Some elf feedback

Hello!

So i have tested a few elf weapons weapons in detail, and i will write down my thoughts on them.

Hagbane bow.

Post nerfs this weapon just feels awful, a straight bodyshot sometimes fails to kill a rootblood mob, not the skinny ones but the beefier ones, and the cloud is also extremely unreliable in how many targets it hits.

It’s weapon traits also seem bugged, as in it not refunding ammo on headshots or crits, and its headshot also does not damage Chaos warriors despite all other ranged weapons doing so.

Wardancer blade-

Hard to describe but it feels “light”, doesnt seem to do much damage and it only hits a few targets which given its comparatively short range (vs the spear) makes it rather awful, it doesnt manage hordes, shields, multiple enemies or even bosses well.

1 hand sword

Short reach, hits few targets and seems awfully specialized against armor with all the overhand attacks…but glaive exists and does the same job much better.

2 handed swords

Feels slow, decent reach, weak against everything that isnt a slaverat.

Sword and dagger

Short reach but is better at dealing with mixed opponents thanks to the…well mixed attacks, speed is good but the weapon set falls short generally anyhow since you always end up with a lot of enemies whenever you enter melee.

Dual daggers.

Short reach, very fast,good heavy attacks, great against armor and shields, hits only one or two at the time…weapon is generally not good at all, its not like you are dealing only with stormvermin and even if you did its terrible when facing more than one.

Glaive.

Excellent anti armor and great damage, reach is decent and is hands down the best weapon against armor the elf has, struggles against hordes but might be alright as a niche choice.

Spear.

Godly weapon, has great reach, easy headshot damage, mobilty, block, single and aoe damage, great heavy attacks making it versatile and almost the perfect all rounder even if the damage is a lot lower than say glaive or dual daggers.

Only struggles with stormvermin shields…thats the only thing i can think off.

Longbow.

Does its job but feels like it should hurt on headshots more, hit a chaos warrior 6-8 times in the face without a crit and he took it without a problem…

Shortbow.

No complaints.

As for the specializations.

Waystalker seems more balanced post nerfs, but i think her F seems a bit bugged at times, you can shoot it into a horde and it sometimes hits like 3 targets before bugging out and gets stuck midair before either vanishing or moving and hitting something a bit later.

Handmaiden, this spec still has talents that seem very useless but the specialization now works well just because of the bleed on the dash, would be nice if said dash was a bit more impressive against armor though, even if only knocking them down.

Shade, sounds nice…does not work.

Needs to flank enemies who cant be flanked, F kills one chaos warrior if backstabbing from behind while Sienna does the same from a mile away at a headshot…salty bounty too.

Gets stuck mid-horde and dies instantly most of the time, there is 0 merit at all in picking this.

I think you ought to wait a few days before giving weapons feedback, the damage, stagger and cleave values of all weapons are inflated, and a patch is on the way.

Regarding Longbow, it takes a lot of shots to kill a chaos warrior not because of headshot damage (it has excellent headshot modifier), but because it doesn’t have enough armor penetration.

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I agree with most points, but I feel some are being neglected, others are personal preference.

You forgot the hagbane dps vs non armor bosses and its horde clearing with charged shots (cloud is preeetty big). Yes it might be underperforming, but it does 2 things pretty well.

Glaive still has the block push attack bug, which results in a even weaker wave control.

Repeater crossbow of shade seems okay i guess?

The spear is a sneaky one. With the move set and pointy tip, you’d think it would be great against some armored targets. However, the basic stab on the body does 0 damage and on the head it does slightly above 0. The power attacks have a sweep and stab so it’s not terribly reliable for pumping out damage against armor with those either.

With the huge block/push angle and mobility, you’d think it’s a horde clearing weapon, but it has an awful lot of stabs in the move set. Ultimately, it just doesn’t perform very well. Maybe there’s some secret trick I just don’t know about, but every other melee weapon for the elf seems better. I’ve done a few runs with it (all champion) and it feels like someone forgot to the spear tip on it and it’s really just a dull stick that looks like a spear.

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run swift slaying on it, cycles through to sweeps faster and becomes on of the better if not best horde clearing weapons minus the 2h swords but those suffer drastically from phantom swings and lack of AP, spear and glaive are prolly the 2 best weapon set ups for the elf at the moment. We shall see if things improve after patch but I feel like melee is going to take an unnecessary hit.

There is a trick for clearing hordes: it’s a combination of using the sweep strong attack, block cancelling the stab strong attack, and then repeating, so you get a series of sweeping strong attacks. You can actually do this very quickly, so there’s almost no interval between sweeps.

It also has probably the best push attack in the game. Continue to hold the left mouse button after pushing and you’ll get a huge sweep.

You should also mix in the light attack chain if you need to make space, the sweep generally comes out on the second light if you mix it with heavies, instead of the third.

Its a very fun weapon in my opinion that requires some micromanagement. I think the only improvement needs to be stab strong attacks which need better armor pen. They have the nice headshot multiplier but can’t pen Chaos Warriors.

Glaive is the only other viable weapon on Legend honestly but it isn’t the best anti-horde weapon. In fact a full crit/crit power Waytstalker with a glaive is probably the best melee armor killer in the game, too bad Bounty Hunters do it better at range.

Shortbow just seems somewhat redudant to me honestly unless you’re specifically using it for the mobility in speed/solo runs, and it’s awful against the abundant armor in Legend. Longbow is versatile enough that I never feel like I wish I had the shortbow. Haven’t used hagbane much in Legend, but I just think there isn’t enough of a need for AoE for it to be terrible useful. I’m not sure how it does in terms of boss damage but if it was really good I imagine I would see more people using it.

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i think a few of her weapons feel very sluggish, which is really awkward on an elf. it also doesn’t help with her squish.
• can’t swap off crossbow after you fire until it puts in another bolt which is WAY too long for that character type
• long bow is pretty bad about quick swap too
• the wardancer guard/push thing is just incredibly off putting. for some reason at the very start of your guard if you release RMB and try to swing you will push, even if you just tap RMB for a second as if you were timing a parry at the last moment. coming out of a held guard is fine, but if you’re someone who is quick on the fingers this screws you over a lot. i don’t know any other weapon in the game that a RMB tap, release then LMB tap will do a push instead of a swing
• wardancer and glaive can’t cancel attacks at ALL once the click registers which seems like pure insanity when pretty much every other 2 hander can cancel out, some even during charge attacks. only one i know of that can’t off the top of my head is the dwarf’s axe.

pretty much. it’s not bad on hordes in the current state but most times you can get a long sight line and do plenty of work with the longbow. curious how it’ll be after the power change. waystalker is a character i worry about after that change though

I agree, she doesn’t have any power scaling that isn’t functioning so a flat power nerf is going to hit her hard I think.

I’ve also experienced terrible quick swapping with longbow, I so often end up aiming down sight instead of blocking, it’s incredibly obnoxious.

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Sorry mate, you lost me when said dual daggers aren’t good.

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I would agree that they are not very good. It does fine against armor, but it’s not exceptional. The reason they’re bad though is because horde density is so much higher in VT2 that a weapon with essentially no cleave just isn’t really viable unless you have a super organized team, and even if you have a super organized team, you would still be better off bringing a more versatile weapon.

I don’t really see a use for it, it has little cleave, little reach, and crit power glaive is just so much better at dealing with armor, and shields. It also has a terrible push attack and it’s not even the best weapon for mobility. The one niche it has is that they are really good for miniboss dps, but that’s such a non-issue since minibosses are generally fairly easy to control. This is incidentally why shade is so absolutely useless.

Consider: a glaive can one-combo chaos warriors consistently, can break shields, has decent horde clear, and a good push attack. Spear has fantastic horde clear, the best push attack in the game, still has a huge headshot multiplier for armor, incredible reach, and excellent dodge distance, although it does struggle with shields. Dual Dagger just does such unsafe and poor horde clear, and has such mediocre armored damage potential, that I don’t see a use for it.

Dual daggers are really strong and designed around the shade carreer. The problem is that The Shade needs a rework, The weapon itself is Good

my main bow is a hagbane so i can tell you that this weapon is largely underrated and misunderstood.

assuming 600 power, a straight bodyshot will kill any regular mob on any difficulty (slave rat/zombie/clanrat/rotblood grunts) and will 1 shot legendary packmasters, 2 shot firerats/gatling/assassins/beserkers, 3 shots for sorcerors/gasrats/SV/marauders.

the poison on it works for a few seconds as a dot, so once you get comfortable using it, you can fire and forget on enemies, and they will die while you can get busy doing other stuff. you can’t fire just 1 arrow at a packmaster dragging off your teammate and kill him, while defending yourself from a surrounding horde, with any other bow. (unless you somehow headshot him with a longbow)

it’s draws much faster than a longbow, and has no zoom-in slowdown.

another of its strength lies in crowd control. ever got your party surprised with a pack of 12 stormvermin? never fear, spam it on the ground or on a huge cluster to stunlock them, buying enough time for your other party members to get away and kill them all. it tears hordes apart, thinning a huge running group out with a few well placed arrows.

it’s a mini-grenade launcher, that will hurt you and your team if used incorrectly, but otherwise, it’s pretty crazy imo. just wish they hadn’t nerfed the ammo so bad.

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Are those heavy or light shots?

sorry, all are heavy shots. i almost never light attack with the hagbane, because it doesn’t have the stagger and aoe cc power that heavy attacks do, and with the limited ammo nerf, you gotta make each shot count.

Hm thanks, what properties/trait are you using, I’ll have to try it out.

crit and headshot ammo traits unfortunately don’t work on the hagbane now (hopefully they’re fixing that)

I’m using:
Barrage – Consecutive attacks against the same targets boosts attack power by 5.0% for 5.0 seconds

and dmg to armoured targets/dmg to monsters would be my preferred, altho i’m just using +dmg to monsters now.

grab a strength potion, and go to town on any stupid-looking boss you see waddling up towards your party. it’s a pretty good boss killer weapon too.

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Dual daggers are great if you know how to use them. But I guess that logic goes for every weapon. You have a point about cleaving but dealing with hordes is doable if you have a bit of space to weave through.

I agree. Shade and Maiden need buff. Most weapons need buff (and NOT nerfing spear); but WS is ok… bodyshot kills are huntsman’s style. WS must to need headshot.

That’s really the core issue, if you had an ample amount of space and time, sure they work fine, but you very rarely have either of those luxuries, and with the changes to power, the problem of horde density is just going to get worse. I think spear, 2h sword, and glaive are objectively more efficient, and safer weapons. That being said, you can make anything work, although you’re certainly go to have a lower success rate.

Is it really that bad? I have only been playing champ with my lvl23 handmaiden and shade. And so far it’s doable. No idea about legend though. Are they okay or is waystalker just op in comparisson?

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