The devs should go to a real life firing range to see a real life carbine rifle and then ask themselves at what distance they would feel comfortable to be shot at with one. If the Scab Stalkers are not highlighted outside of that range, it’s fine.
Scab shooters without the gas mask not being highlighted by Veteran's Counterfire is "not-a-bug"
No matter the range, as long as it shoots, it is a “shooter” or not?
I understand that they are more short ranged fighters. Kind of shock troops. But i still believe the ability should highlight them anyway. I am glad there are different behavior trees for different shooter types. But it is still a shooter.
And even in melee range, if you’re not melee in hand, they just shoot
Is it time to start using logic? I know it’s hard, but let us try?
What is the difference between ranged enemy in DT and melee one? - Pattern of behavior!
Ranged troops spread out into free cover near by and start picking shots, while melee rushing toward aggressor, trying to encircle.
Now what those scab gunners doing:
a) Rushing in with fixed bayonets.
b) Spreading out and engaging on sight.
But he switch to melee weapon, when player stick their melee weapon next to their nose…
… just like many other ranged enemies. Wow, huge success!
Now that there’s a mod that changes this behaviour, time to raise this topic from the past as it’s relevant again.
Ironically the scab shooters (gas mask lasgunners) have a longer melee activation range than the scab stalkers, I’ve seen them charge across a room to engage in melee. Dreg and Scab stalkers will keep shooting you for an extra burst or two despite you hitting them with melee before switching to melee.
And that’s why I think threads should not close after 7 days…
Yeah, that closing and locking thing is super inconsistent.
This continues on. They clearly think this is a good design decision lol
In a way, Shootgunners are more short-range shooters then guys mentioned in bug…
yah, but they’re also elites, so they get highlighted anyways
not saying i think the other guys shouldn’t be highlighted, just saying that’s why they are
One good idea I saw floating around was instead of having a 2 handed lascarbine, they should have their melee weapon and laspistol out at the same time. That will definitely visually change up their silhouette and animations to something a bit more distinct, and having a different reaction time to being melee’d differentiates them mechanically too.
This. And it is ok lore-wise (-ish, because troops in most cases go with standard weapon, not pistols… the “melee weapon + pistol” looks seem to stick only to Rogue Trader captains or higher officers).
These Guys are Stalkers, which use Swords at Close Range unlike Shooters which have Full Masks and only use Bayonet for Melee.
FS said that they will not be highlighted due to their Name and Function Buddy.
Hes a Stalker makes sense you cant highlight since they are good with stealth so to speak!
they shoot at you, even point blank. They’re shooters.
Yeah I pointed out kind of the problem in another thread.
Their current design does not fit what the enemy supposedly does behaviour wise.
Except in game they tend to not work like that and they keep using ranged even fairly close. They sometimes keep advancing but that’s not always the case as often they will just sit and shoot you.
You can call something a fancy name and claim they function a certain way but if they function exactly the same as another thing 90% of the time you’re doing a terrible job at enemy design. Note that the Dreg enemy that shoots you is also called a Dreg stalker but is still highlighted.
And the model doesn’t reflect that at all. It would be different if they had a similar urban camo job like the sniper, a lighter helmet with a cover, a camo wrapping, etc but they don’t. Instead they look like any other shooter but they instead pair with the shotgunner.
What if i told you, that one of the two enemy types that get designated as „shooters“ by the feat, are actually also called stalkers?
There are three types of human sized non elite shooty bois
- Dreg Stalker (the sand people)
- Scab Shooter (green glowy eyes)
- Scab Stalker (annoying cunts that do not get marked)
So the „shooter is not in their name“ argument does not work.
The ult says „all shooters“. Not „scab shooters and dreg stalkers“.
Where did you see how they are intended to attack in any way?
They just dont get highlighted, have a real melee weapon and thats it…
I agree however that they should work a bit more like Dregs in going into melee. However they are soldiers so they obvioulsy have discipline and tend to stay together and shoot you like we would aswell ^^
Lighter Armor does not reflect it?
Hes a Stalker/ Scout, and of course they have lighter Armor.
How can that not be stalthier?
What do you want exactly a Shinobi running around?
Never seen Scouts running around in Ghillie Suits, excepts they are Snipers, so ur Point is invalid iMHO.
*BTW i was only pointing that out what was said!
Maybe FS thought that Dregs are “normal” Peopz and not military and have not learned skills to hide and “stalk” Prey?! ever thought about that.
Or its a bug which is probably not since they stated that with stalkers a while ago and ywouldnt have left out the dreg Stalkers, makes no sense. Its on purpose!
- YOu dont neeed to tell me i know it well enough, and that was the whole point of this Topic aint it. so why tell me like i did not know XD*
There is only one Stalker designated/ Highlighted and thats the Dreg Stalker.
Dregs are not military like Scabs. So it would make sense. Its on purpose since FS pretty sure, did not forget it on Dregs by accident. The highlighting was in Topics so many times its on purpose yet again.
Scab Stalkers have lighter Armor, seems they are scouts in that regard. Would make sense them being Comboed with Swords and not just bayonets in case they would get spotted especially at close range.
F.ex. Space Marine Scouts have lighter armor aswell. Looks practically the same in regard of how much armor. So they are quieter and faster and nimbler!
So now my argument its totally fine, the one which was not an argument at all in the first place, but Pointing something out! ^^
Gameplay-wise it doesn’t matter if they’re narratively “more sneaky” when you’re literally wallhacking their Scab Shooter and Dreg Stalker counterparts. The issue is still with readability, since their helmets, ranged weapon pose and animation silhouettes, and behaviour, are essentially identical to scab shooters until you’re literally in melee range.