can’t really use an automatic gun in havoc unless you’re a vet with crit lasgun talent. this is a really unnecessary and unfun modifier in havoc that doesn’t need to exist
2 Likes
Rather than changing this and making havoc easier they should make the base game harder
Imagine nerfing gamemodes in a pve game!
3 Likes
You can, you just don’t burst down every single horde and elite you see. If you just better choose your targets and play melee rather than blasting it ends up being pretty ammo efficient. I’ve pretty much only been using shotguns for stagger/suppression and damage dumping bons/reapers or marksman’s exe stance and I can’t imagine it’s much different.
3 Likes
does absolutely nothing to make this havoc mod better but ok
there are plenty of unviable guns that can’t be taken into havoc cuz of this one mechanic. its unnecessarily oppressive to build diversity and is generally an unfun mechanic
Have not tried Havoc so I cant say, all i know is I am a trigger happy Ogryn main and running out of ammo is always my fault.
Vets taking smoke grenades when they replenish one every 60 seconds… that makes me a grumpy Ogryn.
vets best talents are the melee ones anyways, which is a damn shame
and survivalist nerf really doesn’t help
Which ones are not havoc viable? I’ve brought exe infantry autoguns and headhunter autoguns into havoc 40 and have victories, some without ever running out of ammo. I don’t even bring ammo aura on shotguns or revolver anymore on vet, and have plenty of runs on zealot without it either.
I agree, also it forces vets down the survivalist path, for themselves and their team.
Buff the game to make up for my shortcomings and refusal to become more skillful or a better teamplayer…
The game is meleecentric. Its not your game. You paid for someone elses game. Play the game and stop trying to make it yours./homogenise and power creep everything so you dont need to think about skill.
Whats next? I want squad of Guardsmen with me to tank and save my ammo? I want to call in a Leman Russ because exists? I want a pet Space Marine instead of Executioner stance?
Ammo, like health is team dependent. If you are burning ammo, youre burning it for everyone. if youre letting your teammates get hit where you could not let them get hit, youre losing your own health too. Both are at best incompetance and at worse trolling selfishness.
How about we make better kits and get better at using Lasguns which are extremely ammo efficient and use the ret of the kit/melee to kill everything that isn’t ranged, or only use Boltguns on targets that our kit can’t deal with otherwise, with more than enough flavor in the middle for everything else?
Nah, I wanna magdump on Poxwalkers because everything is oppressing me
It makes it better for some people by making it harder which is the goal and it’s what the people Havoc is made for want out of it. If you don’t like that you have to conserve ammo it’s not the gamemode for you, it really doesn’t have to change.
I agree it limits viability/use cases on some weapons but that’s the cost that comes with making it harder, which is the primary goal. Havoc is a side game mode made to be hard, first and foremost. If you want fun powerfantasy of blasting your gun all game long you know what to play.
ammo on havoc feels balanced, i like it is in that way
and you have to use it only when you really need to, which is cool unlike in auric where you can magdump mindlessly because there will be ammos anyway.
also ammo it is good, but there are times on havoc where even if you run out of ammo, you can still overcome just by meleeing everything.
1 Like
making the increase in difficulty one that limits build diversity unnecessarily is garbage design. the increase in difficulty with this mod, all it does, is say you can’t use these guns. do you not understand that?
do you understand that there are guns as well as melee weapons? guns are half of the game bub. maybe get out of your bubble and use your brain sometime.
No, it’s necessary. Havoc would be too easy without the ammo modifier because there are a couple ranged weapons that trivialize the game by being too efficient and too usable against all enemies.
Your choices are either nerfing those weapons so they can’t circumvent how the game dishes up difficulty anymore, or you limit their use and hinder some other ranged weapons. Fatshark has seemingly decided to not nerf stuff anymore, so the custom ammo modifier had to be made to keep Havoc challenging.
Or are you gonna say “just make Havoc even harder” instead? It would create the same problem because then only those weapons can keep up anyway.
This is what makes havoc a big no for me
But Havoc is not meant to be open to all weapons… in fact it is for a restricted number of weapons.
And I can understand that the guy that play this mode don’t want that this modifier is removed.
You face surely the same problem I had. But you have to accept or to play with these modifiers and adapt to them, play with other weapons, or not playing havoc.
Sidenote: I think that, if they rework veteran talent tree, they should give a specialization for ballistic weapons. Of course, it has to be different than what we currently have for lasguns.
i don’t know what you’re talking about. all the strongest weapons have the best ammo economy. plasma gun, boltgun, zealot flamer, recon lasgun with vet, revolver, rumbler/ kickback… what guns are you talking about? why is buffing the weaker guns a problem for you? makes no sense. either remove the ammo nerf mod or buff the total ammo of the weaker guns, makes no difference to me. as long as we can reliably play more stuff.
1 Like
there is no reason for havoc to restrict the amount of guns that can be used there. none. its not a difficulty increasing modifier since all the best guns already have good ammo econ. the ammo nerf mod is trash, plain and simple and if you can’t admit that than fine theres nothing to talk about then. also, what a weird thing to say, there is NO ONE that plays havoc at a high level that likes the ammo nerf. playing the same content all the time with the same weapons gets stale, weapons are the one thing players can manipulate to make the game more fun. are you against fun? should fatshark nerf the amount of content players can enjoy in a game mode they spent a lot of dev time in, in so doing diminish their own playerbase? think it thru.
Exactly those. Imagine how easy Havoc would be if those weps had 4x the ammo compared to now. It is the case on aurics, and look how hard these weapons you mentioned trivialize difficulty on auric damnation in the hands of a good player.
Unfortunately Fatshark nerfs nothing, and Havoc is made for good players, so Havoc has a bespoke ammo modifier that exists solely for weapons like that to not trivialize Havoc, at the cost of build variety.
To be clear I’m not telling you that’s optimal, it’s just that Fatshark won’t nerf these weps so we’re gonna have to deal with this if we don’t want Havoc to be too easy. The other alternative is buffing ammo on e.g. Braced/Infantry Autos even more which would further ruin balance on Aurics, as Infantry autos are already pretty busted on Aurics.
This is unfortunately a design problem that can only be truly solved by nerfing the OP outliers like plasma gun, which Fatshark won’t do because sub 80 IQ brainlets would throw a hissy fit and tank the game’s score.
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