You’re telling me you can go an entire Havoc match - 3 boss spawns, 50 special spawns, flamers, bombers, poxbursters, dogs, mutants, trappers, crushers, maulers, ragers, flames everywhere, gas everywhere, poxwalkers everywhere, gunners hiding everywhere - for 20-40 minutes straight, DURING all of that - you will never once accidentally “walk” into the open? Damn, teach me your ways please.
Gunners can also be hidden behind entire groups of enemies which makes them completely invisible while they are perfectly aware of your presence and will delete you because of it. Havoc isn’t fun, and has never been fun. I got to 40 once in the very beginning and haven’t touched it since. Even if there was a quickplay option, I still don’t even know if I would bother.
It isn’t enjoyable needing to achieve a level of perfection on top of being completely limited to builds that most would consider unenjoyable. I have also noticed a major trend toward people linking their havoc videos and 9/10 times it’s either A. Kitchen knife. B. Gold toughness spam. C. broken builds that nullifie half the game. D. Mods that turn the game into easy mode.
I’ll take my “easy” maelstroms any day rather than sweating my balls off trying to be omniscient toward the presence of gunners spawning in obscure places, hiding behind boxes, behind a box on bridges 20 feet above you, being on parts of the map that are completely inaccessible. Yes, completely fair. Oh, and being forced to play a build I don’t even want to play because that’s the ONLY way to survive. Let’s not bring up the fact that a single NON ELITE gunner with a lasgun is also more deadly than a SNIPER with a SNIPER.
This is a perfect example of artificial difficulty and I truly hope they bring it into line so people who actually enjoy the game can play it and not only the ones who min/max everything to the point of unenjoyment and spreadsheets.
You take flamer/bomber resistance to for less fire damage, I take flamer/bomber reistance to tank their respective Sparta Kicks. Those kicks would even kill the Emperor himself.
Some people enjoy Havoc as it is, that’s fine and I’m interested to hear their PoV.
However I do not play havoc primarily because of the gunners. It’s not even elite gunners that are the issue, it’s the peashooters. I don’t find it fun or engaging that they become the single greatest threat in the game.
You can do this already, by applying suppresion to them (shooting at them or near them). Suppression makes their accuracy be really bad
Maybe, I do think all gunner damage should be nerfed by 20%, but remove gunner res from curios
This way it opens build diversity, without making these enemies useless
This is a Havoc thing really, firerate is fine overall
This is not a good thing tbh, gunners should be dangerous
Players shouldn’t be able to use 3 curio slots to essentially reduce their damage by 50%, that’s dumb (and yes even I abuse this)
This is why I suggested their base damage should be reduced by 20-25%, but then remove gunner res from curios forever
I think their threat level is fine
It wouldn’t feel so much instashredding if most players weren’t forced to run gunner res (which means they could run +toughness to pad this issue)
In the vid you presented you only had 80 toughness (the 75 gold toughness expired right before the shooter started shooting at you), and each shot took 20 toughness. And since you had no defense buff active ofc they’re gonna shred you
You can compare this by for example using blazing piety builds with the 25% DR from having max stacks, or martyrdom at 5 stacks (you were at full hp on the vid) with the TDR node, it’s QUITE the difference on this
I like them because they pose an actual threat in havoc and make you mindful of them (reminds me of the days when Stalkers were considered dangerous enemies and people wanted Exe Stance to highlight them). In mission board games they’re the least dangerous enemy and are constantly ignored. I personally don’t mind having to pay attention to more enemies.
There could probably be a better balance between “near instant kill” and “not-a-threat-despite-actively-shooting-you” though.
My guy, you are posting and saying “ehh they’re fine” when majority of your videos are you running around with the kitchen knife and stealth. Of course you think they’re fine. OP is right, game turns from Darktide to SLIDETIDE.
I’d also love an explanation as to how a single gunner with a lasgun is more deadly than a sniper special. Has anyone actually considered this? You can face tank sniper shots now, especially after their nerf. Yet, a single gunner non elite on havoc can kill you FASTER and more efficiently than a sniper could ever dream of. Makes absolutely no sense.
honestly i really should but i the game is already runnign like absolute garbage on my amd hardware that im not sure if i can afford having obs open in the background. i think maybe in the futur ei will but i’ve been frankly too much darktide recently
well besides the obvious nerf they gotten, specials arent there to explicilty do damage but to force you into bad positions that makes it easy for the actual damage dealers like elites or even just regular groaners to take a pot shot on you and chip away your health.
it’s very rare that an actual special does damage to you but more so the elements surrounding the special. snipers are very telegraphed in the way with the laser focuses on you- more so than almost any other enemy in the game- but the danger (and often the fear LOL) of potentially being shot is frankly often cascades into you either needing to respect sightlines and give up ground or have to use valuable dodges to avoid the sniper shot that would’ve been used to dodge something actually dangerous like an overhead
that’s also not mentioning that ranged in general is jsut heavily skewed into you having TDR to survive exchanges. telopots mentioned this over a year ago back when the game didnt even have havoc but the exisstence of TDR basically means that builds (or really particular moments where you cant proc it) will be heavily hurt by ranged attacks- while the alternative of having TDR hilariouisly just makes you be able to facetank several gunners. it’s hilarious in how dichotomous it is and light and day having just 1 or 2 sources if TDR is compared to when you dont
Theyre fine when they spawn in a balanced amount with other melee elites. You can generally manage them with even the worst anti-ranged team comp in this case. However on certain seeds havoc will regularly spawn blobs of 100% trash shooters and rooms full of nothing but gunners and reapers; I do not find these 100% ranged enemy encounters fun at all. In addition many older maps have sightlines and enemy cover that are very obviously not balanced around havoc 40 shooter power and density. For example I don’t think anyone has fun playing the silo cluster opening on a gunner seed besides exe stance vet.
From the content you had been posting regarding Havoc, majority of what you post are with a kitchen knife and stealth. I didn’t claim to know you, I am making an observation based on the content you provide.
