So you have played public games and experienced the following:
Veterans refusing to use their melee and going down
Veterans hanging too far back out of coherency
Zealots overextending too far forward
Psykers exploding
Players going off to hunt for materials while the rest of the team moves forward
Players splitting off to grab medicae charges, medkit healing, or ammo crate charges
Players being barreled off the map and instantly dying
Mutants, Spawn, and Beasts of Nurgle flinging players far out of coherency
Bots going down to a stiff breeze
Daemonhost waking up and kidnapping a player
Quickplaying into a lobby in progress that’s gone already downhill
Generally low skill players you have to carry regularly going down and dying to attrition
Monstrosities, mutants, bombers, flamers dividing up the team and pushing anyone out of coherency
And the most important part of the list
SIMPLY BEING IN MELEE
There’s more, but given there’s this many situations where toughness regen speed loses A LOT of potency, I think it’s still a crime to not at least account for this in the description for the perk. Meanwhile Health and Toughness perks are always active, Stamina Regen helps in melee where toughness regen does not and in the same scenarios where toughness regen is active, Combat Ability Regen will allow for more ability uses and usually this acts as a source of very fast toughness, Damage Resistances pull heavy weight against the enemies any individual player has trouble with, and Corruption Resistance both helps keep grimoires and resist many different enemy types in the game.
The main point being, toughness regen speed is put on a pedastal and revered without ever noting its flaws. Every perk is flawed in some way, Toughness/Health is passive, Damage resist is situational, Stamina Regen isn’t needed when you’re full stamina, Ditto for ability with combat ability regen, etc. The fact these things are not listed and it’s just parroted as the best really is just showing how the advice from the ogrynomicon is geared towards only the ideal situations rather than accounting for all the scenarios where it doesnt work.
So what about the failure state? What about quickplaying into a lobby already gone wrong? What about everything I’ve listed high above? The game also actively tries to divide up the team, that’s part of the moment to moment gameplay.
I have experienced all of that and im going to continue to use toughness regen speed because of the benefit it gives me while playing , the other options give no where near as much benefit to me
This is the entire problem. You are failing to recognize other forms of play, other player’s needs, etc. The Ogrynomicon should aim to educate players on the ins and outs of the game as an Ogryn player, and that includes the pros and cons of curio perks. These things should be signposted, and readers can then make their own intelligent decisions on what they like using information you provide.
Do you stop recommending it? No, you’re free to share your opinion on it. It’s just so disingenuous to not recognize the other side of the argument beyond just “A lot of people tend to dismiss it.” There WILL be people who read the ogrynomicon and then end up playing more aggressively in melee, or play with friends that aren’t good at the game, etc, and not gain as much value from Toughness Regen Speed.
Yes, he is. He was in a good spot pre-toughness nerfs. Those who actually say that “he is great” clearly have not played him or play on less than auric, where I mostly play, with ogryn.
One of the recent points that I think should be taken a look at is also Thrust: its stacking and the starting time, for the melee especially on the Branx is so awful: its should be sped up just by 1 sec, so you can actually use it against hordes.
Yes, he is.
Ogryn should be THE heavy melee class, with THE most damaging weapons and stagger.
He should then suck at mobility and accuracy.
Instead its a worse zealot when trying to melee
Its a worse veteran when you try to shoot
Support wise, bomb is nice, taunt and charge aint bad but they are real MEH compared to the rest of the classes.
Only thing an Ogryn can offer is memes and a somewhat solid object to look at.
Ogryn should be:
Dogs pounce but after a bite or two ogryn pushes them away automatically (no need for middle keystone)
Ogryn should ignore nets completely, or tear them off after a second
Mutatns should stop when charging ogryn as if they hit a wall
Ogryn doesnt have slide and dodge is very short but it pushes things smaller then him away. To however mitigate NOT having slide = dying to basic ranged mobs in 1.3 seconds. Ogryn has alot of DMG mititgation for both healthbars.
There’s no perk in the game that will make or break a clutch scenario, or any of the other situations you described, to the extent that it’s worth dropping Toughness Regen for, in my opinion. Unless you’re playing challenge content but at that point you can make up your own mind about what you need to survive and you don’t need the Ogrynomicon.
So in short, emphasizing its exact functioning to the length you seem to deem necessary isn’t important to me when I already don’t think it has any substantial competition. We mention that it works with coherency regen only and that suffices. Most curio perks are trash or deeply situational in their own, often more restrictive ways, and Toughness Regen – between its regen delay reduction and hefty multiplier when stacked three times, and its synergy with Lynchpin – is the clear winner to us. There is no need to “but what about this or that!” in the guide endlessly when it makes no difference to me.
Are you now criticising me for accurately labeling my subjective statements as such? That’s widely considered to be good practice. I don’t proclaim to say anything objective. Making an objective guide was never the goal and should never be the goal because that’s not a real thing.
If people want to know how coherency regen works precisely, they can read a guide about that. The scope of the Ogrynomicon doesn’t cover basic game mechanics.
The scope of the Ogrynomicon is basically an entire book given the walls of text, yet this is the point where you talk about scope?
Selectively leaving out information in order to make your picks more sensible isn’t exactly great help for new playerse. Many of which consider the thing gospel.
At this point this is just you abusing a position of infamy to spread your personal tastes as objective truth.
And yes it is considered objective by many inexperienced players simply because it is featured by fatshark. But sure go ahead and use the ‘subjective’ excuse whenever you get called out on it.
, the other options give no where near as much benefit to me
