Are Arbites OP or Not?

I think that the overpowered feeling of the arbites is in part a consequence of their talent tree being so open and non-restrictive. It kind of allows you to be good at almost everything, without much sacrifice. Don’t get me wrong - I think the zealot tree is too restrictive, allows for too little experimentation or hybrid builds, and has a lot of skills/tax nodes that are kind of useless. I still prefer a talent tree that is too flexible to one that is too restrictive, but this is the consequence - it can make the class too good at everything. There has got to be some kind of happy medium - I like feeling like I have committed in the talent tree, at least to some extent, and had to make real sacrifices for the power that my character has. In a way, player agency is reduced if you can just have everything.

One suggestion I can offer is that the dog shouldn’t be able to kill multiple specials quickly, or save you from poxhounds or mutants, without specific and costly talent investment that requires you to sacrifice power elsewhere. Right now, the dog does that pretty much at baseline.

There are a few areas where Arbites is slightly overtuned, but honestly, it’s not as bad as I initially thought. I don’t think it’s as simple as comparing Arbites to base classes with outdated designs. I’d rather see the older classes improved, so their talent trees offer more compelling and impactful choices with less tax nodes.

That’s gonna be a subject for a video very soon, am i right ?

Didn’t finished to lvl up to 30 and going in Auric/Havoc yet but my real problem i’m seeing so far isn’t the fact Arbites might be OP but the Vet can be very lackluster on the other hand now … Outside of VoC/Plasma/Duelling Sword of course.

Sad when that class was the strongest at launch ! The ammo nerf with the survival aura might have been too much for that class. they should have keep it as a passive for Vet like he is now and have an upgraded and shared version with the aura.

They can get out of jail without the crutch of going invisible, so yes, incredibly satisfying!

well plas / dueling sword just got nerfed

Where at and how so? link?

or sorry, are getting nerfed. Its one of the devblogs where they talk about changes they want to make to both weapons, the plasma one for example talked about how they felt the weapon was too front loaded into basic shots and that the charged variety was widely ignored and they felt like adjusting that. Dueling sword, similar commentary about how they wanted to increase the skill cap required to use the weapon.

In anycase both changes would effect Vet substantially since both were used as a crutch to prop up the careers otherwise lackluster performance outside of shout.

i’ll try to find the link.

Thanks, i didn’t see it in the hotfix and all the clammer for the nerfs was before Arbitrator release.

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thanks bud.

pretty much my sentiment.

also havoc can go die in a ditch as far as i’m concerned, if auric becomes new sedition due to powercreep (it’s already heresy imo) then i will simply stop playing rather than delve into weaves 0.5

havoc doesn’t feel like darktide to me and i’ll die on that hill

To be a minor contrarian, Yes*

They are stat sticks through and through, made to have obscene levels of numbers in comparison to their contemporaries and basically every ‘best in class easy to proc talent’ under the sun. Damage for hits, damage for dodges, DR for existing and your dog existing, and said dog killing specials for you and your team while weakening/stunning larger targets. That, or Lone Wolf + Shock mine = smite but I can still play the game, and you just walk through most things.

But all that being said, a lot of their ‘brokenness’ is just in numbers, their effects are ‘somewhat lack luster’, also on account of their ‘Ogryn size’ weapon pool. But unlike Ogryn, who’s entire weapon pool is new weapons to play with and use, Arbite has the 4 they come with, and then a Boltgun, and a bunch of ‘impact’ weapons that are still very heavily ignorable. This combined with their middle ability and keystone/talents leading to said keystone being incredibly forgettable and not that great, result in a class that both ‘plays the game for you’ and is insanely broken. But also feels weaker than say, an Ogryn, who does everything they do but strictly better but just has a weakness to trappers, or a well speced Veteran, who will be vastly more squishy but drop a Monstrosity in 1 clip of their bolt/Plasma gun. Or a Psyker, who again is way more squishy but will trip over and entire wave from range and cackle while doing it. Or even a Zealot, who’s to busy sprinting forward and doing high damage per hit while swinging twice as fast and being just as immortal, even if they don’t have the dog backing them up.

In general, the Arbite numerically is overstated to the warp and back, making the game feel like a cake walk and overall allowing you to basically never fall over. But on the flip side, that is all you are doing, and you aren’t really doing anything impactful for your team beyond being a stat stick and either stunning entire waves with a trip mine or killing high priority targets for free with your dog. They feel very ‘whelming’, while also being immortal and technically killing everything in front of them, it’s a strange dichotomy they sit with, likely attributed to a major part of their design space being ‘staggers’, which the Ogryn also does strictly better while bleeding everything to death, and with a better feeling weapon selection than the Arbites have access to.

So are they OP? Yes, do they feel OP? Kinda, their floor is lower than even Ogryns, but their ceiling also feels just as high as your floor. You don’t really get a sense of ‘being broken’, because unlike other classes, ‘being good’ doesn’t really translate to anything tangibly visible. You will be just as broken when you load up the Arbite for the first time as when you maxed them out at level 30 with a good set of gear, the only difference will be the damage numbers, so it feels kinda ‘meh’, at least for me. Says a lot that my friend played Damnation then Auric at level 6 (you can drag your friends to higher difficulties so long as you yourself have access to it and select it, or vise versa), and he never died. It might not be in the most dense state, but that’s still pretty obscene.

Current state of havoc, you decide for yourself.

Hot take: that’s just because no one plays havoc. That SS a week ago would of just been a bunch of 1 man lobbies.

that’s the best way to put all the ‘underperforming’ or whatever into words, i applaud you

They are not infallible, the moment of getting cornered is the weakness I’ve experienced

The really OP thing about Arbites is the insane DR/TDR on both Castigate and the Boombox, with an absolutely mind-boggling CDR talents.

They are easy to do dmg with on the lower levels but pretty much fall in line with everyone else at H40.

A lot of people exploit the Boltpistol bleed bug so, grain of salt etc etc

It was something they initially left on the Chinese version of the June patch note preview:

It’s a new class and many people are probably grinding penances, what do you expect?

Since Fatshark doubled-down on Havoc, the class is balanced around Havoc, same as the reworked Ogryn. I don’t like it either, but it is what it is and I hope Zealot/Veteral get the same reworks. The only trully overpeforming thing is toughness generation on light attack spam (same as Ogryn), but even then, it only becomes really noticeable when your team sucks, so the real reason for this nerf would be that it promotes anti-teamplay builds.

Other than that and the solo maul, the “OP” hysteria is very overblown and IMO whining elitists are even worse then the nerf complaining crowd. Some of the takes about the Arbitrator are so braindead (not having tax nodes is now a bad thing apparently) or just straight up Sedition-tier complaining that the dog is OP because it can disable one Elite/Special at a time. LMAO.