Vermintide 2 Survey in the launcher - This is great!

This is called dispassionate ridicule.

Most games had you doing normal damage otherwise and great damage when you exploit mechanics. The only exception is hidden weakpoint bosses which are so consistently unfavored that they don’t bother making them anymore.

Well, let’s take Nioh since that’s topical now that the second beta is almost over right? Enemies at neutral? Normal damage. Decent kill speed. Enemies out of ki/stamina? Extra damage, faster kill time. But see stronger enemies with mechanics necessary to topple foes through exploitation don’t mesh well in a horde game where every enemy has to be toppled. Which is why staggers been retuned multiple time since it’s flawed inclusion.

At any point, no point bemoaning it now. It’s here to stay

3 Likes

Well FS must tweak it to work much more intuitively (only one stagger lvl) or remove it, otherwise the fanbase will not be there to stay.

3 Likes

What these gents already said.

I already filled out feedback during the WoM beta and wrote a lot of feedback here on the forums, many of my core complaints are still valid. As much as I’d like to think doing this new survey will make a difference, experience indicates otherwise.

As a result I don’t really want to spend the time filling out the new survey, it’s superfluous. They got the feedback they needed, they chose to ignore the majority and stuck to their guns. Fine, their choice.

You’re not wrong, but why are they being reintroduced all the time? Bugs that disappeared from VT2 returned with a vengeance initially in WoM, and many new ones were introduced too. Certainly, reception would have been a lot less negative without all those bugs, but many people were unhappy with the actual underlying design changes too.

I’m already dreading the bugs that’ll be released with the next update when in reality that should be the least of my concerns as a player. And no, I don’t expect entirely bug-free updates, many bugs even get a laugh out of me, but WoM felt completely unfinished at first, it reminded me of early launch. And at launch I mostly-ignored the bug annoyances as I loved VT2’s underlying gameplay, having it end up back in that state again however.

I genuinely feel sorry for Hedge and Julia having to deal with all the backlash.

I don’t doubt the data they got is good, but that doesn’t automatically mean FS makes the best decisions based on that data. It’s quite easy to draw bad conclusions from good data, especially when things like cause/effect get mixed up, or FS’s case, I get the impression they don’t understand a lot of the appeal of base VT2, else WoM wouldn’t have given us: scripted, non-random weaves, more grind, useless talents (don’t get me wrong, I liked the WoM talent tweaks overall, but a number still stand out as useless), and the changes to combat.

For reference (from SteamCharts, which takes the data provided by the Statistics page on the Steam store):


Unless you have any better data.

You need to take a look in the mirror and realise it is you who is in denial, not us. But I guess that’s why you leveled the accusation we’re afraid the majority don’t concur, projection.

If you liked WoM great, but don’t pretend the majority did.

If you, FS or anyone else can point to actual evidence the majority like where WoM went (despite feedback, reviews and, more importantly, dwindling player numbers) I’ll concede I was wrong, but you can’t can you?

At this point, in my eyes, VT2 hinges upon S2 to provide longevity to the game. I’d be content with just getting way less new bugs, having weaker talents looked at/reworked, gradually getting new weapons/enemy variants over time and (most importantly) new maps. Hell, being an avid PvPer too, I actually want versus, but first FS need to get the actual PvE Vermintide back in order.

14 Likes

It is kind of a mess thrown together before closing time on Friday, to be honest.

It’s the same survey from the Beta.

I copy-pasted my ‘final thoughts’ from the survey, as it summarizes all the shortcomings (and i’m really tired, wanted to get this out before it might get updated today):

‘Did we miss something?’

Quite a bit. This is only about the survey itself.

You should really update the whole survey from Beta feedback to Season 1 feedback when doing it, not the headline and deleting some questions (see question: ‘Please explain why you did/did not enjoy these winds?’ on page 2, it does not relate to anything and i remember it doing that while doing the Beta survey).

As said before, you deleted some questions, and made this survey a page shorter, but forgot to update the numbers on the subheading. It goes from ‘2/6 - Weaves’ on page 2 to ‘4/6 - Difficulty’ and skipping the 3/6 (was it Beastmen?).

All the sub-subheadings are not updated:
Page 3:
‘We have tweaked all our difficulties while adding a new tier, Cataclysm. We would like to ask a few questions on your experience on these difficulties’
It refers to the ‘new’ difficulty and should be updated to ‘experience of all difficulties during season 1’.
Page 4:
‘We have a basic implementation of what we will have for when we go live, we would like to get a better understanding of your experience with matchmaking during the beta’
All kinds of wrong.
Page 5:
‘Thank you, we are almost done. We just want to ask you a few question about your general experience with the Winds of Magic Pre-Release-Beta.’
Not anymore, it’s after season 1 now.
Page 6:
‘Any other thoughts or feedback you’d like to pass along about the beta?’
The same as the last one.

The link is directly from the launcher, from your product, to this survey, which itself was made internally in your studio.
Please, a bit more effort next time, ok? If you are not sure about it, don’t release it right before closing time on friday, do it on monday.

4 Likes

imagine having a monopoly on a niche genre with a massive fan-base and throwing it all away

8 Likes

i know u point out and quote in what sorrow place this game is, but this line hit me

most of us did not know some bugs, most of them are from vt1(copy&pasta code), most of the bugs for new players are not bugs but feature, same apply for old&vet players.
we did ignore most of the bugs, we(me) did enjoy the game, but then it happen the update! of 20gig after what it was 1 week or 1 month? idk i dont want to search for that information im sure u all can find that. so what did that update? ofc some fix here and there but most of bugs or i should say feature stay in game amazing!
so that update was a clear reminder or wake up call in what condition this game released
EA? no, beta? no, more like alpha 0.1
and then the question is how long are u going to ignore bugs that needs fix it?

2 Likes

some of my friends who dont own the winds dlc said they did not get a survey button attached to their launcher. if this is true then the devs are not getting the full picture of the overall feedback for winds.

imo, there should have been 2 separate surveys. one for the dlc owners and one who didnt buy or refunded winds. this way the players could explain why they chose to not purchase it or to explain why they refunded it in the first place. that would give a much clearer picture of what is really wrong.

2 Likes

Then again, how much clearer does it have to be? Anyone who has a pair of eyes can see all the major problems by now…

2 Likes

Don’t have WoM but the survey appeared.

1 Like

i can think of a couple of reasons why people left than the game crashing. besides the game crashing randomly. i personally think they broke their core base game mechanics which is what made the game fun.

they nerfed dodge
nerfed cleave damage
altered some of the heros talents, sure some needed a fix but some of them didn’t

bring back the old mechanics, I can probably assure you that people will have fun again.

no one likes a slog fest. or be backed into a corner to just wipe out a wave of enemies.
you want to be able to kit and move around them.

half the weapons aren’t even being used because of that.

3 Likes

This sums it up perfectly. Legend is overall significantly harder than it was before. But unfortunately not in fun way :crying_cat_face:

Lately I can’t even tolerate it because of all the bugs plus literally new bugs appearing. (Yesterday I noticed, holy sh*t I can’t use shoult on Merc now, during attack animations… it kinda broke me, when I switched weapon and noticed that it’s not just Executioner)

First the ult is not doing crap to enemies (literally for months, beginning with WOM beta), they just laugh at you, then when it seems like it might be fixed, you just can’t shout at all when you need it… awesome.

7 Likes

Copy pasting in literally the same survey. Woaw, big work, deserving of much praise.

6 Likes

oh, well thats good! i’ll talk to my friends again and see if its there for them. they hadnt played in a while, maybe they didnt get update.

1 Like

In fairness, if the goal were to see if people still feel as strongly negative now as they did back then, it makes some sense to keep the same set of questions. If they asked the questions in a different way, then it would be harder for them to determine whether a change in answers was due to a change in how people actually feel about the game, or if the change in answers is just because the questions were framed differently the second time they were asked.

Though I do think it’s more likely that someone just did a lazy copy-paste job & nobody really cares all that much what the data shows anyway.

3 Likes

I think the questuon that needs to be asked is “Do you refer pre WoM or Post” ‘please list the top 5 reasons you feel this way’.

This game was better pre WoM and I don’t know if it is mechanical or the bugs but its just not as fun. It’s like adding a new addition to my motorcycle only to have it handle worse and backfire occasionally and not be able to tell if when that’s not happening is it better than before.

The questions are too generic and they don’t seem to approach the core of the concerns at least from my point of view.

6 Likes

I agree. I have some thoughts about why this is. Give this a read and see what you think. I went back to 1.7 for a week. Here's what I learned

3 Likes

Copy pasting in literally the same post. Woaw, big work, deserving of much praise.

I’m kind of confused why they would need another survey. I’ve filled out a few already and if you don’t know what players did or didn’t like about WoM at this point I don’t know what a new shorter survey is going to say. The stuff I wanted sounds like is coming in the next content updates.

Balance beastmen, correct bugs and leave weaves to rot. Then give me new missions maybe some extra (balanced) beastmen units and another lord!

1 Like

It is a solid position but I think there is still the fact that non beastment levels are a laugh and beastmen levels are a trudge and that the direction of development is clearly going somewhere this game was never designed to be, i.e. MMO / Leaderboard eSport / Grind-Loot-Repeat Sim. None of those fit what I thought Vermintide was or should be.

It feels like a confusion of direction. They want ‘something’ they’re aiming for ‘something’ but its not there, its not tangible and thus the result is muddied. They keep back peddling on changes in an attempt to give us the experience we want but it doesn’t resolve issues it muddies the outcome to be both worse than what we had and somewhat less concise than what had been provided with the update. I mean what does stagger even do now, give them an excuse for insane hyper density and some poor optioned perks.

And yeah that FPS issue, which causes insane client side mob behaviours.

3 Likes

This topic was automatically closed 7 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.