*inspired by this old poll: POLL: Which class needs a talent tree rework the most?
Fatshark has stated they want to rework the talent tree of the Zealot and the Vet.
The zealot is by far the one who has the least options in it and hasn’t been update in a while.
but
The vet has a lot of tax point and many players criticize the talent tree.
The question is: Which one do you feel Fatshark should fix as a priority?
Kinda surprised at the split. (EDIT: at the time of posting zealot was winning)
In my view, zealot, while having a lot of tax nodes/weirdly unbalanced choices, is still a solid enough class overall - it just needs some of those nodes to be buffed so people stop meta-chasing.
Vet, on the other hand, has incredibly poor keystone design and a tree that’s even more punishing. Zealot at least has viable choices between their ults, grenades, and keystones. Vet is arguably better off with no keystones and has one ult that’s absurdly OP compared to the other two, ditto one grenade.
Vet needs it more.
Zealot only has one build though.
How much would they have to buff the other Builds to make them on par with a Crit/CDR Chorus Build? That stuff can’t be outbuffed.
They need to move around a lot of the Nodes, remove some entirely like Loner and change them, let you pick any of the Grenades like with Ogryn and the whole Cooldown Reduction removed too or a heavy nerf on Chorus.
As of now with Zealot you also like have 2-3 Builds. You can make a Fury/Martyrdom, Chorus/Martyrdom or Chorus/Crit - only Crit Chorus is viable at high Havocs and no one will even let you join or join your Match if you aren’t playing that as Zealot. And all three of this still run to 99% the same Nodes and 99% always Blades as Blitz.
a lot of people play vet and even more want a return to pre survivalist nerf days of holding down M1 with an autogun to finish the map
Do they?
I thought that on this board the prevalent sentiment is all about vets being unforgivable Plasma fiends in a dire need of their crutch being taken away.
Are you guys having a new thing or just going down a memory lane on this one?
Having said that, if i wanted to observe this alleged multitude (and even more) of veterans desiring the autogun thingy where do i find them? Do they have a discord or something like that? Do they congregate freely or is it more clandestine?
Last I checked, the sentiment was that PG’s problem was infinite cleave trivializing enemy spam with light attacks. Vet himself is not in a great place.
Personally I feel the survivalist nerf was over the top given that its problems were only apparent due to elite spam being cranked up.
i’m voting for zealot, hoping they’ll botch it
Last i checked, the sentiment was that the best way to go about changing PG was to make it about the secondary attack, which has even more pronounced cleave than the light attack.
See how easy it is to get confused on this board when it comes to vet sentiments?
I wouldn’t know, wasn’t around for that. But i’m allegedly pining for it along with the other vets, which i was told are many and even more than many 
Personally i feel we could perhaps for once do a talk about Vets future without airing past grievances over nerfs and without conjuring BS assumptions out of them
I’m not sure why anyone thinks the Zealot is in more dire need of Tree rework than the Vet.
The Veteran talent tree fundamentally isn’t just not well thought out, it’s a literal afterthought.
The original tree concept, built around weapon-specific Keystones, was dumped just before Patch 13, so Vet launched with no Keystone. Vet got Keystones with Patch 14, but not only are they the most convoluted of all classes on average (e.g. in terms of requiring deliberate actions on the part of the player) but they needed 2-4 more Talent points to reach than any other class, so Patch 15 had to rejigger the tree yet again.
Even after all that, Vet is a class that can and often does work just fine without any Keystones at all, not something that can be said of the other classes.
The Zealot has some internal balance issues, but nothing like the inherent fundamental structural issues the way the Veteran does.
I get it, but that’s the exact thing, being able to trivially spam infinite hitscan cleave at infinite range while the charged attack (which has drawbacks) was basically worthless in comparison.
Since the whole schtick of the plasma gun is supposed to be the danger of using it, the forums are generally going ‘yeah take away the spammable nature and make players commit to the charged shots, also make the charged shots worth the ammo and danger overall’
I’ve seen the patch note about zealots being planned. I’ve not seen anything from staff about a vet rework. Can you link?
I think the vet tree is looking outdated and in need of love but if this is something players have collectively mandela’d into being then disappointment is likely.
The only thing I remember seeing for Vet is this:
Perhaps that’s being telephone’d into Tree Rework.
Zealot and Vet both got tax points, but zealots limited options are higher in power than veterans, zealot can make use of all ultimates, all auras, all keystones, while veteran can’t.
Even despite the split now flowing in your favor, I’m actually in the camp of Zealot (though both do need a looking at atm for sure).
Mostly just because Zealots tree feels ‘old’. It’s completely functional/downright very good, but it doesn’t have the ‘freedom’ that’s been pumped into every other skill tree now, on top of having talents that are so bad and old that there’s actively no saving them (5 seconds of increased attack speed after wasting a full clip of ammo? Jee wowzers that’s so nice! and two additional impact talents without a single thing on the tree synergizing with staggers what so ever? Golly I sure do love wasting further talent points! Ohh, and we can’t forget still having sprint stamina cost reduction on the class with the 0.75 sprint modifier when their stamina is out and Swift Certainty so it literally doesn’t matter, on top of the poor left tree before the grenade being actively worthless/the stun grenade being completely power crept by the Arbite’s stun mine grenade).
They just have a lot of power localized in a few designated places, which makes them ‘incredibly one note’ in terms of their ‘build variety’ on top of just generally only ever picking the same things over and over and over because if they don’t they just get rolled over. It’s the main reason you can easily tell a new zealot from an old one, as the new one fell over in room one having picked none of the ‘good nodes’, while the ‘elite’ one is running around with 75%+ toughness DR and Second Wind and Until Death and feels like they are basically unkillable.
I’d like to see an ‘Ogryn style’ separation of power between the DR nodes and some interesting other options, some more proper regen options, the ability to pick what grenade I want (so many builds would use fire grenade if I didn’t have to spend 5 points for it…so many…) and that’s honestly about it. With a further thought in mind being to make some of their niche ‘melee rending’, since Stagger was given to said Arbite along with Ogryn just doing it better, so might as well help them push into a niche a bit more with their melee style of ‘get to thing fast and KILL IT’, and such nodes being a replacement for a lot of the middle tree nothingness (along with further dodge focused nodes).
That’s the main reason I’d like to see them touched first, as they need a ‘tree face lift’ over the Veteran, which outside of Weapon Specialist I feel needs just a lot of help in terms of general tree refinement, even if a lot of their nodes are great/I still think they are ‘the base line’ and very good if you know what you’re doing with them. They just aren’t forgiving (or as forgiving as everything else is these days), which is saying something coming from a ‘Psyker main’ that plays everything. But they can still do some serious work and have a ‘relatively modern’ talent tree in terms of how it’s structured, verses the Zealot which has been left on read since the talent trees where released because ‘they are good don’t worry about them’ and it’s like yes, but please I’m so old so very old.
Hardest Poll ever tbh…Zealot is my favourite Class but Veteran is much more lacking…i would choose both if it was an Option..like both Trees kinda suck, no real variety due to tax nodes and placement of some nodes and some just suck but Zealot is still overall better / more viable but kinda only due to the whole Chorus/Crit/CDR Spam…ultimately i think im going to choose Veteran, ranged Specialist but you can’t really play Ranged in this Game and in Melee he just sucks and you kinda only have VoC Spam as choice. Zealot can still make Fury/Martyrdom work and be great and in Melee really great which you have to use 90% of the time anyway…so i’d say Veteran needs priority first. But tbh they need to rework both Trees ASAP. And for Zealot i think they need to change some Aura/Ability in their entirity, for Veteran just need to buff others / nerf VoC Spam and rework Tree but for Zealot Fury is great but i don’t see how it would hold up even against an nerfed Chorus…Loner should be removed and replaced with something else entirely…Zealot has imo cooler Options than Loner / Shroudfield lorewise for me Zealot is like an Melee/Paladin Champion, i rly dislike Loner/Shroudfield especially how it works in this Game and as said even if they nerf Chorus…keep Loner/Shroudfield and buff it with fury…chorus still going to be the choice to go
Where’s the psyker? There are at least a couple of talents that are mixed up in the tree in places and shouldn’t even be there from a logical point of view.
In general, all trees (except ogryn and arby) need to be redone
If only they could reach them somehow 
Zealot has few options but those work. Vet is my least played class. He provides ammo and toughness and that’s about it.
Vet’s tree is better designed that Zealots. While Vet is weaker now than Zealot, Vet has more options for viable builds than Zealot does.
Zealot tree needs a complete overhaul while Vet’s tree needs a tune up and some talents modernized.