40 ranged trash mixed with endless streams of gunners, shotgunners, and trappers.

Going in for melee is only an option when you’ve already mopped up everything to save a bit of ammo.

Basically Sniper Elite with a W40Hk skin.

weapon flinch is absolutely awful. they should remove suppression as a mechanic entirely. It just kills the pacing of the game, its awful.

Even if you do play sharpshooter, I don’t know how many times ive been stuck in a reload animation and the reload gets interrupted and im stuck in an infinite reloading lock and cant shoot any of the guardsman mowing my entire team down.

“Just duck behind a wall bro” yeah what happens when the guards spawn behind you? or flank you? this game has crazy verticality and its very common to get shot above and below you as well.

“just play with people who do their job” kind of hard when you are the sharpshooter getting suppressed and you can’t kill the guardsman “bb-buh just have an ogryn on your team with a shield” wow very cool that ogryn players are mandatory and they can only use the shield and no other weapons ever. very cool game design.

I guess If I que up a level 4 or 5 mission in quickplay and didn’t get an ogryn I have to restart my game.

“Lmao just shoot at them so they stop shooting” suppression is literally bugged and doesn’t work.

“lmao just gapclose them, they put their weapon away if you get close enough” yeah okay, until you get downed trying to gapclose, or you do gapclose and they don’t put their weapons away because its not consistant or bugged.

Also I have been in several games while the ogryn with the shield is being shot at, and I get suppressed as the veteran and im not even being shot at. Its buggy and it doesnt work.


ive used cover, and then ive had ranged shooting PUSH ME OUT OF COVER.

yep played sharpshooter to 30 and i would say, that not a single sniper type weapon is viable, as soon as you poke your head out of cover there’s 10 platoons ready to supress you instantly, sure theres the ult but not being allowed to play the game until ult is backup is awful design

Not to forget sliding is an anti shooting manouver where every single shot will miss you while you do it

Play vet too and dodging while shooting requires getting used to but let’s you half the shots taken if not more and remember to slide into cover as sliding is 100% dodge on ranged attacks

have you played 4/5? there are 4 reaper 6 gunners and 4 dozens normal shooters, thats without any specials, you ain’t gonna just slide and then quickly take em out easy peasy.

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Not 5 but have done 4 and well i normally go lucius or plasma as to instantly deal with reapers and gunners. And i go for cover when my toughness is low to regen. I will admit it might not be as fun and i do dislike the flinch too.

I think the ranged enemies in this game in general just aren’t very fun to deal with. Not so much the specials, but more the common shooters you find as ambients and in some hordes. I’ve noticed a pattern developing where your whole team is forced to play peek-a-boo for the entire match due to how punishing ranged units are, and it’s a bit boring honestly.Even taking into account the fact that engagement (aka them switching from ranged to melee) and cover are both confirmed to be broken systems, I still don’t see the ranged combat here feeling very satisfying after a while.

The AI also being pin-perfect accurate regardless of the conditions of the map also kinda takes you out of the whole thing. For example with the darkness modifier, you telling me these people living in a sewer of a hive city have access to thermal or night vision scopes somehow? And not just one or two of them being better equipped like the snipers which makes perfect sense, but there’s entire battalions of dreg soldiers equipped with better stuff than any of our rejects? Cause it sure doesn’t seem like the darkness affects them at all, so what ends up happening is you get shot from the fog by about 8000 lasers out of nowhere with no chance to retaliate.

A perfect example of uninteresting ranged combat, and this probably comes down to bad level design more than anything but still, there’s that one mission where you go down the elevator into a room with the data extractor in the middle. Immediately after the elevator is usually (always?) a Medicae station, however down below is a bunch of ranged units dispersed all around the room, usually in cover that is a bit awkward to hit even from above. You have absolutely no cover up above on the balcony other than sliding back towards the elevator and I think a very small wall on the right-hand side where you can still get shot from (might be wrong on that, can’t remember right now).

The entire flow of combat in that section is literally just sliding back to avoid getting shot at by literal aimbots shooting you from a lower vantage point and slowly chipping away at your HP. If you try rush them down by dropping down immediately, you get stunlocked to death and miss out on the medicae healing (the medicae station is within view of some enemies and they will hit you), so what most teams are doing is just sitting up there and taking little potshots from time to time when they recover from suppression. It’s not difficult since these are just ambients that you have to clear out, it’s simply frustrating and quite boring to deal with.

As a psyker your role is to press G, hold left click in the general direction of the enemy, duck behind a wall and wait for 3 seconds. You then vent and repeat this ad nauseam.

As the vet you just have to pray that the enemy targets someone else and you don’t get suppressed so you can get one or two shots off before you duck behind and wait for a bit again.

As an Ogryn, you have to go shield and you hold right click and do nothing else. Fun.

Haven’t played Zealot, but from what I’ve read on these forums he gets flinched out of his ult when hit by ranged which is a truly comically bad design decision, cause isn’t the point of the Zealot ult to close the gap?

I don’t know what the perfect solution to this issue would be (aside from better map design in that particular section anyways), I just know as a player it isn’t all that fun or engaging, especially not when you consider the fact I’ve only played this game for around 20 hours (which is short compared to my thousands in VT) and am already dreading whenever I get the above mentioned level, since I know there’s gonna be a few spots where I have to just… sit there and take potshots at the AI.

I’d love to be able to dodge them, but that option was removed two patches ago :clown_face:

Honestly I’m fine with Weapon Flinch. I just need Toughness and Dodge to be reverted to how it was in the closed beta.

As a Zealot, it plays exactly the same way the Vet does.

Peek-snipe tiny pixels hiding behind cover in the dark x 1500.

Tactical play where the group is being more careful with how they approach encounters when they go through a level doesn’t sound bad at all, it’s just that the game is missing things like cover play which help make those kind of games work. I kind of enjoy the idea of people slowing down and maybe even discussing an attack pattern on a group of mobs, almost like an MMO group doing a dungeon. Problem though is that you can’t really waste time in this game with hordes being a threat, especially in higher difficulties. The idea of harder difficulties requiring patience and thought could work… maybe if your guns weren’t severely gimped in those encounters. Have your own suppressing fire, diversionary tactics, drawing enemy attention away so melee can move in, etc.