I used to think the bile troll’s passive regen was alright but Lately i find it pretty unfair . Let me give an example(based on true events) :
Alright so you have your team setup boss dps and all that jazz , but whoops your dps class has gone down and so has one of your other classes (who knows why ? lets assume one SV overhead took them by surprise)
You’re now left with a zealot flail and a bardin 2H hammer + a troll . with no chance of reviving your dps due to the boss wall .
Welcome to wipe city
At least other bosses can be kited for infinity amounts of time and be withered down slowly if need be . you can solo rakogri,spawns and fiends .
I had 2 friends who went up against a troll for a loong bout , they both wiped and ended the map with absurd amounts of boss damage , all because the troll would regen quicker than the 2 of them could dps with the classes they had . it doesn’t make sense !!
haha. i was having fun with sienna unchained with conflag staff just yesterday in legend, and we encountered a troll at the start of festering grounds. i kited it round and round and round the first drop down spot, my teammates kept dying getting hit by turnaround swipes or bile spews, they’d get picked up by teammates when i got back aggro, then they’d make the same mistake again.
we cleared the horde and multiple specials, took so long that a 3rd wave of specials took me out as sole survivor. if it was a bigger area i could kite him around his bile spews, but that wasn’t an option and he kept regaining hp.
i do like fighting trolls tho, they’re easy to hit, slow, and easily dodgable.
In the scenario you gave, your team clearly messed it up. From the point 2 of your team’s heavy hitting DPS went down, it was either a “team wipe and give up” or a “fight with big disadvantage” situation.
What’s exactly “not fair” or “doesn’t make sense” about that?
It’s like saying “when a wave starts in champ/legend and 2 of my team goes down, it’s too many mobs for the rest of us to handle – this is unfair, and doesn’t make sense.” … so does that mean the wave needs to be weakened so 2 people can handle it without any problems?
If you don’t want the troll to regen so often, stay alive. Simple solution, I think.
@kweassa Gets it. It was over when the two team mates dropped. I do wish they would get rid of bile/fire walls though. The Spawn of Chaos sprints so you can’t outrun him, have the troll do it too…But make it goofy looking, like arms flailing over its head. I would love to see that. Do it with the flame rat boss too, have him activate afterburners or something. Would be awesome!
Its not a matter of “giving up” what are you going on about ? Fighting a rat oger 1v1 zealot flail is a major disadvantage but can be done , now i kindly invite you to take a flail , get a mate with bardin hammer . record a clip of you and him killing a troll (on legend of course) . if you do it then i digress , if not well then youd understand .
Also just with your example , waves can be solo’d , EVERY other boss can be solo’d . Im not saying they SHOULD be solo’d im saying - even things out so if the need arises then you CAN solo clutch for the win
I don’t think the Troll’s (passive) regen is the thing at fault here. Even without the specialists, even when you have to do large chunk of the damage twice, the Troll goes down fast with a decent team. The trouble is, characters spawning beyond the force wall makes the Troll (and Stormfiend) disproportionately punishing to fight. I recognize the walls are probably supposed to stop you from just running past the boss, avoiding the fight. But when fallen characters respawn beyond it, it punishes also legitimately trying to fight the boss, and occasionally makes the fight (practically, at least) impossible to finish.
So my suggestion would be to leave the boss alone, and instead rework the respawning in the walled locations. Just getting to revive teammates is difficult enough, don’t prevent that completely. The latter feels just cheap.
Nobody forced you to take a flail, nor whether I can take down a boss alone or in a pair, with a flail-zealot, has any relevance to this issue. If I be honest, I probably cannot do it under those conditions…
…which means I am not that skilled enough to clear the boss, nor was my team skilled enough to stay alive and take it down without problems.
People make mistakes, and they fail. Part of playing games like these sort is accepting the limitations of you and your teams current level of skill – instead of asking for artificial crutches to rectify your mistakes for you, is it not?
What you are contending here, is basically the game be lowered in difficulty to compensate for your team’s lack of cooperation and/or skill. In harder difficulties, sometimes shi* happens, and sometimes that’s the end of it.
You just hope for better results the next time with a better team, and move on – instead of arguing the game’s unfair.
The problem isn’t that he’s super difficult and needs nerfing so that people can kill him easier. The problem is that he is so much more of a threat than the other 3 boss types. I have plenty of experience soloing all bosses successfully on Legend, and the troll is almost always a wipe, with any less than 3 players unless geared appropriately.
As mentioned above, it isn’t his killing power that is a threat, it’s his durability. Some weapons can’t even get through his passive regen. The amount of time it takes to bring him down often means you’ll need to deal with 7-8 specials and multiple hordes at the same time, which means eventually people will get whittled down and be removed from the fight because of the green wall.
Again, he isn’t too strong, he’s just not in line with the difficulty of the other bosses.
What he and the opening poster, are both saying, is that they don’t want their game to end even if their team obviously failed to display necessary skills to do so.
They keep mentioning how they can clear other bosses solo, but it’s irrelevant to the matter at hand. Other bosses are other bosses, the troll is the troll. They have different conditions and prerequisites to take down.
Other bosses hit harder, move faster, much more aggressive, but as a balance to that danger level, don’t have any major defensive mechanism like the troll. The conditions to take down other bosses is that at least one of the team members can hit-and-run well enough. Cool.
On the other hand, clearly the conditions for comfortably taking the troll down is different. It’s “people survive to deal enough DPS when needed” – as a balance to that, the troll is already slower and weaker and less aggressive in combat, and makes it easier for all team members to be alive to hit it.
It’s already fair and balanced. If the team failed to do so, then they failed a fair challenge.
Ok so then we can gather , invincibility doesn’t equate to difficult . my argument isn’t that he is hard but rather that the game ends when you’re a last man standing and he is around . I believe every situation in this game can be brought back , whether super dire or pretty meh . The fact that an instance exists thats impossible to push through with skill doesn’t make sense to me , thus i suggest some sort of change/rework. Again not arguing against his difficulty nor am i arguing about anything else in the game . now we’ve got people going on about how teams are not good enough and how solo boss fighting is as easy as “hit and run” .
fair enough. if you’re a skilled player playing a tank, you could whittle the boss down slowly while clearing adds and specials, but with a troll you’re pretty much screwed with bad dps. the only way to play is to try and move him out of his bile spew so he doesn’t regen as much.
I think the OP has a point; the problem with the passive regen is that every other enemy in the game is designed around the idea that your grasp of gameplay mechanics determines victory or defeat. That the troll can out-heal the damage of some characters means that sometimes you can be unable to win regardless of how you are playing - I think that is a bit off. Not the biggest problem in the game, but it is the only example of taking skill out of the equation.
Tuning respawn points could help, or just make it so the troll’s regen doesn’t start for x number of seconds after it has been damaged. This does mean players would have to treat it differently and work around this, but it also means that player skill would ultimately be the determining factor.
Except, there IS a clear equation to it, as with any other boss – “Have enough people stay alive to out-damage the regen rate.” Therefore the “skill” factor in this case, is simply – “sufficient number of team members stay alive to deal enough damage.”
Therefore, the very situation this whole thread started with – “I’m alone and I can’t kill the troll well enough” – already presupposes that the team lacked the required skill to clear the boss.
The team lacked enough skill, so the team fails the mission. Absolutely nothing “unfair” about that. If the troll wasn’t all that hard and not too difficult, then why aren’t enough of his team alive in the first place?
I liked the idea of adding fire vulnerability to trolls (lore backed ) as it is unarmored and quite fleshy. Maybe either a fire-damage boost against it or if its taken fire dmg within 5 sec, its healing is cut in half or something?
On a side note: If a bile troll stands in its vomit it heals? o.O
