V2's playerbase isn't bleeding because of a lack of content, it is bleeding because endgame rewards are too rare for much of the population

The game itself is in the best state it has ever been, but you can still go 100 hours+ without ever getting a red weapon you’d use. Or a hat. It has been months since I’ve gotten a hat. I haven’t gotten any reds at all since 1.07. Still only have 3 red weapons after now coming up on 800 hours played. If I’m playing now, it is just a run or two with my fav char Slayer with my friends, I’ve no interest in grinding randoms anymore because I’ve no reasonable expectation of ever getting any new loot in a reasonable time frame.

Coupled with that: Warhammer 40k SpaceHulk: Deathwing Enhanced edition just came out and a TON of my V2 friends have moved over to that because it has very few problems now and offers rewards players aren’t getting from the end game of V2 unless they’re lucky.

Half the end game players of V2 are getting decent/good drop rates for reds. Half aren’t, and are moving on to more rewarding activities. Even if you added new maps to V2 tomorrow if you don’t change the loot system then you won’t keep that playerbase very long.

I warned you. Back in March I think. I said up the drop rates. When people get red weapons they keep playing, because it is fun to show off your red weapons.

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Also crafting. When it’s this gd hard to get enough green dust to try a loadout that seems fun in my head, it really kills my interest.

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In my case it is content. 150 hours and i already memorised every nook and cranny of the maps and tried every char/class/weapons.

Imo more content in the form of new maps/weapons/talents/enemies etc. would increase the longevity of the game considerably.

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Don’t worry, nothing a quick and unwarranted Huntsman nerf won’t fix!

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And they did (marginally) and it isn’t sufficient. As I’ve said several times, rates are a half-measure. I won’t be returning to V2 until loot becomes more reliable/consistent. It’s really quite impressive how much of a downgrade the loot/progression systems are in V2 relative to V1.

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Still playing and got like 5 reds so far. I feel I’m gonna stop when the gameplay content will be too repetitive, a very subjective threshold. I’ve won with every career in legend but not seen every situation or done as well as I could.

But with the incoming patch of Total war: Warhammer 2 I guess I’m gonna drift away until they add new maps.

Audio being sh*t is doing it for me personally.

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I completely agree with you with one nuance:

Endgame rewards is a part of endgame content. You shouldn’t separate the two.

Other than that, there is nothing to disagree about in your post. The problem is it’s a very old problem, that keeps getting voiced again and again and FS only knows why hasn’t it been dealt with.

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I take it you don’t play legend? I’m at 230 hours played and I have 5 red trinkets, 2 charms, 1 necklace, 2 crossbows, 2 onehand hammers, axe & shield. And that is only on the dwarf. (Not even the ones I want, which are 2h hammer or axe and a grudgeraker… but someday they should drop…) End game rewards are not too rare if you get generals / emperor chests on legend. So I’d say, step up your game and give legend a try.

About cosmetics: I totally agree, I’ve never seen one drop

100% agree, I have 32 reds now and use 3 (trinket / charm / neck) , my friend who I play with almost exclusively now has 35 but uses pretty much all of them, his only real duplicates are trinkets / charms but he for example is only missing 1 red weapon for the elf and has 2-3 full red set ups for sienna. Both of us are sitting at 400+ hours now. Also 0 cosmetics for either of us.

Also for example, I have 4 executioner’s swords and 4 blunderbuss all with the same skin, which is pretty sheet tbh

:joy:

Telling KrazyKruber to git gud. :laughing:

No, they shouldn’t. Without crafting system and duplicate protection you might not get your hammer even after getting 50, 100 or 200 red items or even more.

They are.

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This lucky bleeder!

With your luck I suggest getting 2-3 reds for each character before farming particular items. So you could take a look at your collection and realize that reds are real at hard times, you know.

True RNG dictates that its entirely possible you will never find the 1 item you want.

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I rather believe that, while the game does have issues with drops and such . . . Its player-base loss isn’t the massive problem most think. Certainly, yes, there have been losses due to the mistakes, but even if the game was perfect it would likely have lost about as many players by now. Most games have massively declining populations after even just one month, let alone three. And daily counts don’t count UNIQUE log-ins. It can be mis-leading if some people are still playing, but just every few days.

Fresh content will do a lot towards getting the game a lot of players back; I think the game does start with a lot of functional content due to the randomized nature of a match, but after 100-200 hours, it will still all seem less interesting or worn out.

You’re partially right, but you don’t take into account the feeling that players have now when they stop playing the game. Are they super hyped now about new content and will gladly buy a new DLC when it comes out and get back into the game, or are those people forever lost and will not even get interested enough when VT3 comes out? Somehow I think it’s the later.

I think that’s true for some, but I don’t think it’s accurate to assume all or even most who have stopped playing did so because they were truly dissatisfied with the game. A huge portion of players probably played through with friends a few times, had a good time, then moved onto something else that was shiny. Bring another shiny into this game, and a good portion will likely return for a brief while.

That might be true for casual players, who spent less than let’s say 50 hours in game. But there is still 2 problems.

First, casual players tend to get driven away by bugs, performance and instability much more, than fans, and let’s face it - there is plenty of that in the game

Second, personal attitude is highly subjective and relies a lot on public opinion, in case of games it highly depends on core players’ opinion. So when these people come back, see all the shinenigans in reviews, forums, on reddit they’re likely to get turned off. Actually they don’t even need to read that, cause there is a thing called informational noise, and they’re likely to know things from their friends or on random resources.

You might be right, though. I know the theory of how this works, but I haven’t yet witnessed such things in practice, cause I haven’t been involved into a gaming community before. So maybe when a new DLC comes out, casual players might just come back, buy it, play it for 5 hours and leave yet again completely satisfied. But from what I know about gaming industry and psychology and what I can conclude from this game’s state, it’s very likely that the opposite will happen, because addressing core community is the key. Yet, as I said, I am not entirely sure. Practice will show who’s right.

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I understand your POV and partically agree with it, I know such “tourist players”, they play game for a couple of hrs, sometimes even a few hundreds, but then they move to another game, no matter how good the previous one was, they just played “enough”. But in VT2 I also have some friends that stopped to play it not because they go to a “new shiny game”, in fact most of them returned to play “New Shiny DOTA” and the main reasons were not in lack of content, but mostly numerous issues within the game itself.

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would be nice if theres vs mode where another 4 people gets to play as the vermin/chaos like l4d.

Lemme tell you a tale my companion, a tale of a franchise, Warhammer franchise…
Here’s the story :
Warhammer set the basics for the fantastic AND sci-fi universe for almost every game / franchise / movie we know these days.
Many tried to adapt these universes in video games : rpg / strategy / fps / mmo and so on…
Many were good, the old ones : Blood Omen, Space Hulk etc… but when it came to adapt for this millenia, it all went wrong : I remember a mod from HL 1 that was based on Wh40k, was “fun”, but only a mod… Then there was FireWarrior, such a disappointment…
Then when we thought all hope was lost to adapt the Warhammer franchise in new games, we saw : Warhammer Online : AOR, a great game to me, shame they stoped it.
Then there was Dawn of War : holy shet ! another franchise reviving the strategy type, and it worked perfectly with many Add-Ons, till DoW 2, and then the mistake : DoW 3. Lucky bastards we are, we got Total War : Warhammer, fantastic born again, great strategy game again.
Then when it came to action / fps, we saw : Space Marine, good game but… could have been much more better, but the hope was born again.
AND finally, Warhammer Vermintide : End Times : really good games, hard as fck, but good, lacked of contents and unpolished, came from indie, but with time and effort, and supportive community, all the flaws were fixed : many loots, many cosmetics, good crafting system, and finally, more maps, and what a maps they were… I loved the one in the Castle !! But Devs were listening to community, they didn’t promise anything, they just developped and fixed when it was needed.
I made a huge break on VT1, cause of the poor system at the start, but when craft came, content came and dlcs came, I came back too, but cause I’m a diehard fan from Warhammer franchises.
Then we got Spacehulk : a failure too, Eternal Crusade : the promised MMOFPS, the holy one that came as the biggest failure ever on : promises made and kept.
And now, Warhammer Vermintide 2 : Hyped, promises were made, many classes, many gameplay, many weapons, many cosmetics, leveling system with skills, dude… that was the holy land for me !
But truth is : buggy as hell, patch over patch over patch, fix for the patch that was patching the previous patch, nerfs from everywhere, no customizable fort, cosmetics that you have more chance to be hit by a comet than you have to drop those cosmetics, crafting system you need to salvage itselft cause it’s way under the VT1’s one, and reds… that you have more chance to get a vaccine for starvation, aids etc… than getting one (ok I’m a bit over exagerating here, but you get the point) and if by any chance you get one, you might be also lucky enough to f
cking drop clone over clonce over clone… thx to the RNG god.

And to conclude : I was ok to wait until they delivered the new maps by may, but in the end… no new maps, same bugs, nerfs from everywhere, huge 22Giga patch to fix a game that was too buggy to fix that it needed a rewrite, no improve for the rate drop, no fix for the crafting system that all the community was craving for…
So I give them another month to make the things move the good way, meaning I’m not playing anymore VT2, but keep an eye on the patch / fix etc… hoping for content and better rates and craft.
If by the fall of June there’s still no major changes, I’m done for ever with the Vermintide franchise, and Warhammer franchise in general, like I did for all the previous Warhammer based game… I’m done with promises that are not kept and wasting my money.
I was willing to gave them another 30$ or even a full price of 60$ if it was granting me content, no RNG bulllsht , sht crafting system, and delaying all the contents cause the game that was given a beta, was released buggy as hell.

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