Bile Troll is over-tuned

Before marking this post down as a rant from someone who just isn’t good enough to manage this boss spawn, I regularly complete legend runs with less than 4 people and the only time a run is really forfeit is when the Troll is forced on us.

Simply put, he is too tough, even as a DPS-check, he is way over-tuned since his previous state of being too underwhelming. His toolkit is vastly superior to any of his peers:

-Unblockable attacks
-CC that also does high damage
-Regeneration states
-Passive regeneration
-Narrow hitbox
-Resistant

Not even a slayer going at it full DPS mode can out-DPS the passive regeneration. When you pair that fact with the reality that over the course of the fight you’ll need to dodge about 50 unblockable swings of his club that each take half your HP, things get a little frustrating. When coupled with a horde or even a number of ambients/specials on legend difficulty, the Bile Troll becomes somewhat of an insta-forfeit, a 25% chance on boss spawn of losing the run. When compared with let’s say, a Chaos Spawn:

-Large target
-Easy to avoid tentacle grab
-A slam in a tiny AoE
-Disproportionately squishy compared to Troll

Don’t get me wrong, it is possible to beat it, but it’s so substantially harder than the other 3 bosses that it becomes almost futile. Each time a Troll is spawned there is a collective sigh from whichever group of experienced players I’m with at the time. Again, this is all based on legend difficulty.

TLDR:
Bile Troll OP, nerf pls.

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Yeah at this point from easiest
1)rat ogre
2)stormfiend
3)chaos spawn
4)bile troll
oh god fu** this guy, swinging at it for an hour complete with hp gating and regen.

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Stormfiend I think is still easier than the Ogre, just because it’s attacks are telegraphed and easily avoided. At least the Ogre bashes you around a bit and screws up the team’s positioning.

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what annoys me themost about the troll is his bile… you thry to doge it when he aims it at you? You still get hit and due to the slow down you won’t get out any time soon. He pukes as he goes to his knees, while you’re on stairs or so and he is below you? (Like on the Shallya hospital map)… bile still reaches you…

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I agree, not to mention its hit range and the aoe pools on the ground, especially when it starts to heal in it…
I played as a Handmaiden, when the boss targeted me with its spit attack. i wanted to dash sideways, so i dont have to risk that it hits me if my dodge is not enough. It shoot the bile after me, as i dashed, got me ccd and killed…
So fix troll pls (and Handmaiden dash really unreliable, i was stopped mid dash by chaos warriors, bosses and even small rocks on the forest map…)

I totally see where you are coming from, but in my experience I’ve actually found chaos spawn harder to deal with than the troll. I’m sure its just down to who I play (mostly sienna), but i find the troll much easier to kite. I guess ive also had more issues with the spawn bugging out and hitting me from behind or grabbing me through a wall.

this, this, a million times this

I find Chaos Spawn much worse than Bile Troll, especially with latency. I’ve had a Spawn go from 25% HP to full because he wouldn’t stop aggroing a laggy dwarf, and the dwarf couldn’t time the dodge of the grab properly. At least Bile Troll is guaranteed to die eventually if you don’t wipe.

But yes, Bile Troll is super annoying. His unblockable attacks have way too much range/too big of an arc for how little they are telegraphed. Passive regen should also probably just be gutted from his arsenal completely, or get the Waystalker treatment. :smile:

his regen is not that bad, but the unblockable hits are definitely ridiculous, especially combined with the puke.

1, the lag is not the bosses problem, so any wipe realted to that is the actual players problem.
2, the spawn at least stops when it wants to grab someone with its tentacle, which is enough for a dodge(the spawn is perfectly dodgeable).
The troll on the other hand runs at you with full speed and f@cks you with its hammer, and you can consider yourself lucky if you dont fall off the map(>.< Halescourge…)

You would be amazed how much it heals when suddenly you have only 2 ppl left alive and neither of them got high damage weapons.

Suddenly troll heals more than you hit him for with your puny sword and shield…

Most of the time I’d agree, but when a co-op only game makes one player’s lag significantly detrimental to multiple people at once, I blame that on game design as the result is alienation of laggy players lest the party as a whole run into X Content (in this case, the Chaos Spawn) which will make for an awful experience for everyone involved.

Unless…you know…you’re lagging.

  1. The game has clear performance requirements, and everyone has the option to optimize it to their own PC setup to get the best performace, and the same goes to the connection.(Lets be honest, everyone should do this before starting a coop/multiplayer game)

  2. Also, theres an option in matchmaking to set the search radius for matches(unsure if its the correct phrasing, but something along simiar lines), which can also help. You cant just blame it on the game design that someone lags, and it affects the current game. And if you know you are lagging then you shouldnt ruin others game, with joining up to QM, its simple as it is. Also you have the option to kick the lagging player (which might not be the kindest thing to do, i had one(!) laggy game in my 80 played hours, so sh.t happens, welcome to multiplayer games)

  3. And if you met the PC requirements, and your connection quality is also not potato, and your drivers are up to date(Nvidia released the new driver before the game release) and you are STILL experiencing lags with your settings set to optimal, THEN you can come to the forum and post it, that somethings wrong.
    And the devs will answer, you can check the latest replies,they respond to all technical issues, acknowledged stamps on every title like those, im sure that they literally working day and night to find, categorize and fix these problems.

Most of the time I’d agree, but when a co-op only game makes one player’s lag significantly detrimental to multiple people at once, I blame that on game design as the result is alienation of laggy players lest the party as a whole run into X Content (in this case, the Chaos Spawn) which will make for an awful experience for everyone involved.

^Also with your logic every multiplayer game is badly designed, since you can find lagging people everywhere.(LOL/HOTS/DOTA all other wc3 mod copy, someone lags from team thats probably a lost game, WoW: someone important lags on raid, etc.-> probably wipe. Are these badly designed games? No, the problem on individual level, unless server lag but thats another question…)

Yeah…I’m not gonna kick one of my good friends who happens to be screwed by Comcast. He’s a fantastic player all around but when the Chaos Spawn spawns, his presence effectively tanks the mission down the gutter. If that’s not a red flag for a game design issue, I don’t know what is.

Frankly I don’t know why Chaos Spawn even has to heal. It could still have its grab and be more formidable than Ogre even without the heal, and could take a slight (10-20%) buff to its HP to compensate if necessary.

The bile troll is fine except for one thing: taking a direct hit from the bile spit!
It’s too punishing.
A. you get slowed by 99%, take lots of damage, and lose your block shields;
B. watch helplessly as the bile troll runs up to you and punts you for 40% of your hp
C. teammates watch helplessly as you lose 70% of your hp in one sequence

A suggestion for Fatshark: Tone down the move slow and shield destruction thing. Let me dodge the overhead swing that I know is coming. Why do unblockable -70% of your hp sequenced attacks exist in this game?

But yeah, honestly chaos spawns are worse. I’ve seen alot more teammates die to them than to bile trolls.

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That is surprising. Is this in legend difficulty?

The only issue I’ve ever had with the Spawn is when you’re reduced to 1 person left standing, since the Spawn’s attack sequences are so relentless and give such little room to breathe in between. I’d agree the Spawn is hardest to solo, though not impossible.

However, as ridiculous as the bile is, it’s the passive regeneration that irks me most. At least when he spits on an ally, the others can use various abilities to stagger him so that the player sitting in a puddle isn’t punished quite so hard. Though the damage of the bile is still too high considering the CC it also has. The passive regen alone can heal faster than a lot of weapons can dish out, even at 600 hero power, especially considering the time you have to take to dodge bile and attacks.

Another issue with the passive regen is that once you’ve finally reduced him to below half health and a horde/wave of specials spawn that require immediate attention, the time it takes to deal with those threats is all the Troll needs to regen most, if not all of the damage dealt.

Again, I’m thinking of legend difficulty Trolls.

imo trolls die to concentrated group fire very easily, but if your party is divided and ineffective, it’s the worst boss to handle. they have massive animation delays where they just stand there doing nothing (if u dodge the bile spew, it’s free dps time, his strikes are slow - free dps time.)

my order of bosses from hardest to easiest:

  1. chaos spawn
  2. troll
  3. rakogri
  4. stormfiend

it really depends the terrain in which you are fighting, and whether your party is newbie enough to keep pushing up and aggroing enemies even when a boss roars out. lol

Every boss is completely crap by themselves. Their attacks are easily telegraphed and dodged or at least partially blocked.

But as difficulties increase the Bile Troll is clearly superior due to how strong is his vomit. While the Chaos Spawn has CC, his grab has a short range and he can also be staggered to cancel his ability.

Whomever gets caught in the bile artillery is essentially out of the game for the duration of the debuff. There’s nearly nothing to do but block and use blind skills.
Even if his team switches boss aggro, there’s still someone covered in bile and vulnerable/useless against hordes that’s also taking a lot of unblockable damage.

So. Ok, you must dodge the bile. Every bile when it’s raining hordes and specials.
Again, this bullshit troll while Ogre Rat does mostly nothing, Stormfiend is mostly good guy and Chaos Spawn is kited hard.

If anything the bile throwing should have a more limited usage/range/area or require a combo instead of being used as a starter.
The Bile Troll is also too tanky, there’s not much into vulnerabilities and even in his “downed” state he is actually harder to damage than other bosses. Even old OP huntsman had a harder time against him. There could be a vulnerable sequence where you would actually be rewarded for pumping damage instead of being punished for having to use up your ammo.

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Thing is even with concentrated fire the troll goes down so slowly, and instantly regens about a 4th of his hp when he goes into the downed regen phase, after which he takes no damage when you’re finished with the temp hp.
Because of this chances are you’ll get a special wave and/or horde before taking him down, forcing you to take care of that first, which in turn gives the troll time to regen more health.

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I said, that kick is an option, i wouldnt kick anyone either, friend or not, and that you shouldnt join up.(usually happens with one of my friends, sometimes for some weird reason his laptop gets really laggy, if he continued to play he needed to rejoin multiple times, and we also rather have him instead of a bot half of the game… no fun for either of us)
And the spawns healt regen at least dodgeable, while the troll just doesnt care and starts healing in its puke…

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