Ogryns need more toughness

It makes no sense that the ogyrn has less toughness than a veteran.

Considering their roles, yes it does.

Veteran is the “ranged vs ranged” class.
When fighting ranged enemies from range (where they actually shoot at you), you will take hits no matter what you do. So you need toughness to absorb a few shots.

The ogryn is mostly a melee class and can regenerate toughness insanely quickly during melee combat. When you do take health damage, you have a massive health pool to deal with incoming chip damage.
Also, the ogryn ALWAYS has toughness damage resistance from his passive.
Ogryn definitely do not need more toughness.
If you have problems staying alife, as an ogryn, it might be more of a skill issue.

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Wdym, I need a ton of toughness to be able to keep stubbering from the back. The veteran’s job is to frontline for me and provide free ammo.

While at it, please kill the crushers my cleaver is unable to, teamwork mates, teamwork!

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And do not forget to magdump on the bulwark shields and crushers.
Never use your charge to stagger them.

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On a serious note, if you have trouble with toughness, follow the following steps.

  1. Find the biggest blob of enemies
  2. Ulti into
  3. Start swinging

Oh I usually have no problem stay alive.(or maintaining health for the most part) It just 100 toughness on a being 3 times larger than something that gets 200 is straight up heresy. There are to many times I think to myself, I should have been able to take that with 0 damage…cause i’m a freakin ogryn.

It’s about the feeling mostly, ogyrn biggest so should have biggest number >:(

Remember that health comes from your massive body, but toughness comes from technology.
If you slapped the same shield generator on a puny man vs a massive ogryn, the shield would have to be stretched quite thin in order to cover the massive body.

You have the biggest health pool (300 base, up to 500+ with curios).
And the biggest and girthiest body.

If ogryn had 200 base toughness, they would basically be immortal.

Also, remember that the smartest ogryn in 40k lore can only count up to 4 (same as ours, as you can see sometimes during the loading screen, when he counts his fingers and gets confused on the 5th finger).
So a real ogryn would not know the difference between100 and 200 toughness. :smiley:

Running 1 toughness curio greatly helps your ability to trade hits.

In my opinion, it really is annoying to T pose behind a Veteran, who is tanking 20 gunners and 50 shooters while killing 12 Crushers.
But recently, they added the gun that actually kills from a far, so I don’t need to close distance to kill dudes with guns, so now I don’t have a problem with toughness.

And after all, it’s real chill to just watch Veteran play the game while you stand back and relax.

Ogryn has 36% toughness DR from their passive giving them an effective toughness of ~156 before curios and feats (you can get a bunch more DR on top of that large base ).

Then they also have double the base HP of a Veteran, with their 20% HP DR taking that to an ehp of 375, again BEFORE curios and DR feats. Ogryn does NOT have any sort of survivability issues. They also have superb toughness regen options with confident strike and Lynchpin.

Buffing their toughness would be a brainless move.

OP has ‘usually no problem staying alive’ but still wants double the toughness.

This type of thread gets recycled regularly and is a skill issue.

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Rather than buffing his toughness, he needs stagger immunity while he rears up for heavy attacks. That is the absolute basic buff Ogryn needs to even consider being a heavy attack machine. Otherwise, light attack spammers like bull butcher and brunt’s basher will remain his meta weapons. They’d still remain his meta weapons even with that buff, but at least it might even things out in a minuscule manner.

OP likes things to reflect the lore where possible.
Don’t think to much about it.

It does though, just through DR rather than health/toughness numbers. See my post further up. OP is bad at math by the sound of it.

If brunt’s basher is meta then most ogryns still haven’t figured out what’s actually worth playing in his kit because it sucks. Its the worst haymaker user despite 2 relentless heavies, which is the only crowd clearing clubs can reliably do. And it doesn’t have the bonk so fighting carapace and maniac is just a chore while the other 2 will 2 shot crusher and maniac with only T3 thrust and appropriate feats/perks. Trying to kill a mutant with this club is an absolute joke, and the entire benefit of using clubs is that they stagger and damage elites/specials very well.

Also for it requiring you to hit only 1 enemy, the only weapon worth using that only has relentless attacks is the power maul, which is also about the only case for lynchpin because your team is doing everything when you run power maul. So I’d say its still better, because all of the ogryn melees worth running have a strikedown except 1. Which is really just team glue/puny protection: the powered bonk stick experience anyway so it doesn’t matter. Maybe if they add another power maul variant it would just end up outclassed instead.

It’s great. The heavies aren’t very good but what’s new for Ogryn meta weapons.

Just spam lights for almost everything except Carapace and it’s a somewhat worse BB. For Carapace use Block/Push - Light - Light which is two strikedowns in a row.

For Maniac shoot them.

For reference sake I use the Shovel 90% of the time so I’m not trying to ‘defend my favourite weapon’ or something like that. The Basher is legit a great weapon.

Has nothing to do with math sir. I am well aware the DR and health pool. It really is just Ogryn bigger so bigger number = good.

And if you haven’t been able to tell by my past responses by now, I’m mostly, “mostly” joking. A better way to improve Ogryns is to increase more weapons, modify/buff weapons stats to make them more equal in relevance, and add blessing that are actually useful.

What? The other ogryn weapons are all carried by heavies, on top of heavies giving you the best access to toughness. This is why you have issues with the toughness gain on the class, using either a knife with no actual reason to ever throw a heavy or a defective club that for some reason needed the absolute slowest heavies in the game that are also worse in swing angle to regular club straight horizontal sweeps.

And shooting a Mutant 20-35 times depending on Stubber, or 12+ ripper shots, or 4 grenade gauntlets, or 2 point blank maniac kickback shots, is no where near as fast as bonking it on the head as it missed the charge and finishing it off while its recovering in 2 swings. This is the entire point of using ‘things that aren’t a knife’ on Ogryn, but I will continue to humor why Ogryn is bad from your point of view.

I don’t know what you’re really talking about? Are you replying to the right person? I love Ogryn, I main them, I don’t have any toughness issues and I’m puzzled at where your comment even comes from. I’ve got multiple videos on youtube of me doing Hi5 Shock including with Shovel / Kickback bleed builds which are well considered non-meta.

Onto your comment though you stated that:

If brunt’s basher is meta then most ogryns still haven’t figured out what’s actually worth playing in his kit because it sucks. Its the worst haymaker user despite 2 relentless heavies, which is the only crowd clearing clubs can reliably do.

I’m just letting you know that you can crowd clear quite well with light attack spam on the Basher. You should give it a try, it’s really good.

Right I’ve run predominantly the Mk4 knife and the club/shovel, and the Mk1 totally obsoletes the rest minus the very real niche of unyielding damage that is actually on Mk2. Haymaker is the only thing able to make those players response lines for kill efficiency procc as Ogryn on high difficulty and it has the fastest, pure horizontal swing for instantly hitting 5 stacks every swing.

The basher is not more efficient than this, or anywhere close, and it gives up single target damage routes to do so. You have to hit a shotgunner 3 times to kill him, or run flak on a CLUB, and it will need stamina to do 2 push attacks. It gets hopeless on the rest, unless they are unyielding. But if you catch a reaper or bulwark with it you need to sweep low to avoid hitting their armor zones because hey it can’t headshot. I have run it. It is terrible. I can mention the maniacs thing again. It is awful at doing the only valuable contribution a club has, and it also can’t CC as well with lower stagger on those lights and too slow a heavy to be useful.

But alright, it can bunga light attack fast so it meta, even though its basically just the shield argument applied to a faster swing.