Its yet more proof of the play test groups bias. Ogryn shooting machine gun or ripper lots is bad, but ogryn being able to dump out kickback shots every encounter while still running skullcrusher tree is fine because its like Kruber’s blunderbuss wooo!
No I was talking about my beloved backloader flak cannon.
I just mixed up the blessings, was thinking of surgical, the one staking crit chance.
And for a “mag dump” spam: “blaze away”.
IMO there are no blessings on the kickback that compliment each other…
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Respect.
Kickback is doing plasma gun level damage to anything below carapace. It probably shouldn’t have more than 30 shells without the ammo talent.
Run ‘n’ Gun reduces spread and adds close range damage now. Put that on with Surgical and enjoy your new sniper shotgun. I don’t know why people talk up the infested damage so much, it doesn’t oneshot dogs at the ranges it oneshots trappers. It’s actually quite ridiculous how easily you can kill trappers with this thing.
It was the worst Ogryn weapon for a very long time. Now it’s extremely good, and it should never have been given the extra ammo. All the suggestions OP made would basically return it to its useless state, we don’t need to go overboard here. But with how much Fatshark has buffed some things, who knows where we actually want to land for balance.
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I’d probably put Kickback right next to the Revolver in the category of WTF this shouldn’t be this strong, definitely needs the nerfing bat.
It feels super strange that melee Ogryns can easily deal 600k+ damage with ranged weapons. At least I don’t see many people running the solo-mode “melee build but I’m actually ranged” builds that much currently.
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I’m with Nish on the revolver and probably kickback but i strongly agree with the sentiment of “let it cook” for a bit.
Also just nerf revolver when bolt and plasma pistols are added. IMO even as kickback is strong i am finding gunlugger ripper deletion builds to be easily stronger. The meta just got shaken up very hard twice in a row and everything needs time to settle in and be figured out. I haven’t even gotten through my first batch of new aggressive testing and as far as married men with kids go i practically nolife this game.
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Especially with the Mark 3 club I think a Point Blank Barrage Ripper with a Heavy Hitter 3b club is probably insanely strong. Even with the Krourk IV knife which is really only marginally better at horde clears it’s probably one of my strongest builds across all 4 classes.
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i was using Agripinaa combat shotgun regularly. it was describe as precise / high dmg weapon and hv special action slug shell that require user to aim the crosshair to desired target.
ive notice that the weapon ADS and slug shell crosshair struggle to register hit at enemy located far away, especially sniper where it requires the user to pinpoint the crosshair to the enemy’s weakspot in order to confirm kill and 1 shot them. the bullet travel is also relatively slow and as a result the shot will eventually miss.
taken to account with the kickback ADS, u aim to enemy sniper far away and bam its gone no problem. not to mention the kickback ADS is a large square crosshair.
my question is how is this balanced ? and look at the skill required to handle both weapon and the rewards u get. dont forget me wrong im a user of both Agripinaa combat shotgun and kickback. either buff the Agripinaa combat shotgun or we will riot ! sincerely from atoma veteran.
I feel this is a Fatshark server hit reg issue rather than anything inherently wrong with the Aggrip.
Kickback can only reliably 1 shot snipers out to 25ish meters, and you have to get a crit so stacking surgical for 1-2 seconds is neccassary. The Agripp slug can kill snipers at 60+ meters instantly if you have good aim, and the regular shot has good aim and damage as well. Would need to test again to see effective sniper kill range on the Agrip regular shot, but its still definitely farther and faster than the Kickback.
The Agrip and the Kickback shotguns feel great, or at least the Agrip feels great on Zealot. I haven’t played with it much on vet after the patch. The Agrip is much better at killing shooters, gunners, and specialists at range and in succesion than the kickback is. The kickback will struggle against groups of enemies spread out and in cover where the Agrip will shine.
I think people are getting caught up in the best case scenarios for the Kickback and the potential damage per shot. Again maybe it has too much range, but this is somewhat dependent on ADSing to get surgical stacks. But I think the Kickback and the Agrip both have their preferred situations and each of them shine in their own way.
i will take this issue into account thx.
yes plz compare the range effectiveness on both weapon. for me the kickback is suitable for close range combat. but if its ADS can kill sniper far way its feels like other weapon that hv greater modifier falls short to compete with it.
ill practice my aim. its a fun and versatile weapon to use XD.
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I find it pretty fun that the moment Kickback finally gets to be okay, there’s immediate cry for nerfing.
Sure it does a lot of damage now. So what? It’s still a secondary 1-ammo magazine weapon. And it can never be a good primary due to its design. It’s always going to be a great choice when you’re mostly melee-spec Ogryn and need a gun to finalize your loadout. But never more.
It’s not even overall-better than a gorg stubber or rumbler.
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That aside, the other classes are also very good.
Right now you can get at the very least one “busted” build going with every class.
In the case of Ogryn, Zealot and Psyker, I can think of two super strong builds from the top off my head that can absolutely clean house - Either because they become killing machines or unstoppable tanks.
Ogryn: All Melee build - Grenadier build
Psyker: Voidstrike Staff Expert build - All Melee Toughness build
Zealot: Heavy Sword Momentum build - Two-Handed Hammer Monster Slayer build
I think it’s fine. The game is very punishing in turn. One big mistake and you wind up on the floor either way.
If all classes are “very good” then no class is very good. Realistically, two classes are very good, one class is good, and one class is… meh
I distinctly remember you asking for kickback buffs not long ago. Did you change your mind about the weapon or just feel these buffs went too far? Haven’t had much chance to play since patch 14 so not passing any judgement on how strong the weapon currently is to be clear.
No, wrong. This isn’t a PvP game, hence you don’t measure the classes against each other.
This is a PvE only game, thus you measure the strength of classes against the content to play against.
If a class can facemelt the content opposed against, it is very good.
Every class in the game right now has a build that can facemelt even the hardest content this game has to offer.
That means, every class is very good.
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The kickback finally feels good to use, and this guy wants to nerf it.
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Wrong. It’s a co op game. You measure against both: not only what you play against, but also play with. If your class is supposedly very good, and every other class that you’re playing alongside is also supposedly very good, then no one is actually very good.
You’re argument is only sound when applied to single player pve games where the only interactions your character has is with enemy units or NPCs. This couldn’t be further from darktide.
I wanted some identity to the Kickback, it should either be a huge damage option or a support one. But in Fat Shark fashion the buffs to reserves, cleave and damage all at once makes something similarly broken to voidstrike. It feels bad when as a skullcrusher my best options are just mashing my ranged as fast as it can reload.
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No. Right now every class has strong builds that excel at something. They’re very good.
Pre-patch 13, the opposite was the case. Most class builds lacked killing power and sustain.
This measured against the PvE content. Previously it took a lot to bring a Horde of Ragers down. Now it’s easy.
So it applies. Every class is strong right now. That doesn’t get any less valid just because you can outshine some builds with others.
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I would agree with keyboard on this, even if it is just semantics.
If all classes are good at killing quickly than the meta shifts and that is the baseline or normal of what is to be expected. Suddenly other factors will start to apply to shift what is “normal” and what is “good.” This doesn’t mean that “normal” classes or builds are bad, or even than “bad” stuff is neccassarly bad in the content, just compared to everything else you are incurring an opportunity cost to run something that is worse.
For example, if all classes are good at killing different metrics start to appear for what is good or not. How good are they at taking care of armor? How Survivable are they? How quickly can they kill a boss? How easily can they survive or clutch in solo situations? How much range do they have? Does your build support your team in another way or not?
Although I think compared classes is the wrong way to do it, and comparing the vague builds within them is better (you can argue how good classes are for how well they facilitate different builds but I think they all do it fine, besides Vet where its just kinda meh). But if a build is good at killing but loses at on some of these other metrics while not gaining enough in others it will be “bad” in the current meta.
After writing all of this I’m realizing how stupid and pedantic it all is, but I’m still going to post it because I like arguing about stupid and pedantic things. 
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