1 BB per special/elite, no matter what is around them, or how far away they are.
It is true, that in the perfect situation, assail has better TTK against 3 specials or some of the man sized elites, but the situations where you encounter the specialists, are usually not like that at all.
Also, if you use assail against everything, you will not have the number of stacks needed to quickly deal with specials or elites, when ever they show up.
What is that supposed to mean?
Anyone who actually uses something, can not give their opinion on how well it actually performs?
Ogryn elites are the most dangerous enemies and the most difficult to deal with.
In my experience, ogryn elites are a huge factor when it comes to wipes.
It is quite a bit different to âflamer is bad vs sniper so it is fineâ.
You do not usually encounter multiple snipers per minute, or 8 of them at once. Snipers do not overrun you and prevent you from attacking anything else, by building a meaty and metaly wall in front of you.
Aside from that, you can quite easily ignore snipers for some time and then just go and 1 shot them with your melee, when you finally go and catch them.
1 BB per special/elite, no matter what is around them, or how far away they are.
Ive been messing with left and middle tree and i cant oneshot flamers nor ragers unless i have empowered BB. Im taking 20% dmg for peril but maybe im missing something. I could do it pre patch with 6 stacks. Even maulers take 3 BBs if you are not full peril
Actually i cant oneshot ragers even with empowered bb unless i have 15%~ peril lmao. Not sure how you get faster TTK on BB when you need 3 BBs for maulers and 2 for ragers/flamers. Everything else gets deleted by knives bare ogryns that you seem to struggle the most with for some reason
What is that supposed to mean?
Anyone who actually uses something, can not give their opinion on how well it actually performs?
It means that people generally defend things they like since they are biased. Do you remember review bomb after flamer nerfs?
Of course, people are biased towards things they like.
People are also biased against things they do not like.
If you use something, you probably like it.
If you do not use something, you probably do not like it, or like something else more.
If you want to completely eliminate bias, nobody can comment at all.
Or only those who do not use a thing, can say how op it is, and only people who do use a thing, can say how bad it is.
If you want to completely eliminate bias, nobody can comment at all.
Or only those who do not use a thing, can say how op it is, and only people who do use a thing, can say how bad it is.
I used shredder, flamer and knives and i enjoy playing it, sure. Itâs nice to be one man army and not need your team while spamming one button. Problem comes when people only use that build and get used to it so much like you ve seen with flamer and PS, they blindly defend it no matter what since they canât/ donât want to play any other way and will review bomb if it will get nerfed.
They are completely oblivious about their teammates enjoyment of the game. Even if you like the build you must ask yourself how does your team feel while you do 80% of the things in a map? I personally feel bad when i play like that and is why i rarely ran shredder even if its was fun and optimal. Also game gets very stale when one option completely outperforms the others. 95% of psykers i see all run assail, in other classes even if one option is slightly stronger you still see a variation of builds like 45/30/25 unlike with psyker.
I tested BB again and it just cant compare. It leaves a lot of enemies with 20-100hp missing breakpoints even on empowered version
Veteran by far. I was excited for this patch, and and hopefully getting to specialize in Autoguns specifically for horde clearing and specialist suppressing dakka. Before the patch they were really making it seem like we could specialize according to our preferred play style and weapon type.
When I got into the game to allocate the skills? Well⌠I was disappointed to see that my build was pretty much identical to the Veteran Sharpshooter as it was pre-patch, just much more heavily nerfed. I lost damage, I lost ammo, and I lost a lot of survivability and utility that I had before. Who greenlit this? Who looked at any of this and thought it was a good idea?
BB is not new and a lot of people are bad at using it.
Smite is new and looks very cool. It offers great crowd control, but minimal damage.
Killing things is usually more exciting that disabling them.
Of course most people use assail right now.
I donât think it is close to 95%. More like 70%, but assail is clearly the most interesting option to test out right now.
That does not mean it is overpowered.
I use Kinetic Presence aura (10% elite dmg) and Warp Rider (max +20% power based on peril).
All 4 gunner elites, sniper, trapper and bomber die in 1 shot, when starting the cast at 0 peril.
Both flamers, poxburster and the dog will survive with 26 hp when starting the BB cast at 0% peril. If you start casting at ~30% peril, they all die in 1 shot.
Both berserkers survive a BB even if you hit them at 100% peril, but they die in 1 shot, when starting the cast at ~30% peril and with active empowerment.
The additional damage when hitting berserkers with a few stacks of soulblaze from venting shriek, also results in them dying to 1 brainburst, without active empowerment.
This is something worth considering, since BB gets a cast speed bonus after ulting.
Given that itâs approx 48 hours since the patch went live, thatâs not really surprising - itâs new, and itâs the kill-ier option of the new choices. Iâve been mixing and matching for the most part, but Assail has fantastic novelty value so itâs seen more use - Smite is cool, but weâve had lightning before. We havenât had head seeking missiles though! Same deal with the shield - big damage buff is not as interesting, and Psykineticâs Wrath isnât new/shiny
Also, wtf is 45/30/25? Is this some syntax people are using to describe builds now?
Thing is it took me 5 minutes of a game to figure that one out. I donât get how fs and their private testers didnât.
I hope theyâre not just fishing for steam player statsâŚ
Heâs saying that if it were balanced, 45% of players would pick the left option, 30% would opt for the middle one and 25% would go for the rightmost one.
Also the vet might have been hit the hardest but he was also the most deserving ; I think we need some hindsight to see the place heâs at currently.
I did that same build, but without the specific blessings, and the headhunter felt so incredibly lame to me. Too bad I canât swap blessings to test things out. What blessings did you have on the helbore? I noticed my mk1 did alright, but it wasnât quite at your level.
I dont think anyone got the âshort strawâ I think there were 3 very closely sized strays and one that was double the length and the psyker picked that one.
After playing all 4 with several builds there are several viable choices on them all, Vet, Zealot and Ogryn all feel GOOD, they arenât bad, sure maybe some playstyles changed (whos didnt) but the Psyker definitely needs tweaks to go from boring op mindless clicking to being just as good as the rest.
Psyker players when the nerf hits are gonna cry all over again like BB from beta because theyâre stuck in their mindless no worry gameplay when everyone else actually has to play the game as intended.
My biggest issue is that the new ults for Vet donât offer anything substantial. Letâs compare Vet stealth against Zealot stealth:
Zealot
Attacking breaks stealth, with guaranteed crit chance and +100% finesse and backstab damage
Cooldown is 30 seconds
Can reset cooldown in just 5 backstabs
Can reset cooldown in 15 crits (very easy to do with a crit-focused build)
Can grant toughness and DMG resist every, spammable activation
Vet
Attacking breaks stealth, no innate bonus, can spec for only +30% damage for just 5 seconds for an additional talent point
Cooldown is 60 seconds
Can reset cooldown with 10 specialist kills
Also grants toughness
Most notably, can give 10 seconds of pseudo-stealth after it ends
Why is Vetâs stealth on twice the cooldown length, with a singular, much more strict means of resetting the cooldown, no innate damage bonus, and with modifier talents that are barely worth the talent point that they cost? I mean, sure, the ult grants full toughness on activationâbut Vet doesnât need toughness replenishment with these skill trees, when he can get 50% toughness from killing a single elite (or stacking multiple, other toughness talents).
Stealth of the vet is different. You use it to take a position and kill enemies suprised
On zealot you use it to go behind an enemy (crusher) and backstab it
I play both⌠both have a different gameplay (and depending of your choices)
Zealot assassin is really fun. Commando is also. Getting behind enemy lines, killing all threats in no time⌠thatâs great.
You can use stealth, for both, to also avoid things like dogs, trappers etcâŚ
Really a good addition for both classes.
Also you have forgotten than stealth on zealot is only 3s (but thereâs a talent to get 6s but you miss the one that increase backstab damages) while the one of veteran is 6s and have a talent to get 2 charges.
But what is pleasing me with the new system is that you can really adaptâŚ
I did one commando at first with smoke grenade⌠now I use krak grenadeâŚ
I tried 3 different assassin template before finding the one that I likeâŚ
Thatâs really great!
Can you offer any generalized advice on the stealth build specifically? Iâve been stumbling with trying to figure it out and I have no frame of reference for this kind of approach.
Conceptually vet is fine, but other classes are overtuned relative to it, so he feels weak. Especially for those that play multiclass. Although, if the argument is that buffs are needed, yes I agree. Survivability is the biggest problem IMO. In terms of redoing stuff, Auras, the location of the ammo capacity talent, and grenade talent node distribution are some of the bigger sticking points IMO.
In detail, grenade nodes need to be consolidated and redistributed in a way that is accessible by all other trees without incurring unwanted point tax nodes. A grenadier build is way too expensive in both utility, survivability and DMG tradeoffs to reasonably invest in currently. A consolidation or buff if not rework of all auras is needed. Wth the way the ammo economy is currently survivalist is the only viable aura node. All others donât provide enough benefit to be viable alternatives. Even then, if we donât start getting ammo capacity buffs across the board soon then this one will need to be buffed too anyways. Always Prepared needs to be closer to the center or the top and be part of the officer tree just so all three trees have ready access to it. All commando DMG comes from talents dependant on high RoF weapons, who in their sane mind did not factor ammo economy into this balancing decision why is it so expensive for commando vets to access Survivalist and Always Prepared!?
You can use it defensively and offensively if you spec into the modifier nodes. You can use it to:
Disengage if youâre about to get clapped,
Push firing lines with or without cover
Flank HVTs, and/or for assassinating grenadiers and snipers while exposing yourself to them or other ranged threats from afar.
Revive pinned allies
Stay alive and rush revive points for clutching. Caveat, the timing is tight, so depending on maps and conditions youâll need to work on getting it right. Donât just pop it thinking itâll get you to the other end of the map unharmed, ez pz.
Refill your toughness in a pinch.
Get some burst DMG if you want something dead. Offbrand Executionerâs Stance.
Try some MLG sh*t coupled with Tactical Awareness (the CDR talent). This will allow you spam it and also open up the possibility of using it to manage aggro. It needs some practice though.
Engage in defensive or offensive bounding with low mobility weapon builds.
Itâs incredibly versatile if you set it up right.
Perfect Timing (+warp damage on crit) could be subbed in to help offset one of the first two requirements; Malefic Momentum isnât accessible when you take Brain Burst, so thatâs not an option
There is an acknowledge bug where Warp Rider is calculating damage based on Brain Burstâs base damage instead of Brain Ruptureâs base damage, which may nudge you over the threshold (or enable taking another aura and the Ranged Damage node without losing the breakpoint)
EDIT: Or go full insanity mode, take Scrierâs Gaze and just spam elites with it. When it expires, quell a bit (Empowered Psionics casts at 100% peril kill you right now, thereâs a bug report for it already), and use the extra 10 seconds of +10-30% damage to continue your massacre. Conveniently, if youâre charging Brain Rupture, you can cast Scrierâs Gaze without interrupting the charge.
The Precognition upgrade to Scrierâs Gaze is very nice, since Brain Rupture is always a weakspot kill.
No nerf of too strong things are needed as I said in an other thread (sure I did not point everything that is too strong)
Depend of what classâŚ
On zealot I did several tries. I like the one that can play lonely. I used fury for every templates, it feels great with a critic template. Aura and nades you can choose. However, I have chosen the knives just to get spare points (and there is a talent about backstab - not really convinced by knives except against dreg rager).
Swift certainly is for me mandatory⌠as is a dagger with ruthless backstab.
For Vet, I wanted a commando. So, my template is a balance between melee and ranged. I use a tactical axe and a braced autogun (actually agri, but I search for a columnus).
I use hit & run and stripped down, so two defensive blessings that can help with the role.
For the template, I aimed to close quater zone as I wanted a close combat template. Stealth, all improvements. And I added a grenadier role (grenadier, demolition stockpile, grenade tinkerer).
Thatâs work great.
The 60s cooldown and the fact you cannot reduce it tend to slow the gameplay and you cannot spam stealth like with the zealot. But it can be great especially with 2 charges.
Apologies if Iâm misreading you, but I feel like youâre contradicting yourself, would you mind clarifying? Iâm not sure I get what youâre trying to to say here. Is it that there are things here and there that need to be tuned if not nerfed outright? Which is my takeaway from your linked post. Or is it that no nerfs are needed at all? This is what Iâm getting from the quoted post. Or is the overall point that the vet is fine and requires no changes?
