About third person

Hi there,

Notice : Please don’t talk about increasing FoV, or taking meds, or whatever ELSE than using third person here. It’s really the only way to play games without puking all over the place for some people.

I’m not used to post on community forums, but the matter at hand should be expressed sooner or later, so I might as well share my experience and give my opinion and suggestions right away.

Some people can’t play FPS because of motion sickness. That’s a plain fact, you can read about them all over the internet, and even on steam forums talking about mod support prior to the 1.0 release of V2. However, most of these can handle third person without discomfort.

A tale of friendship and rat slaying

On Vermintide 1, the third person mod allowed them to play with us and that was great. I personally have some friends that can’t handle FPS view, and we greatly enjoyed countless hours of fun and rat slaying thanks to this mod, rekindling my interest in the game.

As soon as Vermintide 2 was announced, our first question was “will we be able to play it third person ?” and we were thrilled to see that mods were going to be supported, and even encouraged.

Mod support however was not present at release, but we didn’t care that much, we understood that it needed additionnal polishing, the roadmap showed us mod support for april/may, and we learned that most V1 mods will most likely get adjusted for use in V2, so those of us that can play FPS went ahead to get the feel of the game a bit.

Now that mod support is there, we could gather the whole crew again ! Yipee ! Unfortunately, because of the modded realm not giving away loot and exp, I won’t surprise you by telling you that the game is way less fun, not being rewarded for runs and all.

I know that in summer (or up to this winter for the pessimistic ones) we will have sanctioned mods that allow progression in official realm, but the process of selection is going to be a very arcane and subjective one.

What if third person view is going to be considered too big of an advantage and refused in official realm ? Why can’t my friends and I not share the fun as before ?

Why isn’t third person view not that big of an advantage ?

Let’s review all the arguments I already read

  • This gives an unfair environmental awareness advantage : I agree that it does give an advantage, but I won’t call it unfair : this comes at the expense of being able to easily target head, most importantly on close combat. So I’d say it’s a trade off between seing your surroundings and being able to clear armored enemies efficiently.

  • The game is less immersive : True, but that won’t get the immersion out of your game if another player is using third person. This can and should be left at the player’s discretion if he is willing to reduce his immersion by playing third person.

  • Having third person players in PUG will ruin it as they can’t handle armor/can’t aim : Might be a fair point, might not be. I’d guess that the environmental awareness VS loss of headshot capability might be somewhat balanced, as the third person might take less damage from unseen rat backstabbery i nexchange of taking extra time to kill armored enemies… As for the aim with ranged weapons, it is as precise in third person as in first person, except if you’re trying to use ranged in close combat.

  • The game is meant to be played FPS / The character looks clumsy : Well that’s just not an argument. We’re talking about modding a game, so please don’t go on “it’s not vanilla”, that the whole point. And yes, I’ve seen this argument quite a lot…

  • Just increase FoV, ny aunt did that and it even cured her from all illnesses / Take motion sickness medicine : Again, not real arguments about the topic at hand. For some people, increasing FoV don’t work, and taking meds to play a game seems a bit off anyway.

  • You will get used to FPS anyway, just keep on playing : Having someone puke on his keyboard barely 2 minutes into the game is not an experience I’m willing to renew anytime soon. Having it done regularily until this player can handle FPS better is not how I will enjoy the game.

Suggestion 1 : Have a separate progression save on modded and official realm
Progress will be enabled on modded realm, but progress on both realms will be distinct and will never converge. This way, people playing with mods can still progress, but people only playing vanillia will never have to worry about those “god damn cheater that got this red item with a hack when I spent 1000 hours into getting it”.

Now I know that may not be that easy, and that would most likely mean additionnal running costs for FS (up to twice the amount of data to keep for accounts), but at least that would get both parts of the player base happy.

Suggestion 2 : Be very open about the process of selecting sanctioned mods
This one is not really open to discussion between players I’m afraid, it’s just a friendly reminder to our devs/community managers that players don’t handle very well one-sided decisions affecting their gameplay that are not thoroughly argumented/explained. This was seen as the constant ramble of the feedback section at every patch.

So please, when you get to sanction mods, keep in mind that for some players that may be the difference between playing the game or not. Whether you sanction a given mod or not, open a topic explaining the reasoning of the dev team. Better then, before making the decision, let players give you their point of view.

Suggestion 3 : Let host choose if he allows mods or not
While some people may still whine that players will be able to get cosmetic items easily and “that does not reflect player level anymore”, I think many more don’t care.

If the host had the ability to allow mods or not, and still get the loot/xp for the whole party, that may solve the issue without much additionnal cost to FS. It will certainly solve our problem, as we’re only playing between friends anyway.

TL;DR : third person will be the only way to enjoy the game for some players. We should do something so they can play and earn xp/loot too.

15 Likes

That is the best solution, but considering the decrease of population, VT2 can’t afford any community split.

I hope third person just gets whitelisted, it is true that it gives an advantage of awareness, but I think the disadvantage of not being able to reliably get headshots and making aiming slightly harder with ranged weapons definitely outweighs the awareness. I like the third person animations a lot and I would definitely switch back and forth.

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Did not know that first person was an actual problem for people before now. I certanly hope that this thread gets some love. One problem with the 3rd person animations in this game is that they don’t always accurately represent what you are actually doing timing and hitobox wise.

Also for the “Having third person players in PUG will ruin it as they can’t handle armor/can’t aim”
Loads of people suck at videogames without being in 3rd person in a 1st person game. The skill level of players will always be varying in public games.

Maybe the mod needs some more work in order to be sanctioned.(situational camera for cramped places etc, I dunno).

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WELL if you are worried about people joining and playing third person you could always leave the match or host your own and ask if anyone is then kick them if you feel it will be a problem. I played Vermintide 1 for over 250 hours in third person and was no less short of a GOD and many people can see a huge difference in when playing in 3rd. I prefer it over first because for me I’m not just some walking arms and a weapon I actually have an avatar in game that I am controlling helps with immersion a bit…with that said its not a cheat many games are played in third person and this one is no different that it can be

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Vermintide in first person: brutal combat game.
Vermintide in third person: terrible animations, worse than Skyrim.

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…………lol I’m done with people I cant

I love third person view in games! Please, Fatshark sanction it!

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hello everyone
i really want to buy this game but see is only have the 1 Person View and idk why but this make me feel bad and sometime sick , my friend told me is got a mods in 3rd Person View , i just need to know if the mods is legit before i buy the game thank you ,

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Well the mod works but it’s not as good as in a proper 3rd person game also it’s not sanctioned meaning you won’t be able to play with the main player base and must remain in the modded realm.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1381145345

Uh, no.

The animations in 3rd person are so terrible. You wouldn’t even be able to hit anything.

True, you’ll be able to see everything so you won’t get hit as often but you also won’t be able to kill anything.

I think his main problem is motion sickness here.

@charley222 It’s kinda sad but I don’t think it’ll be sanctionned, due to the policy of sanctionned mods. So you will be able to play in 3rd personn, but in modded realm only, which means less player base, no rewards, and you can end up on game with player with unbalanced mod (No cooldown, infinite ammo, etc…)

1 Like

ic thank for info

Coming back here to this topic after a while to give it some more love( hope fatshark notices.)
I think the main problem here is the effort and time it requiers to make 3rd person viable. That includes an entire 3rd person animation rework to better reflect whats actually happening ( an addition 1st person players would love as well) and some in depth camera work to make fighting back against wall not visual hell.

I think it will be a while before fatshark has time/money for that.

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I can’t agree more! I really hope that FatShark is able to take a look at this on a serious note. It could be great to get some more dedicated players into the game! I am mostly posting in hopes that we get a mod-response, but what I really want is for more players to get to enjoy the game.

Player animations being more effectively displayed could be seriously tricky, but would also be a welcome improvement!

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Honestly, I don’t think animations is that bad when you play with third person on the modded realm.

Its on the level of skyrim, I think.

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+1

Let people play how they want.

Mods sanctioning should be in place to prevent cheating, not to enforce a specific way of playing the game.

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I, too, would really love to see this sanctioned - I have friends who would love to play, but motion sickness is an issue for them, just like with OP. If third person were an option, that’d definitely help them.

IMHO this mod is not needed as you’ve urself mentioned - game looks bad in TP.

It looks fine in TP, but that ISNT THE POINT. Did you see any of the posts above? Some people get motion sickness in first person so TP is the only way they can play. So yes, it is needed.

Why not join the Fatshark Discord https://discord.gg/K6gyMpu