I’m firmly in the camp of disliking the combat changes, but there have been several stating that they like it, a few that it is easier, and a small portion being reasonable about it.
For those who are having fun with this, I have a simple question: How are you doing it? What weapons do you use? What Jewelry properties are important now? Are you in premades? What difficulty are you on? Basically, how do you play this game and find Combat 2.0 enjoyable?
I’d prefer to keep discussion on the pros/cons of Combat 2.0 out of here, many other people have very well spoken posts about the topic already. I simply want to learn about playstyles. I’ve tried 4 heroes and the only thing I’ve learned from Legend QP is that if you want a reliable shot at winning Bring a Flamethrower, or two. Working around Combat 2.0 as much as you can with ranged seems the best approach, for those who have a different experience please share.
I describe my Unchained build is another post here:
It’s used in mostly Legend and Cataclysm.
RV Bardin I go 3-1-1-2-1-3. A support based build using Dual Hammers and Throwing Axes. The idea with this one is Throwing Axes are easy to run out of quickly to get the 25% power bonus for the staggering Dual Hammers. Requires some good blocking/dodging timing on occasion, but works out if the rest of the team sticks together.
It’s not really the builds that make the style, though. I make the builds out of the desire to help the team benefit rather than go on my own rampage. If the solo style of play takes over my builds tend to fall apart.
For cata games, increased block cost reduction, increased stamina regen and block/push angle as standard on most characters. Increased dodge range is also mandatory if available on career. Natural bond is now useless and obsolete.
Am not finding ranged classes like waystalker very easy to use, lacks survivability and melee big time. No th talents, usually run proxy healing + hand of shalliya to spot heal and quickly clear teammate wounds if downed.
I use HM with Gift even though the dash is bugged still useful to get out of situations and clutch dash games with decanter. This can help quickly clear ground and force a win like the end of Empire in flames or Against the Grain, both wins forced because I dashed to the end game and fled combat rather than risked the game.
The builds I use now are at least as varied as they were before. The balance changes and the new Talents have given way to a few completely new setups, and most of the old ones are still quite applicable, if maybe needing some adjustment. I change characters, Careers and setups a lot, so while there are a couple of “fallback” builds that I know I can do well, there’s none that I really use constantly.
While I recognise the importance of breakpoints in at least some builds and weapon setups, I’ve mostly stopped caring about them quite a while ago. With the amount of switching around I do there’s just too much to remember - and there’s a lot more now. So the breakpoints I’ve pretty much given up on. Instead, I tend to go for Crit Chance/Attack speed on my weapons, though I haven’t really rerolled anything. Power vs. Properties still find use, too, but it’s more based on my gut feeling now.
I’m still in the process of testing things out, too, so there are no new favourite builds, but I’ve avoided running healshare until I really get used to the changes - and Beastmen. on some setups, Barkskin could find more use for me now, but I haven’t gotten to testing it yet.
I might figure out something more if I checked around in the game, but right now I’m too tired for that, so I’ll leave things at this relatively general state.
I won’t say I like 2.0, but I’m adapting. The big problem is that QP has no team composition so I have to be sure I bring something that can work in all situations, because odds are the team won’t have something vital, and that’s really limiting compared to before.
I’m going for builds that put out a lot of sustained damage. AKA cheese builds. Any kind of ‘normal’ build or role filling build just takes too long to clear out the meat wall. Waystalker is dead now, and RV is ok but just can’t keep up with the meat wall. Everything Sienna is golden, and any weapon that has good cleave is top tier.
The ones I’ve found successful so far:
-IB or Pyro with Flamer
-BW with Volcanic Fireball or Lingering Conflag
-2h Slayer (Hammer+Pick) is an absolute blender
-HM with Glaive is pretty much BIS for a Kerillian now
Yep WS Kerillian is dead meat. Cannot make work of a meat wall of death, if she runs out of room shes still a liability, its not team priority to guard ranged 24/7. HM elf is pretty much standard higher than legend, or some extremely impressive Shade work. With the necessity of melee ability to counter hordes especially beastmen makes careers like WS Elf almost impossible to play. Shade can be played and is still viable as a boss counter (am thinking of Cataclysm righteous stand…) but performance needs to be impressive to say the least. Meaning blowing through multiple hordes without taking damage, easier said than done.
Mercenary 2-1-1-1-1-3 with Spear (Exec sword is still great too) and Repeater or Blunderbuss.
Huntsman 1-3-3-2-3-1 with Spear/Exec and Repeater/Bow.
Ranger Vet 1-1-1-3-2-X with Dual hammers or 2h hammer/axe and Throwing axes.
Slayer’s build for me varies heavily depending on the weapons I pick (Pickaxe, 2h hammer/axe, dual axes, throwing axes, dual hammer even sometimes).
I don’t really play Elf but all her careers are still strong, Shade is still a blatant easy mode.
WHC 1-2-2-2-1-2 with Falcaxe/Billhook/Rapier and BoP/Xbow.
BH 1-1-2-3-X-X with Falcaxe/Billhook and Xbow.
Zealot 2-1-1-2-1/2-2 with just about any melee and BoP.
BW 1-3-1-2-3-3 with Fire sword/Flail and Conflag + other builds that vary heavily cuz weapons.
Pyro 2-2-2-3-2-3 with 1h Sword/Crowbill and whichever staff you prefer.
UC 1-1-1-2-1-2/3 with Fire sword/Flail and any staff you like, Beam is nice for getting OC’d quickly.
There’s way more stuff I do/could use or that I have yet to test but these are just some examples of what I’ve used so far since the update and all of it worked very well on Cata. Literally anything works on Legend as long as you get the basics right - positioning, pacing, crowd control.
Properties and traits are down to your preference, your team composition and the content you’re clearing.
For the most part I’d go with:
Melee: Chaos/atk speed + crit + SS/Parry. Ranged: test breakpoints (at least for specials), ammo sustain if you think you need it, Barrage for boss damage or hitting a 2-3 shot breakpoint on some elite/special. Hunter on BH for me. Necklace: Health and BCR/Stamina (defensive/offensive). Boon/Barkskin. Charm: Mostly Chaos + Armor + Decanter/Proxy. Atk speed if you need more, Crit.pow for few builds. Trinket: Crit + Curse + Shrapnel. Crit is too good to replace in most cases but replace Curse with whatever makes the most sense for your build if you’re not taking Grims on Cata. I tend to not even take Curse resist anymore for Legend with Grims.
Some of the stuff I managed to make work has been named already, but a build that I’ve also had succes on Cata with: Shield Wielding Ironbreaker.
Shield + Axe (Because I like it better than Shield + Hammer but that might well also work) with Block Cost Reduction & Attack speed, Off Balace
Ranged weapon whatever you like. Flamethrower if you can rely on teammates, shotgun, drakefire pistols, handgun, crossbow; all valid choices.
Neck with Block Cost Reduction & Health, Nat Bond / Barkskin / Boon.
Attack Speed & Power vs. Chaos
Stamina Regen & Revive Speed
Hit Points on Stagger
Power bonus for near teammates
Enhanced Power or Bulwark
Stamina Regen on Power Attack
More radius and duration on Ult
Playstyle: Fight hordes, control the battlefield, bash and push to make space for your team where needed so you keep everybody together, and always have a plan to save your teammates from being overwhelmed / disabled with your ult / block cost reduction / revive speed.
Pros: You are often the last man standing, and capable of some impressive clutches / revives. You can amplify your teammates effectiveness a lot, making the run easier and shitty situations survivable for them. Cons: This setup only works as long as you have capable teammates, that know how to benefit from you. This class is a lot less useful in quickplays or on its own.
I fully admit I am not the best Vermintide player, probably even on the low end of skill for people that play Cata. I’m not very good with glass cannon or special deletion classes at all. No matter which character I play, I usually go for Frontliner loadouts. With this setup, you have to have an entirely different mindset than with almost any other class. You have to have really good situational awareness, and it actually requires a proactive playstyle where you have to recognise a dangerous situation before it fully develops and do something about it. Playing this class is like playing a completely different game, and it would never have worked before 2.0 either. If you do your job well, a lot of what you did isn’t easily noticeable for your teammates, but they will have the feeling the run was somehow easier than normal…
After the Beta? week before 2.0 released I decided not to buy WoM, so I won’t be playing in Cata. I perhaps should have mentioned my experience will be limited to Legend. I will test out how good Stamina Recovery and BCR are now, but my killing time is already half what it was, perhaps survivabilty will compensate. Thank you all for posting.