It was more of an example about how powercreep made the initial limitations of build diversity redundant.
Even though i agree with you that Moonbow is certainly a weapon that is effective against everything, i cant agree with your assessment of OE. A panic button is in my opinion not needed for OE because he can be a counter to everything. Superior Gaskets + Linked Compression Chamber easily lets you have your ulti up for most of the threats and the ulti starts firing with full pressure. That can easily handle every special except the armoured ones, which you are right about. But for those we also have the Trollhammer. Its not like OE is ever out of ammunition. Coghammer deals with the rest. It is indeed a character build that can deal with every threat the game throws at you, efficiently.
Edit: We also have Leading Shots, which helps against armored specials when using the ultimate.
Guys, I have idea so crazy it just might work.
What if we remove the whole concept of career skills?
It seems to me that they are the main problem of VT2 āgame balanceā.
So I suggest the following:
Delete conc potion;
Turn career skills into either extra weapons or talents/passives.
Does it solve the ult spam? Yes.
Does it add variety into gameplay? Yes.
Does it remove powercreep? Yes.
Does it make careers more or less equal in terms of fighting monsters? More or less, I guess .
But itās not without disadvantages. One, IMO, is that youāre almost defenseless once something is in your face. Lack of a panic button has been the main critique the career (legitimately or otherwise) since its early days.
I donāt know about you, but itās quite common for me to get surprise jumped by enemies, especially on cata. They might jump off a cliff, dig from a hole, come from around a corner, or spawn out of thin air behind you - often in an attacking animation - because fatshark has thought thatās a nice thing to implement when you are wielding a ranged weapon, and not always, especially not in public games, you can rely on your team-mates to help you. Also, some enemies you canāt kill in time with a crank gun - perhaps because you were cranking, perhaps you were in melee because of bad positioning or a need of temp HP. It happens, and then thereās often not much you can do besides block and wait for your mates. (or now go boom once with the torpedo )
Ideally in an open field itās exactly like you say, and thatās true of many scenarios, but the reality of the game, without even mentioning what specials can do to a team, is something else. With torpedo and crankgun the possibility to snipe is there, but itās a rare time when you can and it works.
@Romucha Iām not sure if youāre joking, but yeah (except for the variety bit. the ultimates add variety ). But yeah, I think ultimates were a big design mistake, itās the main reason why we need thousands of enemies over the hundreds we had in the first game.
I think itās too late and I would not remove them in VT2, but Iād definitely design VT3 without them: a hybrid of VT1 and VT2 mechanics, moving closer to the first.
I mean, i do know the occasional stab from behind, like we all do i assume. Its like a main feature of the game at this point. But i experience this with every career.
I do not quite understand your example about the disadvantage. I am not really defensless when something is in my face as OE, since i have a Coghammer that deals with the stuff that wants to get in my face. If you talk about having the mini-gun out and then getting swarmed, well, that is a scenario where you should not have the mini-gun out.
One of the reasons why OE became my main is the fact that you have to know when exactly you should use the mini-gun and then how to position yourself to get the most out of it. Hordes are for example not really the threat to use your mini-gun on, except your position allows it, like in a bottleneck. The bridge after the first tome in Into the Nest is a perfect example, because hordes and specials can only come from the front or from behind. But most often you are in a position where a horde can come from various directions and that usually ends in making yourself some room/getting to your team to be able to eventually use the gun for the special spawns.
Since these attacks arent constant i usually have my gun full again for the next encounter. Deal with the specials, crank the gun up, wait for next encounter, repeat.
Properly sniping is indeed a problem, wont deny that, but those are skillshots. They are more challenging, but can be made. I actually very much like to use the Trollhammer as artillery piece on enemies far away.
Do not get me wrong though, this is not an elaborate āgit gudā comment. I fully understand your perspective and your arguments in regard to me claiming that OE can be a master of all. Because even though he can be build to counter everything, he can fall apart easily when he doesnt have any support. Though i wouldnt say its because of a lack of Panick button, but more about his rather slow mechanics. If you are alone against horde + specials and your ulti is empty and trollhammer has to be reloaded, well i hope you have experience with true solo gameplay. I dont have it and when i am alone i get stressed out, its most likely a death for me.
Yeah I practiced a lot in the keep, testing range and such. My two favorite games are āhit the stormvermin dummies while standing close to oleysaā and āmake a torpedo pass through a high windowā.
Too bad in a game thereās always a moonbow standing in the way of true art.
Iād say even with a ready ultimate thatās a problematic situation. (do you use the faster ultimate btw? is it that good?). If thereās elites or monks in the mix I want to rely on block or stagger rather than swap to the crank gun.
Yeah donāt worry, it didnāt get through as such. I enjoy the engineer a lot and I agree it has great potential, iām generally against the buffs suggested for it. Maybe some quality of life, but itās fine as is. I just think that while very powerful in experienced hands, its strenghts are not without a tradeoff, so heās not the career Iād target with a nerf (since the thread is about discussing balance).
Iām by no means a master of the trade, if I really want to win a match Iāll play Ironbreaker, which is were my real experience is.
Yes, i always use the talent for the fast firing ultimate. With Leading Shots the ulti is almost like the armor piercing one and i usually have enough bar to kill all the specials in an encounter, so i dont need the other talent that refreshes the bar after a special kill. If you havent tried it out yet, i fully recommend it. It certainly melts all kinds of infantry and is decent against monster. But the most important thing about it is that it doesnt need to heat up. You get the full force immediately.
Personally, i dont think OE needs a buff. Maybe a rework of some talents, but which career doesnt need that? I can easily live without any changes to the career though.
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)
). But yeah, I think ultimates were a big design mistake, itās the main reason why we need thousands of enemies over the hundreds we had in the first game.
I practiced a lot in the keep, testing range and such. My two favorite games are āhit the stormvermin dummies while standing close to oleysaā and āmake a torpedo pass through a high windowā.