oh yeah lets remove zealots from pox gas too
lets remove thammer from monsters
lets remove flashlights from power out
lets remove chain weapons from twins while we’re at it
grow up just because one kit is better at one thing doesnt mean it should be banned
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meanwhile an ogryn with a shield can cc everything with also zero cost
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thammer from monsters - It’s really funny
And? I assume you’re not seriously suggesting shieldgryn is as out of the spirit of the melee only modifier as Psyker blitz and staves?
I don’t think it’s helpful to zero in on the one part of my comment about CC and nitpick it. The issue OP has clumsily eluded to in their original post is broader than zero cost CC, surely we can agree?
Edit: I even tried to pre-emptively address this in this part of my original post:
If you disagree that’s cool but it’d make more sense to me to address this broader question than specifically shieldgryn and CC potential.
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Are you just wanting a melee-only modifier? Sub-question; do you just want non-ranged enemies too?
Or do you want a mission where there is a limited amount of ammo still for occasional ranged use, but not where psykers can by-pass that. One assumes you’d be happy with gun-psykers?
Gun Psykers would be good but it’s a rarity to see those Psykers on melee missions.
My complaining is that Psykers with ventilation and soulsblaze can burn all elite units in a few seconds.
These are pretty good ideas. Especially the “venting costs HP” one. But this is a really tricky thing to balance:
- A reduction to passive quelling buffs Warp Rider
- There’s blessings like Transfer Peril & Exorcist to consider
- Peril doesn’t just affect ranged, but also blitzes, ults and to some extent melee (Kinetic Deflection (doubly important here bc of their base stamina of literally one), Force Sword specials), so reducing quelling or boosting peril buildup will weaken psykers across the board
- Their talents from toughness regen to +dmg and much more are intrinsically built around warp attacks, with less to no peril to work with their dmg & survivability falls apart
The entire psyker gameplay is built around warp, peril, and their broad toolset. Without those they are beyond a doubt the weakest class in the game, with the lowest hp / toughness / base stamina / dmg resists. Their ranged nvm peril & warp itself is not the same as ranged for other classes. Stripping oggies, zellies, even melee vets (not counting infinite ammo lasgun vets ofc) of most of their ammo is limiting but not really all that severe considering the melee focused enemies. Doing the same for psykers however would put them in a far worse spot than the rest.
I’m not saying psykers shouldn’t get a debuff of their own so to speak, only that doing it right is more complicated than most seem to think.
Regardless, about that good faith…: Any person like the OP who goes from “this thing is annoying to me” to seriously suggesting the removal of an entire class and a large portion of the playerbase first thing is not acting in good faith. That’s just selfishness, ego and little else. And I’m sorry to say this but that 20+ SB stack comment later highly suggests a sense of ignorance to match.
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Thank you. Yes, I understand that. But rather than just blanket-ban all Psykers…
Could you answer the questions I asked?
e.g. If FS created a modifier where you couldn’t switch to blitz or secondary, would that be the level that you want to play? As in - a true Melee-only level.
Or do you want to play a level where you have secondary GUNS, but only finite ammo? So if FS put a huge peril penalty on staff secondaries, you’d basically not be able to use them.
And do you want enemies having guns, or do you just want melee enemies so it’s just a big melee fight?
First of all, I would like to have a balance.
Playing without secondary weapons and reneged enemies it looks like a good idea for another mission modifier but in this one, I would like to care about ammo efficiency.
When I was talking about Psyker banning so probably it was a quick decision but something should be done with soulsblaze and ventilation, especially on this mission.
Ignorance ?) Reaaly ?
So, let’s unblock Infernus stacks on lasguns, and will be having fun.
It sounds like you want:
- Guns (no ammo pickups)
- Blitzes/Grenades, specifically to include Smite, Brainburst and Assail (you didn’t say no)
- Shield, Venting Shriek or Scriers Gaze allowed too
- No staves
- Enemies could be ranged (you didn’t say no)
Helps to be specific. So you’re asking FS to put an additional modifier on this level that causes 2ndry weapon peril to hit 100% in less than a second, thus forcing players away from using them.
This would allow players to still use their Psyker (let’s assume some people spend 100% of their time on the class, so only have Psyker at level 30+), but they would have to adopt a gun-psyker class model.
Emm, What? Where did I say something about secondary weapon peril to hit 100% in less than a second?
Guys, please stop saying things that I didn’t say and not even mean.
I’m complaining about the modifier and I don’t say that we should remove Psykers from the game
No-one knows what you mean. I don’t think you even know what you mean, if I’m being blunt.
The problem you have is that your initial premise is totally unrealistic. No-one is going to create a map instance that instantly excludes up to 25% of the playing population. Some people only do a Psyker main.
I’m re-writing what I THINK you want the end result to be in to something that FatShark could actually implement with existing mechanics.
Read it again. Think about it, again. You didn’t say anything about instant 100% peril, no, but how EXACTLY would you, if you were FatShark, implement this with the existing game mechanics? If a Psyker with a staff hit 100% peril almost instantly, then you’ve caused their exclusion.
Maybe you could decide whether actually what I wrote would enforce the modifier conditions you REALLY want?
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Almost under the each comment listed above I wrote that soulsblaze must be fixed/limited and the ventilation also. That’s what I wrote and that’s what I mean.
I explained my problem and my vision but I’m not in the FS team and it’s up to them whether something should be done with it or not.
That is all! Bye.
Sure, my point was just there’s an actual interesting question to be discussed here regardless of OP’s tone, may as well try to be productive rather than escalate to a likely thread lock.
For the rest of what you said, I might not agree with the significance you’ve given some points but overall I agree, without much to add. Was really just throwing around ideas for how the modifier could be adapted to have a bit more impact on staff Psyker. Upon further consideration the first idea I gave was kinda bad and it makes no sense to punish Scrier’s and blitz along with staffs. Honestly a Scrier’s melee focused DS build or something similar would probably be the sort of thing that ought to be encouraged by this modifier.
Basically if anyone’s got good ideas for how the modifier could be adjusted to place a similarish limitation on Staffs to what it does for guns please chuck them out here.
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Completely remove psykers from the game.
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I was trying to go for that too, rather than just rubbishing the idea. Hit a brick wall though which may have been language barrier - apologies @Andrii if so.
Excluding staff Psykers is always going to be controversial though. Unless you’ve got some kind of limited “Psych” that you spend, and when it’s gone, it’s gone. Or you could have it where you can’t vent it, and it doesn’t naturally dissipate. So you’ve got to melee kill stuff, or have tree ability venting, in order to reset it.
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fun for me but not for thee
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Everyone who complains about difficulty being too easy should just remove all their skill tree points before playing lol
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