DPS Meta in Darktide: More Fun, Less Bubble Simulator

Warhammer 40,000: Darktide General Discussion
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:warning: Disclaimer

This post isn’t meant to stir up another balance war or invalidate anyone’s experience. It’s just a personal take based on my own time in the current Darktide meta. Some of the opinions here might come off spicy, especially if you’re passionate about support builds or concerned about power creep, but the goal isn’t to dunk on anyone or declare a “right” way to play.

If you love bubble setups, slower tactical pacing, or feel the game’s gotten too easy, that’s totally valid. This is just one perspective in a diverse community, and I’m throwing it out there to spark discussion not division.

Now to the post:

There’s been a lot of noise lately about “power creep” ruining Darktide, but let’s be honest, it’s not that simple. Yes, Ogryns and Arbites often feel borderline immortal, especially when things are going well. But that’s not inherently bad. In fact, it’s part of what makes the current meta feel fast, fluid, and fun. (in my opinion and experience).

:brick: Power Creep: Real, But Not the Villain

It’s true that high-toughness regen classes can shrug off hazards and pressure more than they used to. You don’t always need a Bubble Psyker or Zealot Chorus to survive unless something goes catastrophically wrong. But that’s not necessarily “killing the game”, it’s just a shift in how survivability is achieved.

:brain: Community Whiplash: From “Support Is Boring” to “Power Creep Is Evil”

Let’s not forget: for months, the community complained about the meta being stale 50-minute runs dominated by cooldown management and camping behind bubbles. Now that we’ve moved into a more aggressive, DPS-heavy rhythm, suddenly “power creep” is the new bogeyman?

It feels like we’re chasing ghosts. First support was the problem. Now it’s damage. Maybe the real issue is that we’re not sure what kind of game we want Darktide to be.

:collision: DPS Meta: Fast, Punishing, and Actually Fun

Personally? I’ll take this over the Bubble Cooldown Simulator any day. The current pace rewards skill, positioning, and quick decision-making. It’s not perfect, sure, support builds could use some love to stay relevant, but the overall experience feels more alive.

  • Combat is snappier

  • Team roles are more fluid

  • Mistakes are punished, but not drawn out

:brain: Veteran: The “Dated” Class That’s Quietly Carrying Support

Funny enough, in this new meta, Veteran is arguably the most supportive class:

  • Ammo regen keeps the DPS train rolling.

  • Gold toughness shout is fast, unconditional, and clutch.

  • Doesn’t rely on setup or positioning, just delivers when needed.

While Bubble Psykers and Zealot Chorus builds struggle to keep pace, Veteran quietly enables the whole squad without slowing them down. The downside of playing like this is you will probably be last DPS on the scoreboard and feel squishy asf with next to none clutch potential.

:puzzle_piece: What Could Help

  • Rework support builds to complement fast-paced play, not slow it down.

  • Make hazard damage scale better across toughness levels to keep everyone honest.

  • Keep pushing build diversity without reverting to turtle meta.

:brain: TL;DR

  • Power creep exists, but it’s not the death of Darktide.

  • The DPS meta is more engaging than the old bubble/chorus-heavy slog.

  • The community needs to decide what kind of pacing it actually wants.

Some argue this meta lacks mechanical depth. While it’s true that certain builds are more forgiving, the skill expression hasn’t vanished, it’s just shifted:

  • Adaptability and target prioritization are more important than ever.

  • Resource timing (ammo, toughness, cooldowns) still separates good from great.

  • The pace rewards decision-making under pressure, not just precision.

So while the meta may feel easier to enter, mastering it still takes awareness and finesse.

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I’ve always thought that the old Havoc was better than the new Havoc. I remember being able to play games with my friend on his recon lasgun gunpsyker and us being able to play aggressive and clear 40s. New Havoc is harder yes, but it’s harder in a very artificial way that’s not fun.

The current meta is the opposite of aggressive, DPS heavy gameplay. You can’t push too far or you’ll step on a spawn tile and wipe the group, and you’re constantly bogged down by walls of armored mobs because they decided to balance Havoc around infinite cleave and CC skills like chorus and shout. My friend barely plays anymore because his preferred gunpsyker play-style doesn’t really work anymore (I know gunpsyker can work in new Havoc and we’ve done it, it’s just not nearly as enjoyable for him anymore).

The game has always been about positioning target priority since it’s launch and it’s a big thing that separates good and not good players. With new Havoc that hasn’t changed, but it’s more so just everything being thrown at you at once out of nowhere which is part of the artificial difficulty I’m talking about.

Bubble is still a necessity in situations like; if you’re doing that sewer map and drop down into that hallway with a BoN spawn and a captain? Well, hope one of you brought bubble for that BoN or chances are you’re just SOL. Chorus/flame staff/Rumbler is a necessity for situations like purple carapace regen deathballs bogging you down. It’s like they introduced blight spreads and regen mobs as a way to give players something to prioritize… but this isn’t WoW, I can’t tab target to the mob in the back and focus it down that’s not how the game works.

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Totally get where you’re coming from, and I appreciate the detailed breakdown.

What you’re calling “artificial difficulty” has been baked into Havoc since the beginning. Back in Season 1, gunners were apex predators and player Ogryns had little functional role due to their kit limitations. Sure, challenge runs with Ogryns were possible, but they weren’t meta-viable until their rework. That shift didn’t introduce artificial difficulty it just changed which builds could handle it.

You mention aggressive play being punished, but I think that depends heavily on team composition and mindset. If a squad brings the right tools, screen-clear builds, CC, and mobility then pushing forward isn’t inherently reckless or punished. Getting cornered between an elevator and a wall of crushers, twins, and chaos spawns can happen even at a normal pace. It’s not necessarily a consequence of aggression, it’s often just poor timing, RNG or positioning.

Support builds like bubble and chorus are still solid, especially for slower, more methodical teams. But they’re no longer essential in every situation. Current Ogryn and Arbitrator builds can survive and thrive without constant bubble babysitting. If you keep moving, spawn rates drop. If you camp, they escalate. That dynamic rewards game knowledge and proactive play, not just cooldown cycling.

Gunpsyker reminds me of pre-rework Ogryn twin stubber builds, viable in specific metas, but out of favor now. Raw damage builds without cleave or CC are struggling, much like twin stubber Gungluggers. It’s not that they’re unusable, but they’re high-risk and low-reward in the current environment. Ammo-thirsty builds have always been tough in Havoc, especially with modifiers like Emperor’s Fading Light and the sheer tankiness of mobs.

What feels “fun” or “viable” depends heavily on expectations, team synergy, and build familiarity. Your frustration is valid, especially if a favorite playstyle got sidelined. But from a broader lens, the current meta isn’t necessarily less aggressive or more artificial it’s just rewarding different skills and setups than before.

Would love to hear more about what kind of changes you think would make gunpsyker (or similar builds) feel fun again without reverting to bubble meta.

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Yap sesh

You talk about players hating a support turtle slog, but that was less because of any character power levels and more because of this. It was the Havoc design causing it, not the character design.

I do want to bring up 2 things here.

1: Pacing is always important, even if your team brings the worst weapons possible. You don’t want to be bogged down in one area for a long amount of time if you can help. Yes, you don’t want to trigger stuff early, but you want to keep moving forward.

2: The current meta hurts build diversity. And I don’t think saying “if you bring all the optimal stuff you can roll over spawn triggers,” is a good answer to that.

Also situations like these are why, mainly Chorus, but to some extent bubble are still really good. Being able to stagger everything for a bit and give everyone gold toughness gives them ample opportunity and safety to break out of that position. And with how strong dueling sword is, if the Zealot knows what they’re doing they won’t have to compromise on dps that much.

Its a combination of both their incredible tankiness AND their very strong damage output. They have the best of both worlds. There isn’t a trade off. If they want them to be tanky I’m fine with that, but there needs to be something else (Ogryn has the movement penalties which is a good start, but they still need a little tuning imo).

I enjoy the fast pacing of Darktide. It is one of my favorite aspects of the game. However I believe changes should be made so that the game can still be fast paced but different enemy comps can be faced other than elite armor spams, which includes player and weapon nerfs.

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You talk about players hating a support turtle slog, but that was less because of any character power levels and more because of this. It was the Havoc design causing it, not the character design.

But isn’t that kind of the nature of Havoc itself? It’s a curated challenge mode, metas will always emerge around its mechanics. Quickplay lets almost anything work, but Havoc demands more specific answers. The real dilemma is: how do you make “everything viable” without leaning into artificial difficulty? And while some Havoc changes are mechanical (like spawn pacing or enemy behavior), others are just raw numbers and stat tuning. Nobody wants bullet sponges, and I’m not saying the current direction is perfect, but it’s a tough balance to strike.

The current meta hurts build diversity. And I don’t think saying “if you bring all the optimal stuff you can roll over spawn triggers,” is a good answer to that

I hear you. Saying “just bring optimal stuff” isn’t a satisfying answer, and I don’t mean it that way. Havoc has always had metas, and the current armor/boss spam just shifted the flavor. Personally, I’ve found more ways to enjoy it than what we’ve had previously, but that doesn’t mean I want it to stay this way forever or become the new baseline.

Also situations like these are why, mainly Chorus, but to some extent bubble are still really good. Being able to stagger everything for a bit and give everyone gold toughness gives them ample opportunity and safety to break out of that position. And with how strong dueling sword is, if the Zealot knows what they’re doing they won’t have to compromise on dps that much.

Absolutely. They’re great tools for breaking out of bad situations. But I’ve also seen FotF Zealots with bolter + relic sword builds out-damage Arbites and Rumbler Ogryns. Not by a huge margin, but enough to show that viability isn’t just about the build, it’s about player mindset and execution. A CDR-chasing Zealot who gets lost in pox hordes isn’t more or less viable because of the build, but because of how it’s played.

I enjoy the fast pacing of Darktide. It is one of my favorite aspects of the game. However I believe changes should be made so that the game can still be fast paced but different enemy comps can be faced other than elite armor spams, which includes player and weapon nerfs

I didn’t want this to spiral into a balance thread, but I disagree that nerfing players or weapons leads to more diversity, it usually just lowers the skill ceiling and pushes everyone into safer, slower play. Better enemy variety and smarter spawn logic would do more for balance than blanket nerfs.

Fast pacing is one of Darktide’s strengths. The goal should be to expand viable playstyles by lifting underperformers, not cutting down what works.

And if nerfs are truly needed, we should wait for the Zealot and Veteran reworks. With the older classes still in flux, it’s premature to call anything OP. Let the dust settle first, otherwise we risk fixing problems that might resolve themselves.

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I see a lot of talk about Havoc, but Havoc is a blight that should never have happened in my opinion.

It was an answer to the power creep and besides some very skilled individuals who like to challenge themselves even more, it pushes the meta so hard that people now believe everything else should be as good on Havoc.

I would have liked to see Auric Maelstrom being the ultra sweat mode with free picking of modifiers for those wanting to push the very limits.

The more general public should have had a hard enough time with Damnation.

That ship seems to have sailed and I’m between a rock and a hard place where I can carry Aurics, but am demolished in higher Havoc and honestly just don’t want to deal with the party finder or Discord, nor want to play support Zealot or rumbler Ogryn.

So talking about Auric, Arbites trivializes it. After playing 100 missions on it I went back to Zealot and I had to relearn not to get hit.

While before the Ogryn rework, Zealot was the class considered most OP. This is not a healthy state for the game.

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I get the frustration with Havoc, but calling it a “blight” feels a bit extreme. It’s clearly inspired by Vermintide’s Weaves, and while no one asked for it specifically, the community did want a Chaos Wastes-style challenge mode. Saying Havoc was an “answer to power creep” feels off, it’s more a curated format to test builds under rotating constraints right now.

As for “everything should be as good in Havoc,” that’s a community contradiction. When everything’s viable, it’s “too easy” or “power crept.” When strict metas emerge, people complain about being filtered out for playing off-meta. So which is it? Even Auric is viable for most builds now, and yet complaints persist.

herlekein:

I would have liked to see Auric Maelstrom being the ultra sweat mode with free picking of modifiers for those wanting to push the very limits.

I’m 100% with you on wanting more customization, Auric Maelstrom with selectable modifiers would be a great way to let players push their limits on their own terms. And yes, the general public already struggles with Damnation (Since forever). That’s not a Havoc or Arbites problem, it’s a skill curve and matchmaking issue.

harlekein:
That ship seems to have sailed and I’m between a rock and a hard place where I can carry Aurics, but am demolished in higher Havoc and honestly just don’t want to deal with the party finder or Discord, nor want to play support Zealot or rumbler Ogryn.

That’s the downside of seasonal formats: some builds just fall out of favor. It’s like rotating formats in card games, nothing’s nerfed, but the “rules” shift and suddenly different decks dominate. Not perfect, but it shows Fatshark is at least trying to keep challenge content fresh.

harlekein:

So talking about Auric, Arbites trivializes it. After playing 100 missions on it I went back to Zealot and I had to relearn not to get hit.

While before the Ogryn rework, Zealot was the class considered most OP. This is not a healthy state for the game.

Any class can, if played well, trivialize Auric. I’ve seen Veterans and Psykers with shredder builds outdamage Arbites consistently. It all comes down to player skill and experience.

And on the “healthy state” of the game: I don’t think power creep is the main issue. It’s divisive at best. There are bigger factors behind player drop-off, like lack of content pacing, poor matchmaking, and limited/poor communication. The occasional sweat deleting everything in an Auric game isn’t what drives most people away.

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:heart_eyes:

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It’s missing all the fun from Chaos Wastes, which is the main draw of Chaos Wastes.

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I don’t like havoc, I don’t play it.

I’ve always felt the reason its difficulty is so artificial is because of the power creep, because we are too fast, too lethal and capable of recovering too fast the damage spikes have to come that fast and hard.

The game is being pushed out of range where it “works” into the realm of having to be “artificial”

And by that I mean it’s moving from choice and adaptation into nothing but perfection of execution.

Power creep might not have “killed” DT, but IMO it has already taken it out at the knees.

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Yes, but not every player can make every class work. I’m terrible with Psyker. I don’t jam with it, except gun Psyker but I don’t want to compete on the ammo pickups.

Every class can dominate in the right hands, but Arbites allows most people to dominate with least amount of effort or skill.

It’s unhealthy.

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And Ogryn

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Can’t say I fully agree with the OP, as I would like both enemies and players to be rebalanced and brought down for more “tactical” and “grounded” approach, however:

This is 100% true. Old Havoc was a complete garbage because of this. Funny how people still claim that powercreep rUiNeD tHe ChAlLenGe and you “had to at least play the game”. How? Sitting in the bubble with mandatory 1-2 gold toughness bots and slowly grinding the enemies coming at you? Sorry, I would rather play overpowered Ogryn, Zealot or Arbitrator and handle the platoons of elites and specials thrown at me by myself rather than making a cookie-cutter build to counter Havoc artificial diffuculty and advance at snail’s pace.

That being said, both cases are bad and taking it to the extreme.

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I’m saying it right here. The obsession with DPS, AOE, and DOT is really ridiculous about this game

Obsession with with the Meta is also another very problematic factor it’s even ruining the table top version of Warhammer 40,000 alongside the flavor and lore-theme compositions

Can we all just get clear, concise game mechanics rather than all this bs?

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you dont need bubble you dont need meta it just compensates lack of knowledge, skill and positioning

i hope they remove bubble soon since it just teaches people bad behavior and compensates their trash positioning and skill issues

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Havoc is a blight because it’s a piece of tape pretending to be a bandaid slapped over the festering wound that is darktide balance.

It literally was the answer to powercreep (of both character power and overall player skill) . It exists because top end players were finding T5 to be too easy so Fatshark made a new mode with everything turned up to 20.

Addressing many of the balance problems the game has means large changes/additions to its underlying systems but instead of doing that Fatshark opted for the quick and dirty route.

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Many takes about Havoc being a response to power creep miss the timeline. When Havoc launched, Zealot and Veteran had just gained the dueling sword, boosting their mobility and elite-killing potential. Ogryn wasn’t meta, and Arbites didn’t exist yet.

Today’s power creep discourse mostly revolves around post-rework Ogryn and Arbites, not the state of the game when Havoc dropped. Framing Havoc as a fix for power creep retroactively distorts its purpose.

Havoc wasn’t a balance patch, it was a new challenge mode, likely inspired by Vermintide’s Weaves, designed to shake up team comps and pacing. Whether it worked is debatable, but it wasn’t a surgical response to meta scaling.

The real issue is that “power creep” has become a catch-all critique since Patch 13. Every new addition: class, weapon, mode, is instantly seen as either a symptom or a failed fix. That mindset doesn’t foster good analysis; it turns discussion into superstition.

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Can we all just get clear, concise game mechanics rather than all this bs?

I agree with this sentiment, but how to achieve this without making the game “too easy”?

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I somewhat agree with this topic. But not entirely.

Yes, arbites is indeed much more entertaining to play, with actually good talents, mechanics and tree. BUT.

Game has nothing to offer against besides increasing numbers. And sometimes there are so many enemies that you WILL be overrun just statistictically.

That’s why we need not only new and better talents\mechanics\weapons\instruments to be given to players but also increase the danger of the enemies and bosses. New attacks, animations, behavior, etc…

I was already suggesting in one thread to allow enemy crushers and bulwarks charge into players like ogryn-player does. Or allow gunners to toss weak frag grenades at players. Or similar, to increase the danger without dumb stat increase.

UPD: I also have to add that i mean the elite spam. Spam or regular mobs is somewhat OK.

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Yes indeed. The meta completely broke Damnation. I remember it very clearly, because I only just started playing. People were complaining about Auric being trivialized and I couldn’t understand. I didn’t worry about it as I was just graduating from Heresy to Damnation.

But FS worked on Havoc at the time and indeed as a new game mode, but also to challenge the hardcore players running meta.

The meta which broke the game is the meta that dominated Havoc on release. Vet and Zealot with gold toughness leaning on DS4 and Psyker on purge staff.

The community complained and the answer of FS was to boost everything to counter Havoc.

That’s why the Ogryn rework became what it is and why Arbites is so blatantly OP. It’s a vicious circle because during the Ogryn rework they also made Havoc harder. Now we have people demanding everything to be buffed to those levels. It’s literally spiraling out of control.

As I said, it’s a very unhealthy state of the game.

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