I’ll have to try it out and see if it works then.
Again, a link to the enemy health spreadsheet.
To the best of my knowledge, Hunter’s Prowl acts like a Strength Potion, which does one of two things to Chaos Warriors:
- Changes their armour type from 6 (“Super” Armour) to 2 (“Regular” Armour)
- Changes their amour type to infantry, but reduces all damage taken by half
Strength potions change every other enemy in the game to infantry, but I am not able to 1 shot a Chaos Warrior with a build that would normally do 120 damage to infantry (under the effects of Hunter’s Prowl with “I’m Coming for Ya”, this would do 42.25 * 2.5 * 1.2 = 126.75 base damage, more than enough to kill).
Considering simply reducing all damage taken by half seems slightly obtuse, I made my calculations under the assumption that it changes their damage type to regular old armoured. Unfortunately, if it reduces all damage taken by half, but changes them to infantry, reaching the 120 damage threshold is impossible.
round(round(round(42.25 * 1.2 * 1.2) * 2.7) *1.2) / 2 = 98.75 maximum possible damage
Of course, this is assuming that by changing the armour type of the Chaos Warrior, bonus multipliers then apply to the new armour type and not the original. It also assumes that my assumptions are correct. If someone could test/verify these, I’d really appreciate it. I’m starting to run pretty low on green dust!
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I’ll dust off my huntsman gear and see what I can roll with %Chaos and %Armour.
I’ve got terribly bad luck, and no vet items, so might not be able to test. But I’ll try.
Huntsman should one shot bodyshot armored targets? Really? Have people just given up on trying to play well in Legend? The only special which should really be one shot regardless of where you aim is the assassin, which is already the case (at least with my gear).
The amount of silly threads/posts I keep reading on every forum asking to nerf Legend into being basically Champion is astonishing. RIP difficulty, you’ll be missed.
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Yes, in champ still bodyshot, in legend nope.
I decided to use my brain and just test the damage the bow can do on Champion, where Chaos Warriors only have 80 health. Even with a 10% bonus vs Chaos, and the “I’m Comin for Ya” talent, it still takes 2 body shots to kill. This means a body shot under Hunter’s Prowl does somewhere between 60 and <80 damage.
Messing around with other damage values, it also doesn’t seem like it literally turns Chaos Warriors into a different damage type. Strength potions don’t seem to either. Both of these give large buffs vs. armour, and allow any weapon to penetrate them, but the numbers don’t line up. It seems other people in the chat are correct when they say +20% vs Chaos is the best you can do, and that probably won’t 1 body shot a Chaos Warrior even on Champion.
In short, I think it’s impossible to 1 body shot a Chaos Warrior at the moment without some combination of strength potions, buffs, and crits, and maybe not even then. Best just aim for the head. I’ll rectify my original post.
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Two things:
-
Thanks a lot for these information; I wanted to do some tests but university takes too much time.
If you let, I have some questions/explanations:
° I don’t understand wich “group of specials/elites” I can bodyshot and wich bonus I need; for expample:
“If you choose “x” bonus you can kill “y” group of specials”; -
Anyway I think isn’t fair that huntsman needs all these “complication” (and a lot of green dust :P), while career like Pyro and BH can bodyshot ALL;
Also, in this way, I can’t use precious bonus like power against bosses and crit chance.
- If he can’t bodyshot SV, this advantage is removed;
- CW:
° without active he can’t do anything;
° active gives us only 5 seconds, we can just kill two CWs (and only if the field is free);
° we should avoid CW patrols; - About bosses, I could agree, but also Keri does great damage… and she can to aim head’s bosses with easiness;
So, when will they nerf Pyro and BH (o buff WS and Huntsman, I would prefer it)?
You can still run crit chance, just not if you want to 2 shot maulers AND 1 shot most skaven specials and SV. If you don’t care about 2 shotting maulers, a skaven+armored charm and a skaven+crit chance bow will work fine. Also, that will still give you +20% against skaven type bosses (ogre, fiend, spinemanglr, skittergate bosses), so it isnt a big loss either.
You haven’t read my entire post, I know that you can do full damage without full charge… but this, in comparison to WS, gives us less time to aim.
I’m trying to understand the best combination.
WTF? Pyro and BH can bodyshot all + have more bullets + have more versatility + have panic button active;
Could you explain me better? I’m trying to understand wich bonus I need to bodyshot wich specials/elites. Thanks.
Skaven and armored on your charm, skaven on your bow. You will be able to bodyshot stormvermin, warpfire throwers, ratling gunners, packmasters, and gutter runners.
Great write-up, thanks.
Does all of that account for the new crit damage algorithm?
I tried to show which damage type specials were in my original post, but I’ll reiterate:
Each enemy has two types, their race, and their amour type. Bonuses for both apply against them. Again, this refers to this spreadsheet.
- Infantry (1): Gutter Runner, Globadier, Leech, Blightstormer, Chaos Mauler (body only), all “weaker” enemies
- Armoured (2): Ratling Gunner, Warpfire Thrower, Stormvermin
- Monster (3): Packmaster, all bosses
- Berserker (5): Plague Monks, Chaos Savages
- “Super Armour” (6): Chaos Warriors, Chaos Mauler (head only)
I’m sure you can decipher which units count as Skaven and which as Chaos without my aid.
Both your weapon and your charm (assuming they’re blue/orange) can have up to two “Damage vs. X” on them. While not important here, it’s useful to keep in mind melee weapons can only have Damage vs. Skaven/Chaos on them; aka no vs. armour bonuses. This means you have up to four total buffs to work with. Buffs range from a minimum of +5% to a maximum of +10%.
To simplify, in order to get what I would suggest are the most useful, versatile breakpoints, you’ll need at minimum:
- 3 buffs totaling (~+23 vs. Skaven AND Armoured)
- 1 buff of (6.5 vs. Chaos OR Infantry)
This will allow you to kill a Stormvermin, Warpfire Thrower, Ratling Gunner, and Gutter Runner with a charged shot to the body. an uncharged crit to the body with also kill a Gutter Runner. Additionally, you will be able to kill a Chaos Mauler (the big guys with the helmet) in 2 shots to the body. All other specials will take two body shots, but this is true of any weapon without crits.
Same buffs are additive, and then applied multiplicative to your damage somewhere after the new scaleback from 5x to 3.5x power. To the best of my knowledge, buffs round to the nearest .25 after every multiplicative calculation. For example:
A bow with (+8.5 damage vs Armoured and +6% damage vs Skaven) combined with a charm with (+7% damage vs Armoured) would give:
- (31.75 base damage) * (1 + .085 + .070 damage vs. armoured) = 36.671 = 36.75 * (1 + .060 damage vs. skaven) = 38.955 = 39 final damage
You can ballpark it pretty easily without being so precise, though. In general, just add all of your bonuses up and multiply your base damage by them. Unless it’s very close to a breakpoint, you’ll be fine. The margin for error isn’t that big.
It’s worthwhile to keep in mind that Power vs. Skaven/Chaos also apply to bosses, so you are getting up to 10% extra damage there. The needed percentages also aren’t that high, and there’s some variability in the traits you need, so actually getting this setup isn’t too hard. If other traits are that important to you, it’s possible to just take two buffs (X vs. Skaven OR Armoured) totalling ~16.5%, which will allow you to open up two buff slots for your power vs. Monster or increased crit chance.
Yes, these are tested with the 1.0.5 version of the game. I derived the crit multiplier though tests with weapons with different bonuses for accuracy. It seems as if it’s now applied around the same stage power bonuses are.
Keep in mind I o̶n̶l̶y̶ accounted for crits with the uncharged body shot, for it’s ability to kill a Gutter Runner in 1 shot with buffs. The headshot and crit buffs are identical for the uncharged attack (x1.4), as well as the charged attack (x1.7). With my recommended setup, it is not possible to 1 shot a Mauler to the body with a crit, although it is possible to do so with at least 3 bonuses against Chaos/Infantry. T̶h̶e̶ ̶h̶e̶a̶d̶s̶h̶o̶t̶ ̶b̶o̶n̶u̶s̶ ̶(̶x̶1̶.̶7̶)̶ ̶i̶s̶ ̶a̶c̶t̶u̶a̶l̶l̶y̶ ̶l̶o̶w̶e̶r̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶c̶r̶i̶t̶ ̶b̶o̶n̶u̶s̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶a̶ ̶c̶h̶a̶r̶g̶e̶ ̶a̶t̶t̶a̶c̶k̶ ̶,̶ ̶s̶o̶ ̶a̶n̶y̶t̶h̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶a̶ ̶h̶e̶a̶d̶s̶h̶o̶t̶ ̶w̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ ̶k̶i̶l̶l̶,̶ ̶a̶ ̶c̶r̶i̶t̶ ̶a̶l̶s̶o̶ ̶w̶o̶u̶l̶d̶.̶ ̶C̶o̶n̶s̶i̶d̶e̶r̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶h̶e̶a̶d̶s̶h̶o̶t̶s̶ ̶a̶l̶r̶e̶a̶d̶y̶ ̶d̶o̶ ̶w̶e̶l̶l̶ ̶e̶n̶o̶u̶g̶h̶ ̶d̶a̶m̶a̶g̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶k̶i̶l̶l̶ ̶a̶n̶y̶t̶h̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶o̶u̶t̶ ̶b̶u̶f̶f̶s̶,̶ ̶i̶t̶’̶s̶ ̶s̶a̶f̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶s̶a̶y̶ ̶c̶r̶i̶t̶s̶ ̶w̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ ̶a̶s̶ ̶w̶e̶l̶l̶.̶
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Oh woopsie, thought I read it thoroughly but somehow managed to miss that point.
And yeah, it has a pretty steep learning curve that one.
But once one learns a faster aim, it’s one mean weapon (and I ain’t there yet either).
To be fair, WS is fully focused around enhancing her ranged gameplay. If your comparing any other class to in terms of time to aim it’s kind of unfair. You shouldn’t be outdoing what a class specializes in better than the class itself. Chances are if they play WS they are pretty used to sniping and will beat you to the punch in a lot situations in terms of specials and elites.You have tools that you can use that she can’t, thats why your class exists. Not to fair up against other classes.
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Thanks again. So I should have, using the four slot for “bonus vs X” (bow + charm), at least:
- 23% (adding % vs skaven + % vs armoured);
- 6.5% vs chaos OR infantry (they should be the same thing, but if I choose chaos, I will have bonus against all bosses thanks also the % against skaven… right?);
In this way, I can bodyshot: SV, Warpfire, Ratling and Gutter.
Right?
One last doubt: why 16.5% vs skaven or armoured? Ok, in this way, I have free slot for monster/crit… but bodyshot should become impossible.
We are saying the same thing, I think. Keri should be the queen of long ranged gameplay and mirate shot… and, for this reason, it’s ridicolous that also huntsman needs headshot. Aim to headshot is WS’ style, in fact Kruber’s bow suck as accuracy. His style is (was) bodyshotting and to lack of versatily (another WS advantage).