Switching ranged to a melee weapon is instant. Currently there is no point in using gauntlet as melee weapon, because it has no advantages over another types of melee weapons, but it has noticeable disadvatages. The lack of block was offset by significant weakspot damage in the patch 14.
I would like to see the hybrid weapon to be competitive with both ranged and melee weapons. By the way, the ability to interrupt the animations of melee attacks by aiming would be useful here.
Previously, rumbler was overspecialized, but highly effective weapon for killing monstrosities.
With the new patch, this weapon become impractical, because itās not capable to kill anyone except rippers and only scatters zombies around. Itās too short on ammo for killing specialists.
Bring back itās key advantage. There is no need to limit archetype to a single role
Last I ran rumbler it was a potent anti-shooter weapon, staggered and badly hurt specials, coupled with an ability that made them basically dead meat with a light brush of autogun fire from anyone else in the team, and I could stack ridiculous quantities of damage with abilities. AFAICT none of that was changed in this patch.
Having played the new map a few times, I quite like it. Nice aesthetic, nice challenge, great music. I appreciate the variety of bug fixes and QoL changes in the patch as well. Good work!
Just wanted to say, youāre absolutely right about this build. It does make the bolter feel fun again for me, and I find the build has decent survivability and feels solid.
I ended up not using the keystone as I like having the ammo and supression immunity, but yeah at the very least I have something fun to play on Veteran for the time being.
While I respect the CMās decision to delete my earlier post (it did have some questionable language in it), I must repeat the core message:
Please reconsider the decision to use a suitably rigid layout with three clear lanes for the vet tree. Itās at the root of almost all of the major complaints around both the previous and current iterations. It is an extremely unpopular design.
Edit: Brainfarted - The post I as thinking of is in another thread and was not deleted (Iāve removed the offending text though). However, my point about the tree design remains.
Have been through the carnival map four times on Damnation, with a zealot loadout I was capably performing with beforehand.
Every single time, we got bodied - either by seemingly endless hordes of gunners and shooter mobs, or by the dozen or so quasi-immortal, obscene-DPS ragers that appear rapidly. One time we literally had a dozen shotgunners and a half dozen dreg gunners spawn directly around our team, downing three of us in an instant and then netting our last guy with a trapper.
Iām going to assume yāall either have ridiculously broken spawns for the new map, or you fed the conflict director a mixture of meth and Jack Daniels, because this is kinda nuts. What happened to āwe want fewer enemies and for each of them to feel impactful?ā
Also I really feel bad for the vets because there is no way yāall are surviving this or getting any use out of that no-movement keystone.
It does seem more intense overall than other maps with the same modifiers. Iāve cleared carnival a few times so far and it always feels like the āendless hordesā thing that crops up from time to time in other maps ā just endless waves of trash mobs.
TBH I hope itās intentional, Iām really enjoying the more intense spawns ā I think it makes thematic sense, since the idea behind the mission is that weāre invading an enemy stronghold, which surely would have a very high concentration of crazies inside it.
I run shock trooper even nerfed, the weakpoint node on the way makes it hurt, 3 kraks and the melee tree up to trench fighter. Las pistol and a shovel. I doubt keystones will ever be impressive for me - I just liked the nice toughness regen from the specialist modifier, but its another 2 points on top of that and has a cooldown preventing it from being as useful as even nerfed confirmed. May as well take the 4 youād need getting down there and put Confirmed Kill and Out for Blood on. Seriously run Out for Blood now though.
Preemptive apologies as I think Iāve tagged you more times in the past week than at any other point, but a question occurs to me:
I donāt doubt that you guys will eventually fix whatās been done to the veteran skill tree, but I think I can safely say that this experience has been exceptionally unpleasant for more than just myself. Indeed, I donāt know if Iāve ever seen the community quite so unified as it is now in opposition to changes to the veteran.
I guess the question that Iām meandering towards is simply what reassurance do we have that this wonāt happen again? Because this was a pretty consequential misstep made to what is statistically the most popular class, and which likely wonāt get fixed for weeks, sadly.
The community becomes beautifully āunifiedā in rage by every single thing short of free content (but also that, see the Vanguard bundle and newer penance wear).
The vet changes have opened up the play/build space HUGELY. There is no doubt a crunch for points, and I hope thatās alleviated a bit. Just needs some tweaks.
And since weāre talking directly to FS: please please please keep making big changes that shake things up. Some of us know yāall are human, will make mistakes, will miscalculate, but many of us have also been here and seen how you continue to hone the Tide formula.
The Veteran keystones are a little better than I initially thought. I think the bigger issue is the point tax for getting to and upgrading a lot of things.
For example, thereās 3 low-value travel nodes on the way to get Tactical Awareness and Iron Will, and they removed easy access to the elite damage nodes that used to be near them. Itās much harder now to justify spending the points to branch into there from the left or right side compared to patch 14. That bottom-middle section used to be a central point of general utility nodes for basically any Vet build.
Likewise, most classes have two +15 toughness nodes as connectors out of the top section, with Ogryn having two +25 nodes becauseā¦reasons. The new Vet tree only gets one +15 toughness at the top and is also forced to path through one of the low-value travel nodes as well. Psyker and Ogryn donāt have to path through any low-value nodes to leave their top section. Zealot does have to take one, but they at least have a higher concentration of good nodes in the top section and pretty good pathing in the rest of the tree. Vet just has to pay this point tax with no real compension.
They really need to get rid of those top-level points tax nodes: +5% health, +1 stamina, +5% movement. Also, all +5% health nodes should be changed to +10% health as is standard for other classes. (Ogryn has iirc one +5% health node, but they get double value due to their base health.)
Veteran also has too many optional upgrades for its abilities and keystones, which further exacerbates the point shortage they feel from pathing:
Infiltrate is particularly egregious, having 4 upgrade nodes for an extremely barebones base ability. At least one of those upgrades (probably Surprise Attack) should be baked into the base ability.
Executionerās Stance should have one of its upgrades (probably either Relentless or Enhanced Target Priority) added to the base ability.
Marksmanās Focus should just have the Camouflage upgrade added to the base ability. I also would be in favor of reworking this keystone to lose stacks from missing shots rather than from moving.
The ranged upgrades for Weapons Specialist are pretty decent, but itās still too costly to get all of them in most builds. The melee upgrades seem lower value to me. I would just consolidate these by combining Always Prepared with Fleeting Fire, and Invigorated with Conditioning.
If these changes were made, I think the Veteran tree would be in a reasonable place. Thereās always room for further tweaking, but this would go a long way toward enabling build variety.
Based on holidays coming up soon I think weāll have to wait for a proper fix until at least mid-January. Hopefully, weāll see some adjustments (apart from bug fixing like the Exhilarating Takedown fix) to the vet in the next update, but Iām not keeping my hopes up too much.
Fine pal, Iām glad you like it, but I and evidently plenty of others do not, and your dismissal of that and of the opinions of your peers, all of whom bought the game just as you did, comes across as rude and condescending. If thatās going to be your attitude, then weāve got nothing more to discuss.
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