Because malice is too easy and is doable even with bad players doing dumb things. This in turn ingrains shitty habits that don’t fly in heresy. So when people try to pull the same dumb moves they get their sht pushed in. Rightly so I must say.
Heresy is basically a common sense filter and I’m tired of pretending it’s not.
That’s not the problem. The problem is about enjoying the game. I cannot continue to play malice… that’s boring. But in heresy, I clearly need pratice. But if I practice, I ruin the game of others.
That’s why I think that there should be an intermediate level. I don’t ask to lower heresy difficulty.
My brother in the emperor’s light if people can’t carry a single guy on heresy they deserve to fail that’s not on you.
Just throw yourself at it until it clicks. 3-4 games and you should be good.
I had a similar problem with Vermintide at some point, champion was a walk in the garden and legend was 70% loss. But at least reward for a legend game was quite noticiable with the hight chance to drop a red weapon. I expect to have the same mooment of hesitation with heresy but the game mecanisme (melk and plasteel/diamantine) really reward playing low difficulty instead of trying to get better.
It’s pretty simple just jump right in and ruin some games.
It’s OK I lost tons of games when I jumped up to heresy.
Thing was I screwed up a ton but so did everyone else.
I saw stuff like knife zealots rushing objectives just to get shot to pieces and people just trading hits in melee and dying before getting to the med or sharpshooters just standing around with 0 backstab melee awareness and clubbed down over time.
We all bad till we getgud it’s not just you.
I got eaten by a pox hound and 2 trappers caught my team and fired bombed then failed or the time I got thrown by the same mutant 10 times in a row because I got caught with out my team and couldn’t time my dodges.
Sounds to me like Malice players should spend more time in the high engagement Malice missions before moving up to Heresy. That’s about as good a middle ground as I can think.
Bro I had a game yesterday in Malice, low-intensity malice, no less, where a L30 vet had a cry about picking up grims. Apparently picking up grims is bad because it means we can’t use medkits.
Malice is hard for some people.
I am legitimately having more success getting people to pick up grims in Heresy now.
I don’t mind carrying people who are getting used to new difficulties, I’d prefer that than someone asking to sit out 90% of the mission due to working on a penance. One way to practice in Malice is try your hardest not to take any hits. Practice your dodging, blocking and staggering. A lot of the higher difficulties is killing the enemy while taking minimal hits yourself.
such missions are easy… sorry. High engagement is just a joke on malice.
And the gap between that and Heresy difficulty is still the same.
You cannot compare the hordes of malice, even with high intensity, and the constant pressure of the heresy difficulty.
What we would need is an intermediate difficulty with enemies that have more HP and does better damage (like something clearly at middle of Malice and Heresy) and constant pressure like in heresy but without the wound removed.
I tried today an heresy… verdict is… I have to progress. We had someone with a zealot critic template and he rushed during the entire map. I have fallen 6 times and died 2. But he has revived / liberated all of us several times. We were clearly just passengers.
Play more heresy and after a while you’ll look back on this statement and laugh.
Heresy really isn’t as difficult as people are making it out to be. All you need to do is stay on your toes for the first 4-5 runs. Let someone else take the lead while you get used to things. After that you’ll be just fine there.
I recently coached a group through high intensity heresy assassination with grims. One of the guys wanted to carry grims despite going down in the first horde. He and the other guys refused to listen until all 3 were dead right after the drop before the boss elevator.
After I got them all up they finally listened to basic sht like “focus the trash first while one guy kites the boss” and the boss was a walk in the park.
Ok. I would like to thank all people that have take time to give me advices. I have taken them in consideration and practiced. I play now on heresy and do not die every times. I have acquiered reflexes and begin to fight really better.
I continue to think an intermediate level would be great. But now, I have jumped on the other side.
Thanks all.
So the jump to heresy felt relatively steep at first, but quickly leveled off. I do have Vermintide experience though. I’m just guessing here since I didn’t hit any kind of roadblock or stone wall with Heresy, but it might be a combo of things.
Things to keep in mind: The game doesn’t actually teach players good dodge timing, combo mechanics, slide attacking, timing etc. There’s certainly an argument to be made that the game shouldn’t teach you, there are plenty of games where the finer mechanics need to be figured out. (Souls genre is basically this concept entirely).
In heresy it’s not just that enemy HP, damage and numbers go up - but timings are shortened considerably. You have a lot less time to react. In a situation on malice where you could power up your weapon, or have time to bring out your clunky 2 sec prep ranged etc safely, will get you damaged in heresy. More likely than not, it’s the timing change that some people might find makes it a lot harder. And, of course, probably that ranged trash starts to really become a serious threat. It’s not quite the same game anymore. I bet people can fumble through Malice in most public groups without really knowing the finer points of dodge and combo timing, or having intricate knowledge of blessing/talent combos etc.
I don’t know. Not sure I have a solution. It does feel like the steepest climb in difficulty, but it’s certainly nowhere near insurmountable. I think it might just be the first difficulty where you actually have to have learned all the things the game doesn’t explicitly tell you about.
I’m currently at this wall where I also find Malice really easy, and I have played on heresy on low intensity and succeeded but have failed multiple runs on Hersey on normal intensity. I’m not sure what to do, because I don’t have many choices to change my gear because of how little resources you get.
My transcendent gear isn’t too bad, but I don’t know if I’m failing because my gear actually has poor damage output and I’m not clear on that, or just not being good enough at not taking damage. In particular, the ranged enemies management is really frustrating and a major difference between V2 and this game. It makes the specials much more deadly and much more frustrating.
One sniper has taken out my whole team multiple times. Sure, there is a beam, but many times you can’t tag them because you don’t actually have line of sight on the model. I can’t see them on certain maps at all.
Not sure what to do, just play high intensity malice when it’s up? I want to have fun with the game and keep progressing and I feel like I’m at a dead stop. Doesn’t really motivate me.
What class, what weapons? The game has some real stinkers.
It was told in this thread, and it is true. Best to do is to continue.
I changed my behaviour between malice to heresy. Now, I have learnt to dodge. Before I was also doing it, but 80% of the times I was not thinking about. Now I dodge really more.
Also, stay with your team. Every times I have been part of a failed mission, we had not played as a team…
Last time, we progressed so well. Not really any problem. We were so confident that we’ve splitted… and died 2 minutes after when 2 hordes, 1 in front, 1 from behind, came with a nurgle beast and several specials.
I don’t know your gear, but there are weapons more effectives than others. It doesn’t mean that there is bad weapons. I’ve seen someone with a recon lasgun mk2 that was really effective, and this rifle has not even good damages…
For my zealot, I switched from my dream bolter (a real good bolter) to a bad braced autogun. But autogun is more effective with my gameplay. I try to find a better braced gun but until that I keep this one that has good damage output but important spray… who care ? I am always at close range or I can use bullet by bullet mode that is precise (took the one more precise).
I keep doing mistakes, but I learn from them.
Actually I had to do the same with my veteran and it was difficult.
Worst is my psyker. Someone asked me if it was my first game in heresy… it was not, but it was with a psyker. An absolute nightmare…
In summary, the advices are:
I feel the difficulties are fine, but the rewards need to be adjusted - also for the secondary objectives as well.
If we could convert diamantine to plasteel at a 1:1 ratio I’d feel properly rewarded by damnation.
Credit to Fatshark when it’s due, I honestly really appreciate the low horde modifier. It’s a great way to ease into learning a higher difficulty
Yeah, its a good idea, its just such a shame that the mission select mechanics are so restrictive.