I thought it was obvious. Not using 2 block cost reduction properties for shielded weapons is wasting of it’s potential.
For those who not have Armory mod:
All weapons have two block cost modifiers, inner (effective block) and outer.
For most weapons it is 0.5 / 2.0.
For shielded weapons it is 0.2 / 2.0.
For rapier it is 0.3 / 2.0.
For elven one-handed sword it is 0.5 / 1.5.
For elven dual swords it is 0.5 / 1.0.
For elven sword and dagger it is 0.8 / 1.5.
I recommend to use two Block cost reduction properties for Shields and Rapier, and at least one for other weapons. Otherwise hits from behind will stagger you too often. Also, it will increase chances to pick up downed ally while being attacked.
That’s a weird design choice… I mean S&D is in a good place, but it feels weird that they just decided to increase frontal block cost with ONLY that weapon. So it would confirm my though it’s really a weapon for HM, or at least made to dodge a hell lot. (Same goes for Rapier which is designed for WHC).
Even 1 Block Cost Reduction feature is generally enough to make it work on a high-stamina weapon. I’ve soaked the hits with my Kerillian spear in the past. However, in most not ridiculously-high stamina cases, it will break your guard unless you are on a solid weapon as @Adeon posted above.
There are characters who block better than others And that’s sorta why we want to see some nifty changes to the shield!
Yea I understand. It’s just, you’re not going to take block cost reduction and trade away a stat you need on a damage dealer. So for nearly all weapons, overheads will take all stamina. The exception being Seinna, as all 3 classes can be built for 100%+ block reduction.
So, I made a small research. All those results are for 60% bcr. Time is actulally nedeed to regen such amount of stamina, which is taken, when blocking CW overhead.
And time nedeed to reset dodge.
You need 5 seconds on default to gain stamina worth 1 chaos warrior overhead at worst scenario
You need ~2,16 seconds on HM with 30% stamina regen trinket to do the same.
Shield lover butthurt alert
Or you need ~1 second on default, without any item properties or talents(BCR, etc etc) to reset your dodge, each worth of evading 4+ overheads
As far as I know, Unchained can’t have 100% block cost reduction, Dissipate is not works that way. She have additional x0.5 modifier when overcharged. The level of damage reduction is similar to shields.
If I calculating it right, final modifier will be:
For shields: 0.2 * 0.4=0.8 (modifier, block reduction)
For Sienna: 0.5 * 0.4 * 0.5=0.1 (modifier, block reduction, Dissipate)
See my first video. If it was so, there would be no damage to stamina.
For 1st and 2nd Siennas the talent description is similar, and slightly different for 3rd.
I’m pretty sure this is exactly what happened. Everything about shields fits this.
I’ve tested it, sort of (in game, not with mods), and from what I can tell she DOES get 100%, but only on 5 heat stacks, and that only lasts for a block or two because blocking vents heat and you lose those stacks.
Part of why I love the sword and board, honestly would like to see a few more weapons with advanced movesets. It’s a shame how many weapons have 1 or 2 good attacks that are simply spammed to victory (coughhalberdcough)
I haven’t read all of this massive topic but here is my take:
It would be nice if they would offer a different play style just like 2h should (lol).
A play style that is not centered around dodges but blocking, pushing and bashing.
Therefore they deed to be able to deal with unblockable attacks of bosses. I would suggest timed blocking or timed pushing.
They need to have resistance against all stamina consuming attacks since they can’t and should not have to deal with them by dodging again timed blocking and timed pushes would do great here.
About actual block capabilities: it wouldn’t hurt to give them the ability to block warpfire too and btw Salty’s eternal guard really feels like the shields should.
But the entire thing isn’t just a case of the shield being bad, it’s also most (used) weapons being way to versatile without any real shortcomings.
Thanks, exactly what i wanted and supports how i thought the current blocking works.
That still seems kinda wasteful especially considering you usually need those slots for stats to hit breakpoints. I kinda understand it for shields but everything else you might be better off just killing stuff faster.
Well put. I think you’re on the money with your thought that someone misjudged exactly how their design for shields would translate to real gameplay.
This is a big part of why I like them. I’d love to see more weapons get this treatment. I hope, if they do decide that shields need some attention, that we don’t lose this.
I love playing with Sw+S. It has a mix of combos, they chain into each other in different ways, and you have to master all of them. I really wish more weapons worked like this. I can see potential in something like Flame Sword but the combos just don’t work right.
I believe that every weapon needs to have a certain minimum capacity against all foes. If something is completely worthless vs armor for example, it just won’t get used, armor is way too common. No character or build can afford to have a weapon that’s impossible to use for 50% of the game - unless they can offset with a ranged weapon, like Sienna does. They should have strengths and weaknesses, perhaps even extreme ones, but not lockouts. Kruber’s 2h Sword (post 1.3) is a good example, it’s ideal for hordes but just strong barely enough vs armor to get the job done.
What is over the top is that so many weapons can do all things with all combos. Falchiaxe for example can everything it wants with just left clicks. Sw+Shield on the other hand has access to all the needed attack combos, but it’s not easy access, and you can’t do both at the same time. You’re either making anti-horde attacks or anti-armor attacks and they don’t mix. That’s the kind of balance we should see more of. Keri’s 1h Sword is also good at this, but much easier to use, it would probably make a good baseline - not counting it’s OP dodge count ofc.
Well, as far as I remember I had problems with breakpoints and block cost only with Rapier.
I wanted two block cost reduction, health, stamina, and crit chance.
Sure, you can use only one block cost reduction on Rapier and it will be fine, it is just I a little bit geek about defense.
I agree. One of the reasons why I love elf 1h sword so much. If you know how to properly use the attack chains, it is one of the most versatile and simply best weapons in the game (especially on HM). But this is something that has to be taken in account. Part of the reason why the BTU weapons are so good is because their attack patterns are no-nonsense straight forward geared towards how the game is played. It just adds to the shields’ quirkyness and the reward for it is mediocre atm.
And that’s sorta why we want to see some nifty changes to the shield!
