The problem of meta-shaming players who follow the meta and want to see meta compositions in their lobbies

Warhammer 40,000: Darktide General Discussion
1

So, a group of unpleasant individuals has appeared on the forum, I won’t point fingers, who mock players for their desire to play meta and see players with meta builds in their team. This is presented as something shameful and unworthy. But I will explain where this desire comes from.

Last fall, at rank 21, I suffered about 30 defeats in a row, playing as a Zealot with FotF, at a time when Supermen were playing with grey weapons, green curios, and empty talent trees. And my teammates were not Supermen, so defeat after defeat followed, throwing me back to rank 20, which was unpleasant due to guaranteed visual modifiers. I managed to break out of this losing streak only by using the Chorus of Spiritual Fortitude.

This summer, playing more or less meta (I don’t know where to find a notarized meta) I reached Assignment Rank 33, but that was the end of it. I got stuck; I found that out of eight games I only successfully complete one. If I am the lobby creator, I very carefully select teammates; I don’t scrutinize builds under a microscope, but I try to assemble a team according to the principle: two damage dealers of different classes (or at least with different ability and weapon sets), two tanks of different classes (or at least with different ability and weapon sets), one of which is my Zealot with Chorus (I don’t even know if it’s a tank, but it seems closer to a tank than a damage dealer) and, more importantly, I carefully look at teammates’ Assignment Rank (using mods). And even so, I suffered three defeats in a row at rank 33, three defeats in a row at rank 32, and three defeats in a row at rank 31. In my last ranked game with randoms, I barely successfully completed a rank 31 mission, clutching at the final event with a Zealot with Chorus and Relic Blade (not the best combination for clutching). That was possibly the peak of skill I have ever demonstrated. Yes, with careful selection of teammates with meta builds and my own meta build play, a single victory was achieved in a long chain of defeats.

I am pleased with myself, I go to the forum and read: that I am apparently a shameful sucker, cowardly not wanting to lose thirty matches in a row by letting cool meta players into my lobbies.

In their fairy-tale world, a team filled with just anyone (in terms of builds) somehow appears to be able to provide participants with a win rate that allows them to climb ranks. But this is as far from the truth as it is possible in principle. Successful non-meta play is only possible with very strong teammates, or if the player is simply a god of clutches.

It turns out, according to their logic, either you are a clutch god - who broke through the very hell and now chill out relaxed at rank 40 with strong teammates, or: “sucker, loser, shut up, haha, skill issue”.

Yes, I am sure, and that single game of mine at rank 40, which happened thanks to Rvl’s help, only strengthened me in this: breaking through the thirties to rank forty is a more difficult task than playing at forty.

At the same time, they themselves are far from necessarily being clutch gods. Either they brazenly climb into rank 40 lobbies right away, flaunting their huge True Level, or they climb to rank 40 at the beginning of the season, on a powerful upward stream of skilled players regaining their rank 40 Assignment Rank, or they play not with randoms.

So it turns out that some elitists who have climbed to rank forty mock those who failed to do so, for trying to do so by playing meta and selecting meta teammates.

That is, they mock not even the current achievements of such players, but already in advance their future achievements.

If specifically about me, I have come to the conclusion that I am capable of playing at rank 40 by playing meta (even if on a role requiring minimal skill), but if I play non-meta and don’t select meta teammates, I will inevitably end up at rank 21, with frequent defeats even at rank 20. There it is, the real difference between meta and non-meta. And to mock non-meta play of those who, even with meta, did not reach rank 40, is absolutely unethical. It is roughly like an athlete from a strong team mocking an athlete from a weak team, not only for his current achievements with that team, but also for possible future ones

2

Brief summary from DeepSeek:

The author criticizes forum elitists who mock players for using meta builds and selecting meta teammates. He shares his own experience: long losing streaks at ranks 21 and 31–33 when not playing meta or with random teammates, and only achieving success (including a clutch at rank 31 and one game at rank 40) by playing meta and carefully picking teammates. He argues that climbing through the 30s to rank 40 is harder than playing at rank 40, and that elitists often reached rank 40 with advantages (high True Level, early season, premade groups) rather than pure skill. Mocking non-meta players who couldn’t reach 40 even with meta is unethical, like a strong team’s athlete mocking a weak team’s athlete

3

I recommend leveling up during the first few weeks after your rank drops. The number of superheroes with a heavy sword and a Scryer’s gaze is practically zero.

4

In fact, this season that’s precisely how I went up from Assignment rank 20 to 33 (right now I am actually rank 34, but that is only thanks to the game that took place with user Rvl at rank 40). I was pushed up by the influx of strong players at the beginning of the season (but at that moment I didn’t realize it), and then I faced a harsh reality: everyone who was strong had moved to the top, and I was left with those who weren’t too strong, so win streaks were replaced by loss streaks. There was one game at rank 33 that seems to have been the deciding factor on whether the wave would drag me to rank 40 or not. One single game at rank 33 that could have been won, but in that particular game I decided to play an experimental build (three health curios instead of two for health and one for Toughness), and in the end, that very Toughness, followed by my health, was blown away by every single sneeze. In short, I ruined this game for the team, and my defeats rushed further; perhaps if I hadn’t ruined it, the winning streak would have continued

5

Too bad most people won’t get your post. But hey if you’d had a Psyker with an Inferno staff, according to them, you’d be at 30 wins already. Of course, they’d still spit on you for using it, but we won’t talk about that.

Oh great, here they come about to report me for being off-topic, or just for saying the word “Psyker.”

To the point: your team composition makes perfect sense. You’re picking up random players and, like a normal human being, you’re just filling the gaps so you can actually enjoy the game.

But explaining that to the elite squad of balance-obsessed tryhards who cry about Psykers is clearly a lost cause.

6

Personally im not a darktide supermen (I reached havoc 30 as max) and im not mocking meta users. At the same time, i just dislike playing with many meta builds (myself or with team mates who use them). Its just not that fun. Even when i play Psyker, i use void blast staff, even if prolly i could be a bit better with inferno. I just dont like playing it, or playing with poeple who use it. Fatshark just really made a bit of a hell with balancing. Atm im happy to have found a niche in Havoc , playing Skitarii Chord Claw phosphor pistol - boss and crusher killer, which is both fun for me and seems to help the team with one of the most dangerous enemies. Im not even sure if its meta or not.

7

From how you talk about people who play 40, how vaguely you talk about your team comps and “class roles”, and how our previous forum interaction was you saying that tac axe isn’t good, maybe you just don’t understand this game as well as you think you do and/or your mechanics are lacking. There is nothing wrong with that. You don’t play high havocs enough to be used to it. You list high true level as some mystical advantage but that just means that people have more time to get used to the game (or are speedrunning maelstroms but that’s a minority). These are difficult games that take time to master and there’s no shame in not playing at the top difficulty. All that matters is if you are having fun doing what you’re doing.

At the end of the day balance and how people play is solely in the hands of Fatshark and people are free to do whatever they want. I don’t see how people begging for a balance patch that will never come is somehow stopping you from playing however you want right now. People loathe all the extremely broken options because they make the game less fun to play for a lot of people.

9

Without AI, I wouldn’t be writing anything here at all, since I don’t know English

10

the epic cole’s weapon

11

I guess it’s a translation issue — I just meant that someone with a high true level immediately jumps into a rank 40 lobby and then brags about how badass he is (while playing with badass players). If he played with average players, he’d show how badass he really is

12

nobody does that lil bro why we inventing things

13

I mean, it is so badass when I find a pub playing dope stuff, what is not badass is waiting hours on end to find those players.

Average (95%) NA/EU Party finder requests →
Psyker: Flame Staff/Knife…
Ogryn: Taunt/Shield/Powermaul or the occasional PBB GG/Ripper/Rumbler…
Veteran: Plasma/Dueling sword Shout grenade spam…
Hive Scum: Shivs/Needle pistol RPGs/Chem nades…
Zealot: Flamer/Relic10/Dueling sword/Knife chorus,
Arbites: Shocking mines arbites maul or shield sometimes dog.
Skitarii: Arc Gun!!! YESS ARC GUN YESSS!!! SOO BADASS!!! until recently it was just Noobspheric Skull chudson + arc gun.

It is so laughable how often you see these exact builds over and over again because people are slaves to win%/crutches to play Havoc 40. It just makes the game less fun and trivializes so much of the gameplay loop. It just is lame and boring.

14

Just ask yourself one question: if win-rate-obsessed players are losing 9 out of 10 games, what happens if they stop obsessing over their win rate? Do you happen to think they will just drop to lower ranks? Yes, way, way lower. You’ll end up with two castes of players: one playing strictly at rank 40, and the other never climbing above rank 21

15

You should be losing in Havoc. It is not meant for the general player base. The game should be balanced for Auric Mael, and Havoc 40 should be ball crushing. Stop playing Havoc attempting to be 40.

it is okay to try it out play in lower havocs for fun or to improve. Simple as that. When I play games and I am not great at I just tweak the difficulty. I enjoy getting better at things and feel no shame in being bad or not great. If I desire to get better, I do. If I don’t I just play lower difficulty and have fun and move on. It is okay to play the game at not Havoc 40 level!

It is not meant for you! If you enjoy the gameplay loop there is no shame in playing in lower levels. No one shames people for being lesser skill, the thing I will shame you for is crutching on stuff that is poorly balanced while you have no fundamentals. The main gripe I have is when you abuse Fatsharks poor balancing to play in the highest difficulty to “win” the goal should be to have fun and get better and if your goal is to just have a power fantasy go one shot everything in Auric!

16

I think you concern yourself far too much with the so called ‘elitist’ boogieman and should just play the game and enjoy it. you don’t need permission to have fun.

All of the overpowered things should be nerfed.

17

The thing is, when play off-meta, most players—I’d say the vast majority, including myself—will hit a brick wall right at rank 21. That’s exactly what happened to me back when I played off-meta. I went on a 30-game losing streak

I don’t play on the highest difficulty level; I’m just trying to climb as high as possible. And while trying to climb, I look to optimize not only my own builds but also find the right teammates—both in terms of skill and their builds. If I don’t do this, I’ll drop straight to the very bottom, right into Havoc rank 21

And yeah, nobody is ever going to believe that a player hardstuck at rank 21 with an off-meta build and full random teammates is stronger than a meta-build player who once got boosted to rank 40 and plays there now. Honestly, I wouldn’t believe it myself, for that matter

18

I don’t mind. But I have no intention of putting self-imposed restrictions on myself, at least not until I can reach rank 40 without any restrictions. If everyone ends up restricted in their options, though—fine, so be it

19

I personally think and a lot of the best players see a player playing off meta stuff “hardstuck at havoc rank 21” is infinitely better than a player playing meta at Havoc 40. If you disagree with this you are a problem and so is your thinking. The funny thing is that player hardstuck at Havoc 21 given time will be 1000x better than the player meta abusing given the time.

20

This line of thinking is so silly. “self imposed” If I play any other game and notice something that is clearly not balanced correctly and is lame to use for me or other people I avoid it. You can call it a restriction it is just smart. You learn nothing and don’t get better if all you do is use things that circumvent a learning curve.

21

temp criticizing elitists
temp literally being one, using mods to check and declining people due to their loadouts
just because they are not running chorus, purgatus, taunt, bubble, voc cause otherwise cant rank up :wilted_flower: