Maybe let’s all hold off asking for turbo sweats 1.1 simply because you beat havoc in a week, and let’s instead ask for 10 new full size maps?
Despite the couple of recent new maps it really does feel like we’re still desperately stale in terms of map content.
Let’s make it a priority and get loads more maps then we can all get back to asking for in-depth sweats or infinite dmg value tweaks lol.
I can’t help but feel that perhaps the lack of map content is causing idle minds and thus requests for changes to things that we’d probably be ok with if we were distracted having fun with lots new missions.
a vicious circle of idle hands and misplaced requests.
While I wouldn’t mind new maps, I think core systems should be prioritized.
Ragnarok had a great post a few days ago about the disconnect between how the story is told despite the fact that one of the selling points of the game was there being a cohesive story. Alongside this was solo mode, but while I want them to prioritize that, it’s still not the most important thing to add.
We still don’t have a way to select maps and modifiers and there’s no way to follow a cohesive story line due to how the random missions work.
The priority, in my opinion, should be to now revamp the mission board to add a soft-campaign that let’s us select missions/modifiers/difficulty that has a cohesive story while still keeping the mission board and quickplay as the “hotzones where we need to deploy”. (then solo mode) then new maps to expand on both the story and more mission board options.
Payday 2, a game from 2014, had this functionality - you played through missions in order or could pull them from Crime.net’s randomish board, OR could pick some for a nominal ‘fee’.
Weapon balancing is a more burning issue. At this point I’d only ask to buff the weaker ones so they can at least somewhat live up to the broken stuff
More weapons (speicifically: Staves for Psyker. Beam and Bolt staff from VT2 for starters).
I wouldn’t mind some proper sniper rifles for Veteran (ie: long las which is used by the Scab Sniper) but Vet already has enough broken OP toys to play with.
Last but not least: More talents and/or talent tree branches instead of new classes.
I’d like to be able to play 2 matches in a row without crashing again but yeah. Rather new maps and such instead of some experimental new modes or “operations” that are just 10 minute farts in the wind.
We need new maps, new weapons and new enemies. That’s it, honestly.
But if I had to choose just one, yes, maps should be prioritised. Also I’d like to see non-linear maps that have multiple ways to proceed with the mission and maybe some randomization, i.e. 2-3 different hallways leading to the same point, but only one is not blocked and it makes each run slightly different.
Also add new train cars with different objectives to Rolling Steel.
Well yes, stability and maintenance goes without saying. I’d also like to play havoc without crashes lol. Those things are always being worked on in the background and shouldn’t affect new content or vice versa though.
New maps are always appreciated, but even now the number of maps is pretty high for a game of this type. The one thing is is an obvious flaw is the “biome” variety and a feel of uniqueness. That one is no where close to Vermintide 2 in my opinion.
If we are talking totally new biomes, assets and environments, I doubt Fatshark would be able to deliver 2 per year. No with the current dev pace. Not to dis them or anything, they clearly struggled with the dimensions of their 40k vision, also they kind of shot themselves in the foot with the whole Hive setting. There is only so much of character you can squeeze out from tunnels, hab areas and industrial estates.
Players are always able to consume new game content like maps far quicker than such content can be produced, and some point Fatshark will redirect most of their resources towards of a new project. There is only so much of “free” content that cosmetic “shop” can sustain.
On the topic of maps I was pleasantly surprised that the manufactorum power matrix repair map got updated pretty significantly. I remember before playing it, I was thinking after seeing the preview icon “wow, this has snow in it, like a big freezer?” and then there was nothing of that sort there, but people still commented on the temperature in the map which felt unfinished.
Here’s the preview icon just to show what I mean, you can clearly see snowflakes and frost:
Now, literally 2 years later, it has been updated to finally reflect what I assume the design intent was.
I’m bringing this up because I feel that the latest map drop was rushed in a pretty similar, if not more severe way and is not finished yet. I don’t think it was meant to end like this and have such impactless events. Like it doesn’t even have an extraction…
I guess my overall point is that I hope they add more content asap and continue to refine it in a similar way as this (but hopefully a little faster than 2 years after release, but I guess their release schedule for stuff made it so)
I think the issue isn’t with the Hive, and more with both the system, and the quality they want to have work.
Modular maps to have multiple missions in 1 sector does mean being able to rail road the player, which is easier in more cityscape than wilderness, as well as the ranged component.
And when you look at the quality and details of the maps, they’re very worked on.
From other 40k stories, there are some possible Sectors, more so when we look how Gloriana is a ‘snow sector’.
For example Necromunda has some noted ones:
Chem Forest: Indoor Greenhouses, with attached Breweries and Chem Stills
Hospital: Somewhat clean (well, was clean before the Dreg entered)
Undersea Ports: Might be in Tertium too, as there is a group named ‘Sumpdock Gang’
Plasma Discharge Station: Electrical plant
Vaults/Banks: As there are needed every where by every one (let us rob one)
But there are also other possible:
Spire: Noble quarters, higher than Throneside, maybe having the Noble be the Vocator of that mission
Space Port: Same height as Spire, but more utilitarian
Outskirt/Ridge: Outside map, where you’re on top of the atmospheric shields, on industry and Hab blocks
Then you have things outside the Hive, which could still have Scab/Dreg forces:
Witherland: Basically what ever is outside the Hive, we don’t really know but there are fossilised trees iirc covered with dunes
Tancred Bastion: The prologue ship, which most likely fell to the hands of the Scab and Dreg
Atrox, Atoma’s moon, where an Observatory Vault is, and where Scab and Dreg are laying siege.
What they could do is expand the similar-map roster for existing areas. Yes, there will be complaints, but if they do it quickly people would be less annoyed.
They could try new biomes, which will probably take up a lot of dev time.
Well story and core mechanics couldn’t be further from one another and whilst I adore the 40k world, I give absolutely zero cr@ps about the story in DT.
As long as I’m playing a fun horde game in a believable and pretty 40k world then that’s fine by me. I’ll happily believe whatever paper thin narrative is provided and will keep listening to the HH and other lore audio books for my narrative interests.
The fact it’s all tied to 1 planet via narrative is, imo, absolutely insane. If it had been much more vague then we could be on loads of different planets with different environments and/or enemies. They wrote themselves into a teeny tiny corner (of a VAST universe).
I get immersed in stories in single player games like stalker 2 and love to get sucked into them, but a coop horde game? I just want fun and loads of it. After over 1500 hours playtime I couldn’t even tell you the first thing about the missions beyond “we have to kill a really bad guy” or “stop the enemies plans”. I just don’t absorb it because I’m just focusing on the core mechanics - which is horde coop fun for 30 mins in a fun map.
Even havoc…I just see the new conditions and couldn’t tell you why they’re there or what the commisar is doing - I just don’t care. It doesn’t affect my enjoyment of the gameplay at all. If anything I’d say it keeps it a bit purer! Not getting hung up on “but that functionality might not fit with the complex web of lore they’ve woven in my head so now I must question it and get distracted from the fun”.
I’d much rather resources were spent knocking out playable content instead of shoe horning unnecessary narrative. I know others are interested in the lore but it’s not something I need in a game like this.
And I stand by my point that if there was a steady release of new maps and other playable content then people wouldn’t be even half as focused on wanting nothing but a never ending balance pass (which team will never stop grinding on anyway).
Playable content is king in an online coop horde game and it’s the bit that’s been least nurtured in DT.
Lots of development time spent on unlocked and loaded (which was cool but simply unlocking the weapons would have sufficed) and now havoc (which some new maps and enemies could have easily have done). They’ve spent years finding ways to rehash bits. It’s all been nice but I want new content now.
Yeah choosing map and modifier would definitely be fantastic but I’d prefer a whole range of new maps to keep us entertained first whilst they plug away on yet more mechanics rehash.
1 new biome a year would be cool and shouldn’t break the team now all the rehash overhauls are hopefully over. Art assets can be reused to the Nth degree, and once a palette of assets has been generated for a new biome then new maps can be dressed easily.
I’m sure we’d all be shocked at how few assets are used in this insanely detailed game. Artists are damn canny these days!
It’s the whitebox that matters most though IMO as it dictates pace, duration, space and encounters etc. Any whitebox can be dressed as any biome.
Designers will design the whitebox and artists will dress it. They can work on them separately and an artist can be dressing a finished whitebox whilst the designers are working on the next whitebox.
Many teams have designers dedicated to level design.
I understand that, and I wasn’t saying the story was a core mechanic, but more that accessing the story (mission board updates) needs work as well as making things more enjoyable. Imagine if they added 5 new maps and you only got to see 1 or 2 of them in a week because RNG didn’t favor you. The mission board update would let people access the missions they want to play as well as allow for the story to be more cohesive for those interested in following it instead of piecemealing what they can gather from random mission selections.
Edit: plus, the more maps added the more diluted the pool gets and the lower chance you’ll have to find a map you want to play in rotation. It’s just a terrible mission select system when it’s the only mission select system. As Ragnarok pointed out Payday 2 has a similar, yet better, system that gives you randomly selected options while also having the ability to pick a specific mission that you want to play.
I’ve been clamoring for new maps for the last year, we got 2 good new maps with Ascension and Archivum, then 2 more good maps with Warren and Mercantile in the carnival district, the the slowdown started.
We got Gloriana which is a great map but only 1, then 1/3 of a map with train (blech), then ~1/2 a new map with Dark Communion as it was heavily re-used like many of the launch maps, reverse layout which feels like it reduces total map count. So basically 2 - 2.33 vs the expected 6.
VT2 (and 1) had excellent map design since launch with interesting and varied locations, events and ofc U4|5 (it doesn’t mattah) voices to go along.
Worth reminding people that different roles in an organization exist, and the bottleneck is likely QA and testers, but that can at least be queued. I doubt you see techie devs making maps or graphical artists.
Maps are the lifeblood of these games, keep 'em coming!
Absolutely no arguments from me over the mission board update, I just want to have a smattering of new maps to enjoy whilst they work on it.
Otherwise we will wait another year playing the same maps we’ve played for years, for a new system that just allows us to play the same maps… then we’ll have to wait another year for any new maps.
You won’t get bored of the new maps if you don’t get to play them much via the RNG nonsense
100%. There are even many sub roles within roles and they will all move to the job that requires them the most, which is almost never the same thing for the whole team at the same time.
I’d be shocked if they didn’t have at least 1 or 2 level designers who sit and make white boxes for most the time.
