After 1.0.5 Huntsman has lost his role

[LEGEND 600 POWER]

LINKED THREAD: http://forums.fatsharkgames.com/t/huntsman-bad-synergy-with-his-weapons/21571/31

We have a ranged meta, four ranged careers and one big problem: Huntsman (and Waystalker) is outdated by ranged meta. Pyromancer and Bounty Hunter are top tier, they can do everything and better… Let me explain.

IMPORTANT: I’m NOT here to ask a bare nerf to Pyro and BH, I only would like some balance to ranged careers

  • Simply, Pyro and BH:
    • can kill all specials without searching heads;
    • can do crowd control;
    • can melt bosses;
    • have “panic button” super;
    • have “infinite” ammunitions;
    • can kill at any range (just BH, with some weapons, lacks just a little in long range);

I repeat myself: they can do everything.

  • Waystalker:
    • is a versatile career: HP regen, “infinite” ammunitions, “panic button” super… BUT
    • to kill specials she needs headshot;
    • to do crowd control she wastes a lot of arrows;
    • to melt bosses she needs headshot;

(WS should need more words, but I don’t want to go off topic)

  • Huntsman:
    • can bodyshot specials, BUT
      1. ONLY SOME of them;
      2. and also, he needs four nearly perfect bonus power vs X… so he can’t have some precious build, like crit and power vs monster;
    • can melt bosses, BUT he needs headshot (and it’s not always possibile to aim boss’ head);
    • hasn’t “panic button” super
      1. enemies will continue to attack you;
      2. you can’t go through enemies;
      3. it lasts only 5 seconds (x1,5 damage for 5 seconds, it’s not enough; also 5 seconds aren’t enough to stealth action; it could be nice just against CW patrols, but we must avoid them)
    • can recovers ammunitions, BUT very badly;

There are other problems, like talents about headshot but weapons that lack about accuracy or that he has just bow (other weapons are so bad)… but this is another story (look linked thread)

6 Likes

roll bonus power.

3 Likes

You haven’t read my entire post.

I have +10% to chaos and skaven on my charm as well as 10% inf on my bow. Executioners take 2 charged shots and storms still take 2. All specials take 2 besides the assassin.

1 Like

Is that with headshots or bodyshots?

there was a guy who mathed it out on the patch test forum before it was hidden. stacking armored/skaven, i believe the number was…24%? it was completely possible to body shot them still though.

not saying it’s fun to stack like that, as the elf has to get more than 10% just to body shot a gutter runner and i don’t think she can even reach a point where it takes less than 3 body shots on stormvermin, but that’s where the breakpoints are at now.

1 Like

Also, did you see the spot in the patch notes where they buffed the heck out of Huntsman?

Yes, and so… ? Some seconds less for an useless active? 15% more crit chance after headshot with a bow not thought to accurate aim? This doesn’t affect the disadvantages.

Sorry, maybe it’s for my english, but 24% to bodyshot who?

Useless? Come on now. You’re the first person I’ve heard complain about his bow not being accurate, are you playing with a controller? Sounds like maybe you only want to play a specific way and these balance changes make that difficult.

Wtf? We have Pyro and BH that can bodyshot ALL… we have WS that needs headshot but her bow is thought to accurate aim and she has panic button active and she can recover bullets and she has regen; now also huntsman needs headshot but without Kerillian’s versatility and with a bow not thought to aim heads (it loses accuracy);

This, simply, is a fact.

huntsman slams elites hard and more frequently than the other careers tho and even after this patch i still slam specials with him

though I just been playing champion since the patch went live, don’t know about how effective he is in legendary now

Huntsman’s big advantage over waystalker is stormvermin, chaos knights, and bosses. He also gets the halberd which is an ultra-premium melee weapon that solves all problems at a luxury range.

Compare anything to BH and pyro and they’ll look bad.

Has anyone tried the repeater on him after 1.05? With the changes to crit damage and his headshot talent he might really melt some face.

I made the post in the beta forums. I will reiterate that information here:
(enemy health spreadsheet; Leech and Blightstormers are now identical, Infantry / 60 health)

Uncharged Shot (Infantry):

  • Base Damage: 22.5
  • 10% bonus + 20% bonus: 29.75
  • 15% bonus + 16% bonus: 30
  • Crit/Headshot (x1.4 bonus): 31.5
  • Crit/Headshot with 8.5% bonus + 14% bonus: 39

Charged Shot (Infantry):

  • Base Damage: 42.25
  • 19% bonus + 19% bonus: 60
  • 6.5% bonus: 45
  • Crit/Headshot (x1.7 bonus): 71.75
  • Crit (x1.7 bonus) with 10% + 10% bonus: 86.25
  • Crit (x1.7 bonus) with 8% bonus + 16% bonus: 90

Charged Shot (Armoured):

  • Base Damage: 31.75
  • 10% bonus: 35
  • 10% bonus + 10% bonus: 38.5
  • 8% bonus + 14% bonus: 39
  • H̶u̶n̶t̶e̶r̶’̶s̶ ̶P̶r̶o̶w̶l̶ ̶(̶x̶2̶.̶5̶ ̶b̶o̶n̶u̶s̶)̶:̶ ̶̶̶8̶4̶.̶7̶5̶̶̶
  • H̶u̶n̶t̶e̶r̶’̶s̶ ̶P̶r̶o̶w̶l̶ ̶(̶h̶e̶a̶d̶s̶h̶o̶t̶)̶:̶ ̶̶̶1̶9̶8̶.̶5̶0̶̶̶
  • H̶u̶n̶t̶e̶r̶’̶s̶ ̶P̶r̶o̶w̶l̶ ̶(̶"̶I̶’̶m̶ ̶C̶o̶m̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶Y̶a̶ ̶2̶0̶%̶ ̶b̶o̶n̶u̶s̶,̶ ̶8̶.̶5̶%̶ ̶b̶o̶n̶u̶s̶ ̶+̶ ̶1̶6̶%̶ ̶b̶o̶n̶u̶s̶)̶:̶ ̶̶̶1̶2̶0̶̶̶

Some important breakpoints (Legend difficulty only):

  • 36 health: Gutter Runner (Skaven/Infantry), Ratling Gunner and Warpfire Thrower (Skaven/Armoured)
  • 39 health: Stormvermin (Skaven/Armoured)
  • 60 health: Globadier (Skaven/Infantry), Leech and Blightstormer (Chaos/Infantry)
  • 90 health: Mauler, body shots only (Chaos/Infantry)

To summarize, it is possible to create a bow/charm combination which can 1 charge shot all skaven armoured units, including Stormvermin, as well as kill all chaos infantry with 2 bodyshots, including Maulers. It will also be able to kill a Gutter Runner with a crit/headshot uncharged shot. This effectively allows it to retain almost the exact same usefulness it had pre-1.0.5.

An example of such a bow/charm combination may be:

  • Longbow (+7% vs. Armoured, +8.5% vs. Skaven)
  • Charm (+7% vs. Armoured, +6.5% vs. Infantry or Chaos)

** Please ignore the below, upon further testing it looks like it was made under false assumptions, and is not possible **

̶A̶d̶d̶i̶t̶i̶o̶n̶a̶l̶l̶y̶,̶ ̶b̶y̶ ̶t̶a̶k̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶“̶I̶m̶ ̶C̶o̶m̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶f̶o̶r̶ ̶Y̶a̶”̶ ̶t̶a̶l̶e̶n̶t̶,̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶s̶t̶a̶c̶k̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶s̶l̶i̶g̶h̶t̶l̶y̶ ̶h̶i̶g̶h̶e̶r̶ ̶a̶n̶d̶ ̶m̶o̶r̶e̶ ̶s̶p̶e̶c̶i̶f̶i̶c̶ ̶m̶o̶d̶i̶f̶i̶e̶r̶s̶,̶ ̶y̶o̶u̶ ̶s̶h̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶a̶b̶l̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶g̶e̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶s̶a̶m̶e̶ ̶r̶e̶s̶u̶l̶t̶s̶ ̶a̶s̶ ̶a̶b̶o̶v̶e̶ ̶A̶N̶D̶ ̶b̶e̶ ̶a̶b̶l̶e̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶1̶ ̶s̶h̶o̶t̶ ̶a̶ ̶C̶h̶a̶o̶s̶ ̶W̶a̶r̶r̶i̶o̶r̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶b̶o̶d̶y̶ ̶u̶n̶d̶e̶r̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶e̶f̶f̶e̶c̶t̶s̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶H̶u̶n̶t̶e̶r̶’̶s̶ ̶P̶r̶o̶w̶l̶ ̶(̶H̶u̶n̶t̶s̶m̶a̶n̶’̶s̶ ̶a̶c̶t̶i̶v̶e̶)̶.̶ ̶I̶ ̶c̶u̶r̶r̶e̶n̶t̶l̶y̶ ̶d̶o̶ ̶n̶o̶t̶ ̶h̶a̶v̶e̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶r̶e̶q̶u̶i̶r̶e̶d̶ ̶e̶q̶u̶i̶p̶m̶e̶n̶t̶ ̶t̶o̶ ̶t̶e̶s̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶i̶s̶ ̶i̶n̶ ̶p̶r̶a̶c̶t̶i̶c̶e̶,̶ ̶h̶o̶w̶e̶v̶e̶r̶,̶ ̶s̶o̶ ̶i̶t̶ ̶i̶s̶ ̶o̶n̶l̶y̶ ̶s̶p̶e̶c̶u̶l̶a̶t̶i̶v̶e̶.̶ ̶S̶u̶c̶h̶ ̶a̶ ̶b̶o̶w̶/̶c̶h̶a̶r̶m̶ ̶c̶o̶m̶b̶i̶n̶a̶t̶i̶o̶n̶ ̶s̶h̶o̶u̶l̶d̶ ̶l̶o̶o̶k̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶:̶̶

  • L̶o̶n̶g̶b̶o̶w̶ ̶(̶+̶8̶%̶ ̶v̶s̶.̶ ̶A̶r̶m̶o̶u̶r̶e̶d̶,̶ ̶+̶8̶.̶5̶%̶ ̶v̶s̶.̶ ̶S̶k̶a̶v̶e̶n̶)̶
  • C̶h̶a̶r̶m̶ ̶(̶+̶8̶%̶ ̶v̶s̶.̶ ̶A̶r̶m̶o̶u̶r̶e̶d̶,̶ ̶+̶8̶.̶5̶%̶ ̶v̶s̶.̶ ̶C̶h̶a̶o̶s̶)̶

** End ignore**

Considering this, as well as some of the buffs he received in the recent patch, Huntsman is capable of doing many things no other class can with his longbow. Is this information extremely convoluted and not well presented in the game? Absolutely. No average player will figure out how to specifically min/max his bow to hit these breakpoints, nor is it likely they’ll stumble upon this. But lack of information in the game is another issue, for those who put the required effort/grind in, Huntsman is currently a unique and viable class.

8 Likes

The bow is accurate as heck if you don’t draw it all the way. Full draw (when the zoom kicks in) brings inaccuracy, as is not the case with Kerillian’s longbow.

Accurate and fast to shoot with: it’s a special killer roles dream come true.

Try to get +10% Skaven on Bow and +10% Skave and 10% Armor on charm. This will give 30% more Power vs Stormvermins. If you still can’t bodyshot them- sorry, not possible.

I was told that CW don’t count as infantry or armoured? Is this not correct? Is there an updated spreadsheet somewhere where I can find which enemies are affected by which modifiers?

It’s correct, currenty Power vs Armor is bugged and on CWs it does not count to it.

Infantry are only trash mobs and Marauders/Fanatatics/Clan Rats. Zerkers are their own category.

Thanks. Wondering what specific modifiers Positron was talking about to one shot CW under hunters prowl? 20% Chaos?

Trying to find a build to deal with CW patrols fast on Legend, as two of my usual teammates are so bad at dodging it’s often a last man standing or wipe situation when we aggro them.

Only Power vs Chaos works on CWs now so 20% is max what you can do.

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