The draw animation/sequence is way too long. It’s a liability to get the weapon out and ready unless you preempt the need for it. The plasma gun is way quicker to draw and fire.
When hip firing, why does it double-shoot? Just make it semi-auto or automatically with a slightly slower but regular firing rate whether shooting from hip or ADS.
Have the gun do fixed damage regardless of where it hits. Maybe as a counter-balance it needs to have no bonus headshot damage - just more base damage that always apply.
Slightly faster reload.
Fix the the horrendous jumping / kickback effect when ADSing.
The gun is just soo cumbersome that after you unload a clip in most heavy engagements you’ll never be able to get it reloaded in time to be used again.
about this i have a complaint aswell, when using executioner’s stance
so normally if you press F with exe stance it would haste your draw animation while you are equipping a melee ok?
BUT
if you press F while you are in the animation you get animation locked for another full draw animation without being able to shoot, it sucks, its bad, it has been like this since the new draw animation was implemented @fatshark please fix this its for real though
Patch 13’s Executioner’s stance is so bad that i deserve to be shooting immediatly after i’ve pressed that damn F
even if i’m aware about the animation bug i still get stuck in that sometimes and its awfull
It is when you and I are discussing things: because you know full well I mean no one here was complaining in the context of balance conversations about the weapon.
It was too weak relative to other options on zealot in many cases. I’m not saying it was a weak weapon, but on zealot the draw time was pretty prohibitive for such a fast moving class and despite that draw time (and very low ammo supply) it often failed to 1-shot basic shooters (dregs in particular, which it still does). All those weaknesses together meant it was largely used only as a solution to elite armor blobs and crusher patrols when running weapons like the Heavy Sword which lack fast and safe resolution to those threats.
I agree in part here. Vet IS and should be stronger with ranged weapons. And still would be if everything I suggested above is added to the game. But he doesn’t need instant reload for that to be true at all. Instant reload is a cut above many other ways of improving the strength of various weapons and it was largely fine on other weapons except our friend the bolter precisely because it is an alpha strike capable weapon. Alpha strike is very hard to balance in every single video game its added to. The reason is very simple - time value. Alpha strike weapons usually have less damage over the course of a game but, when played well, they are deployed at the time they are needed most to maximum effect. Which means they have compounding value for being good at delivering high burst damage to key targets, and at eliminating those key targets right when it matters most. The downtime built into such weapons doesn’t matter as much if the key threats are dead and cannot threaten you while you’re on downtime. Doubling the shots in the bolter doubles the uptime, doubles the number of threats that can be killed, on what was (at the time) an insanely strong weapon. I am arguing for broadscale weapon buffs that would only be compounded by vet’s talent tree being so good for ranged weapons. Its not like I don’t think vet should have the best of it here. Its just that I have always believed the doubled mag size caused by this ability was the key balance problem and it seems to me that Fatshark agreed (though that’s not really points in my corner per se).
Its not a false argument and I hope I have better detailed my reasoning above.
You know I’m never going to be offended by anyone, least of all you, trying to poke holes in my argument. I’d rather someone find them than not.
I think the bolter with my buffs wouldn’t have the same ammo problems anyway. Its fine that it has ammo problems, but part of those problems is the number of times I ADS at something and either take two hits to kill a peasant in rags or miss because twitchy shot recovery that makes no sense.
Yep. I was meaning that description as praise for the design of the weapon being so accurate.
You’ve given me a really spicy idea. What if for bolt weapons the Weapon Special was customizable (like an "attachment). You carry ONE (1) mag of special ammunition with you that can only be replenished from ammo crates or something. You get to choose what kind of rounds the special mag has loaded. Hitting the Weapon Special button reloads with this mag and lets you reap whatever benefits you took with you. would be WAY cooler than the silly gun smack.
It could work. Execution might be a bit wonky though. A better idea in my opinion would be to simply make different marks of the bolter for different ammunition.
Personally I want to see the in place weapon customization implemented. So I think the special key should be reserved for attachments going forward…
Yes but I don’t like the design of the weapon being headshot focused in the first place. We have enough finesse weapons. We need more power weapons. That’s why I suggested largely normalizing out the weapon and suggested breakpoints the way I did.
Sure enough. My rogue trader book is also 24. Its even the same pattern we have, and has full auto. I swear I saw 15 somewhere. Musta just made it up in my head after too many darktide games.
Standard Bolter ammunition is designed to penetrate the target and then detonate, causing immense damage and leaving little opportunity for survival.
Maybe convert some of its damage into a small explosion (like if they’re standing side by side) such that the direct target takes the same damage as it is now, but people around it take a decent chunk too. This would help differentiate it from the plasma gun’s line cleave and give the bolter a niche aswell, as they are essentially fully automatic mini grenade launchers in lore.
I’ve used the Bolter a little bit on both vet and zealot (lets say maybe 20 hrs ?). I don’t have an expert opinion. As a newbie to it, this is my opinion:
It’s just about the best gun in the game.
It’s also just about the worst gun in the game.
If you’ve got it ready to fire, and a full clip (w/e it’s called) to work with, then you’re about to be a gaming monster. Your team will bask in the amount of DPS you’re about to lay down on enemies.
However, if you’ve just decided you need to switch to it from melee, or heaven forbid, you’ve just run out of ammo in your volley, then it’s like holding a pair of brass monkeys in your hands. You’re going to stand there looking mighty stupid for about 3-5 seconds.
For me, it’s such a marmite experience and one I just don’t like. I remember how OP it was on the old veteran with instant swap or instant reload. That’s more than likely why that skill disappeared for the vet: purely because of the bolter.
God knows how you’d balance that weapon. I know for sure if the emperor had it, he wouldn’t have built the death star twice.
Original Bolter was ridiculously OP. But then again, it should be. In warhammer 40k lore, the bolter IS an op weapon.
Ammo should be very limited and handling should be super bad but IF u spend a precious round to hit something, whatever it was, it should pretty much stop existing right away.
Amen, Reg.
I still use the bolter, since well… it is a bolter. I love the juicy sounds and the “clunky” feeling of the weapon. I share your sentiments here, the weapon should be slow, cumbersome but hit like a train. You need to feel the weight of awesomeness here.
Having to shoot a dreg twice or spent half of a clip on one dog is immersion breaking and unfun, simple as.
I don’t know if anyone’s fired a weapon at FatShark, but the bullet goes where the barrel is pointing, not some random angle in a cone from the barrel (just in case they’re unaware that’s the tube what directs bullets from the chamber to the target once fired). The recoil system used in the game makes the sights of any high-recoil weapons basically useless since they’re not seeming to use the actual iron sights for anything at that point and even if your second or third or fourth shot in a salvo should be on target, they go flying at some random angle in the general area (especially with the Bolter).
I mean… c’mon the Bolter is The Emperor’s Wrath… which is why it probably shouldn’t be shite.
Admittedly, they’re originally meant for Astartes to… y’know… purge non-compliant humans, but the fluff and tabletop all have human-wieldable variants.
The ammunition is also technically self-propelled, so while it DOES have a casing that is struck & ejected (because it just seems cooler-- the og writers/creators knew so little about actual weapons technology which is fairly evident when you take a look at what the bolter shells are supposedly composed of), there probably should not be as much recoil as there is in-game.
There’s really no issue with the recoil in my view. It is a two stage projectile where the first impulse fires a fairly GIRTHY round. Even if its not at full terminal velocity out of the barrel there’s no doubt its a significant bit of mass being shoved out of the barrel. Even an RPG7 has a fair bit of apparent recoil despite the kicker charge functioning on the premise of a recoilless system. The Bolter’s initial system is clearly a closed action so it the recoil from the kicker charge would be absorbed by the user which includes no stock whatsoever in common usage.
But yes - the ADS behavior on the bolter is heinous. Its both a precision AND a mag dump weapon. Its flexibility and power are the reason you take it.
