Yeah that was the plan. Just sad to get those perks 
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I don’t have issues with what the players on these forums are saying. Most of the opinions outside of the jokey ones are quite nuanced, and well thought out because its made by people who actually play the game. Even the hyperbolic ones like outright removing handcannon would fine. I didn’t even know that it was good as it was until rather recently (I thought the rending only applied after the first shot hit so I ignored it), and I’ve been just using Roulette + Surgical so I have no real horse in that particular race anyways.
The problem is its Fatshark themselves that tend to not interpret things in a nuanced way.
Maybe I played too much VT2, and things are better now but the launch of this game makes me feel like they haven’t really learned much.
I assume worst with them. So I assume my favorite gun is dead now so that when the patch notes hit I can be pleasantly surprised, or only mildly miffed as I’ll have gotten my gamer malding out of the way early.
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Only with the veteran, maybe the vet needs to be nerfed , they have many ways to one shot things
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And you have just described here why surgical strike is the only point that needs a nerf…
Eh? It’s the same situation like with devil’s claw/chain/power weapon
We should put weapon in it’s niche, so there will be space for all of them.
Yes, nerf revolver vs carapace dmg and give it something in exchange, like bigger ammo pool, or faster reloading, etc. Now you have high mobility/fast to swap human-sized-non-carapace elites and specials remover. Close to shotgun niche, but more single target/pierce and mobility oriented
Bring bolt/plasma pistol that will take vs carapace pistol niche
Nothing is useless now from the gameplay perspective, arsenal is bigger, makes more sense lorewise.
Win-win.
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Using Bing create - “revolver on couch surrounded by fat sharks”
After seeing how they handled the Ogryn Kickback, I’m sure they’ll find a way to tune it down, without making it obsolete.
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I see that lot are wanting something that is lore compliant…
Doing that means that we let only one good ranged carapace weapon for zealot. And as people want also to nerf combat axe, knives (both are fines), well… let’s start to play all with a bolter. Bolter party again…
Revolver is in its niche. As I have shown, hand canon permits you to kill a crusher with 1 less bullet than with it. So, the problem is not hand canon.
However, surgical strike permits to land critics after critics and without effort.
Seriously, a revolver is not great against a crusher patrol.
What is suggested here is to make all non iconic warhammer weapons weaker than their iconic counterpart. This would be possible if we had more than few weapons (and so few gameplays) and also if there was a system that restrict the use of these iconics weapons (like only 1 slot can be an iconic weapon).
I think the problem can be seen as a part of players see the game as something that is part of warhammer 40k (true) and this requires that everything has to be lore compliant (and here I don’t agree), even if it means that several weapons won’t be balanced towards the others.
The other part of the players want just to take fun and pay attention to the general balance.
I am in this part. I love surgical strike, but I see that it is too strong. As it is not balanced, I pointed it.
Nerfing hand canon / making revolver unable to deal with unyielding / carapace, means that revolver would be useless for 80% of the players.
Fact is, you deal in my little test 76% more damages when you land a critic, and 152% more damages with hand canon. In other words, hand canon and surgical strike give the same advantage against a carapace, but surgical strike is useful against anything while hand canon is only against flak and carapace.
And as hand canon triggers only when landing a critic…
But even if you don’t take hand canon, let’s be honest, 76% damage bonus in no time… there’s a problem…
And without surgical strike, hand canon triggers rarely. Without hand canon and with surgical strike, you can land tons of critics.
Again, if you want to nerf something, nerf surgical strike.
Off course, I don’t care of lore. What I want is a balanced game. And no, a game where players just use 3 iconic weapons, would not be a fun game for me. More weapons we have, more fun I can take. Except if there is a lot of weapons just for the numbers and that, in reality, few can be used.
By the way, I see that we have a “lore” offensive… Several ask nerfs for revolvers, knives just to be more lore compliant. I disagree fully with such propositions as it would lead to less good weapons.
What if they gave Surgical a cool down ?
Like using the charges put a cool down that stop the counter to start again before X sec
Maybe…
I just says that it procs too fast, and as a result it permits to triggers hand canon too easily.
I would even say making surgical strikes procs a little faster than what we had before patch 12 (so a little slower than what we have now) would be enough.
But anyways, this is Fatshark that has to find the correct timing.
[M.A.S.H. - 1972]
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Since bolter is there for zealot, I don’t see why bolt-pistol can’t.
Or even meltagun/inferno pistol, different religious fanatics like to use melta.
But zealot also has thunder hammer and evi, he is obviously a melee focused class.
It shouldn’t be able at all or struggle to do so.
See, despite my vision comes from the lore perspective, nerfing “DMG vs” is a balance deed.
No it’s not. Are you trying to say that devil’s claw is bad, cause it’s not effective vs crushers as power sword? Cause DC is one of the best melee weapons.
Because there is no alternative currently. With such vision, let’s just remove chain and power weapon, and just will give high vs carapace damage to all mundane weapons. It’s gonna be balanced, right?
Ok? Game is about popular franchise anyway, there is an audience that cares. Don’t make game in Star Wars universe if you don’t have to deal with certain things like force or lightsabres
Again, where you see this? No one said that. Damage and damage against specific armor type isn’t the only stat in this game. Infantry lasguns can’t deal with carapace, still a good workhorse weapon. Mg la even great one after buff.
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But the revolver is already in its niche: great damage vs a single target but small mag, slow RoF, slow reload, need accuracy, suffer vs multiple enemies (and there is a continue wave of specials/elites)… it’s a weapon that needs skill and has long dead times
Plus to be strong vs carapace needs two perfect bless… and it’s still RNG
We would change its working niche just to hope the next niche will be balance, fun and characterized like the current one
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Yes and no. Balance is an endless process kinda.
Having revolver, bolt and plasma pistols and balancing them is just better than having only revolver with universal damage.
In first case you have specialized weapons for different roles, there is more depth in specialization approach.
With universal damage where is difference just in reload time/swing pattern it’s more simplified.
Again, remove chain and power weapon, make mundane weapon effective vs all armor types. Is it more fun now? Don’t think so.
About Lore and videogame logic, not all weapons should be viable for all purposes…
You don’t shoot a tank with .45, do you now? (well, some do)
Let me just “borrow” this little reddit gem:
"Excuse me sir, I think it is pretty obvious that Tom maxed out his handgun stats
80% damage amp, 80% crit chance, 4x crit damage, last bullets does double damage, 90% plus reload speed, 75% chance to not consume ammo on shot, 8x headshot damage, 70% speed boots per kill with a handgun, 50% defense boost while using a handgun as a primary weapon and 3x deadeye duration
Plus he is using a legendary tier weapon that does around 28k damage per shot, does 70% more damage to armored enemies (like tanks), deals true damage ignoring defense and deals fire damage which is great against enemies that are using metal equipment, dealing 1.5x more damage
All this without mentioning his own perks like life steal, hawkeye, clear mind, explosive finale or steady hands and much more
So I think it is pretty obvious that Tom is a very high level veteran player who knows what he is doing"
Someone on Reddit
I hate that logic in games (and stacking damage feats). When you are tasked with destroying a tank, you use Anti-tank weapons. When you need to kill some infantry you use anti-personnel weapons.
Carapace enclosed Ogryn is at least APC level of enemy.
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I’m not sure if I have understood but imo Revolver and Plasma are already balanced each other. Boltgun needs just a shorter delay before be ready to shoot and would be perfect
Sorry, I haven’t understood this point
I’m talkng about bolt-pistol, plasma-pistol, maybe something more exotic like inferno-pistol, for anti-big-armored-thing pistols.
It’s an analogy. I don’t wanna loose arsenal variety and specialized weapons, and just play with universally good vs anything mundane sword. It would be bad.
So if it is so for swords I don’t see why it should be revolver pistol for killing armored ogryns. Especially when there are much more iconic things exist in the lore. It would be ok if there was no options to add to the game.
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Maybe cause the models are not ready?
https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkTide/comments/146v7fa/datamined_upcoming_ranged_weapons_and_variants/
Don’t even talk about a potential new weapon to justify a nerf of a weapon in game… the models shown in the post are ready for several months and not yet implemented…
I let you imagine how many months/years would be needed to take the decision to introduce a plasma / bolter pistol and implementing effectively in the game.
In other words, they should remove hand canon or make it useless.
Guess what… hand canon is in game, they cannot remove it.
Live with that.
But I would not take catachan sword without anything that can kill a crusher… and you try to remove me tools that can deal with crushers…
Fine… no alternative but let’s nerf anyways and we will see after…
Won’t say what I think about this…
This is a game… not a book or a movie.
Live with the fact that a game has to be fun… I really don’t care that a knives should be labelled power dagger and have a different look, what I care is the balance between weapons.
From what I can see, our approaches are totally different… I would not sacrifice a weapon and make it useless just to fit a vision that works in a paper and dice game…
This is a video game, they give us tools, tools have to be ueful and balanced.
I don’t say that they should not take into account the universe (anyways they could not, GW would not tolerate that), I say that they have to build the game to be fun for everybody, and not just a 40k window that would please only 40k fans.
When you want to make a weapon a lot less efficient than the iconic counterpart, you perfectly know that everybody will take the iconic weapon, and so the other weapon won’t be used.
For me, this is a problem…
Before patch 12 there was bolter in any of my games…
But, by curiosity, what would be the few weapons that should deal with carapace then?
Dude… i never said in this thread revolver should be nerfed right here right now. It’s actually the opposite what I did say.
It should be nerfed but with new weapon drop as the countermeasure.
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It takes 3 headshots to kill a single Crusher assuming they’re all crits
Out of 5 rounds
With slow ass reload
I don’t know what difficulty you’re all playing on that you come in this thread and pretend that’s too strong, but i sure hope the devs are outright ignoring your feedback entirely
This is ridiculous