While I can’t speak for everyone, a lot of us want to get all the goodies we can so we can finally play the game(in a sense). It’d be silly to get everything you want and then stop playing. Getting and wearing all the cool gear/cosmetics then slaughtering rats is part of the fun. Because now you get to slaughter in style. Plus, it opens up even more doors for experimentation. People have hundreds of hours in VT1 because it has enjoyable replayability, despite a number of people already having everything. I have the hours I do in VT2 because it’s enjoyable and has good replayability. That said, Vt2 isn’t even “finished” yet. Things are still being fixed, balanced, added. Mods aren’t even out yet. DLC’s aren’t out yet.
That said, the amount of theoretical hours you’d have to put into this game in order to get reds/cosmetics for everything you want is absolutely astronomical. The drop rate definitely needs some kind of improvement-system/increase.
Insane droprates will not make me put in 10,000 hours to collect these cosmetics/reds. I’ll just look at those drop chances and not bother trying to get them at all. If Fatshark wants to pad out playtime, this is not the way to do it. Most people will only chase goals if they are reasonably achievable.
But this is a misrepresentation. The core loop of the game is completely intact at level 1 on recruit. Depending on your skill level the “sweet spot” of gameplay could fall anywhere between recruit and legendary heroic insanity deeds.
Reds and cosmetics are completely secondary carrots on a stick, they are not the core of the game and they mean nothing in terms of gameplay itself. They are psychological ploys to keep you playing, that is all. You can perform just fine with a 90% rolled well orange and no cosmetics and that is EASILY achievable by 25-30 with all gear on any class. In fact, IMO, reds are somewhat pointless.
The idea of slaughtering “in style” is a BS subjective statement invented to argue a point. Because I could slaughter “in style” wearing 3 boots, a napkin, a pizza box, an “i’m with stupod” ascot, and a small hand grenade earing. Because my “slaughtering in style” is in regards to my gameplay, not how fancy I look.
But look, I agree with you cosmetic drop rates are not well balanced. In fact they are terrible and need to be fixed. But that doesn’t stop what you said from being completely unfair and inaccurate. Also, if we really get down to brass tacks, being so easily manipulated by superficial rewards is prolly the worst thing you could do to yourself in gaming. Putting that much value on cosmetics and trivial upgrades that “the game doesn’t start until you have your cosmetics” means you are very vulnerable to alot of really scummy practices. If you care about yourself at all, you should try and not be like that. Enjoying cosmetics and trivial upgrades is great, having them have such impact on your gameplay that you feel you can’t really enjoy yourself without them? That’s called having a problem mate.
Great example: Nintendo crushing graphically superior opponents, CS:GO’s dominant grip on top tier FPS play, 7 Days to Die destroying Day Z, etc. It’s not about the superficial, it’s about the substance. Superficial is just tasty garnish and you;'re still here playing legendary even without that garnish, that should tell you of how little importance it actually is with the hours you’ve already invested. Though again, if you are playing a game for so long you do not enjoy: you have a problem.
In regards to players like myself, we don’t just want them for the stats. We want them because they look nice. And some people are collectors. I can play the game with whites that look plain, but that doesn’t mean I want to.
It’s not a bs statement in the slightest. One of the primary drives and selling points for players in video games is customization/graphics. Being able to improve the aesthetics for your character that you are playing is important to many players. This is apparent when looking at how many cosmetic sales are made in games, across all games. How much time, money, and energy is put into developing graphics and customization. How marketing will feature these things and use it as selling points for products. Or how many players will go out of their way to do something for cosmetics. Cosmetics don’t change gameplay, but that’s not the point. People want to look the way they want to look. Look at the customization for creating a single character in a lot of MMORPG’s. It makes them feel better and have a more enjoyable experience. And I can bet there is almost no one who wants to kill rats looking the way you described.
You misunderstand. The more you can customize, the more you can work towards making the character what you want them to be and what you want to be. It’s about enhancing the enjoyment factor of playing the game(especially since the visual aspect of video games is so important). When that goal feels so out-of-reach, it can severely dampen the enjoyment aspect of a game for a lot of players.
A system of “progression” was put in, but there are huge uncontrollable hurdles that are sometimes placed in front of players via RNG. Players start to feel that they can’t get all the content. That they can’t be what they want. It feels like a hollow dream and intangible goal after a certain point. You bought a game but due to RNG, you might never be able to personally experience all the content you want no matter how much you play. There is no real money involved in this process, so players can’t be victims to scummy practices. That’s also not the problem or point here though.
It’s not a matter of impacting gameplay per se, because cosmetics don’t change how you play. No matter how much you may say superficial cosmetics don’t matter, the fact of the matter is that aesthetics are one of the most important things for humans. You can see it in your every day life. Re-painting walls or objects because “you don’t really care of that color”. Choosing not to eat something because it doesn’t look good. It affects choices when looking for someone to date. It affects whether people even pick a game in the first place. If a person will spend money on something or not. I’m sure you get the idea. Aesthetics affect human behavior in a number of ways. Regardless of whether you specifically care or not, it’s absolutely important to a lot people and a number of businesses realized that long ago.
As for your comment:
People are certainly playing and enjoying the game, which is the main reason they have the time they do in it. I wouldn’t be concerned about that. Vargs has the right idea in regards to the drop rate issue:
As can be seen here, Varg’s not saying he isn’t going to play the game. Varg’s not saying he doesn’t enjoy the game. He’s just stating the ridiculousness of one of the “goals” Fatshark gave players. Fatshark doesn’t want their players to be disinterested in achieving these goals. That’s why it’s important that Fatshark is given feedback like this so they can make necessary adjustments and provide an even more enjoyable experience for players.
I have 200 hours in the game now, i play with a close friend and my husband. Combined together that’s around 500 hours in total. We usually play champion with 3 tomes and 2 grims. We also have done legend a few times. In total none of us have seen any red items.
Totally agree, right now drop rates is incredibly stupid. Dear Fatshark, if you want players to play you game - dont make this game more BORING, make it more interesting, make the game HARDER. Im pretty ok to play even stronger legend for rare drops. But im sure - no one want to grind 200+ legendary boxes for 1 red\cosmetic item. This is anti-fun and this thing alone can doom you game in prolonged perspective.
Would you rather the playerbase stop playing because they are satisfied and got all the end game items…or would you rather they stopped playing because they never got any of them and were frustrated?
A lot of people are saying the top players have gotten some exclusive access to mod tools and such. And I really don’t care about that just as long as us mere mortals will also get the chance to consistently switch weapons when we press Q. If I am playing Sienna and try to switch from staff to sword while executing my right click > left click ability, well then half the times it just won’t happen for whatever reason. Meanwhile, player in the video doesn’t even seem to have the switching animation.
That answer is prolly different for customer vs company with different ramifications for each honestly. It’s entirely possible the slightly unsatisfied feeling actually results in longer retention and higher dlc/expansion adoption.
Rare cosmetics also let players show off proof that they’ve invested time in the game and accomplished some feat. People who have masetered it want to stand out from the crowd. This is fine.
Wrong. There are countless players who have poured hours into this game and who are very talented but have not been gifted a Red or a cosmetic.
That’s ultimately one of the HUGE issues in this game and games in general: a lack of merit based rewards. It’s all RNG. You get rewards not for actually being good, you just randomly get them eventually based on dice rolls and chance.
Not wrong. You gave a “would you rather x than y?” Self contained scenario. I gave you a valid answer acknowledging the customer perspective, company perspective, and the very real fact that we answer this from a position of ignorance.
The right answer for company and customer is often different and consumers themselves are often illogical. Look no further than JC Penny nearly bankrupting themselves because they dared to offer fair and honest transparent pricing that was lower. Seriously look it up.
I personally agree drop rates are too low. And if they are too low it does not mean stingy drops are the wrong move for the company, only that they didn’t find the right balance of stingy drops.
You might not like RNG rewards but they have a very long and successful track record. You’re a very smart doge, but don’t let your personal bias and knowledge that you are smart let you forget that this is an area you are not an expert on, or the fact that our words regarding this situation matter little…only our actions.
We can only give our feedback and make our best GUESSES from an outside uninformed perspective. Once more: we do not disagree though that the current rates are too low.
Apologies, your post didnt have a reply to target, was relevant in context, and my last reply was to you. Their forums is a bit buggy showing that reply to indicator.
As to the RNG: your last post was mostly a complaint about RNG as a whole, across all gaming, and specifically mentioned an alternative: merit based rewards. This implies of course youd like to see that change. Thus their market viability is a pretty potent counterpoint to the idea of changing it. If you feel I misinterpreted that I’m all too happy to concede that point. But I can only work with what was typed.
