But I noticed that gunners have ammo and need to reload. It might be interesting to lower the ammo they have so when they reload you get a moment of respite.
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They used to have ammo and a need to reload, likewise they used to stop shooting you if you got within melee range. Now they shoot pretty much forever and will ignore melee engagement unless you stagger them.
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The ones in the testing chamber seemed to only fire so long before reloading. I was using the creature spawn mod to test how long my psyker could block gunners shots. That’s when I saw that they eventually stop shooting and start playing with their gun for a bit before firing again.
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what character is it unfair against?
psykters? they have more then enough things to deal with ranged enemies
360 shield that blocks bullets, Long range staffs, long range abilities, unlimited ammo (with staffs)
zealot maybe? well yeah some zealot builds might struggle, mainly support zealot, support zealot would need a good range weapon with efficient ammo use against long range i assume, i don’t play support zellot shrugs
dash zealot doesn’t care about range, you just dash and slide you want through the bullets
invis zealot, i assume would not have trouble closing distance on range enemies, although i don’t play invis zealot so i wouldn’t know, I’m just assuming them not being able to see you would be beneficial for that
veteran? yeah actually i could see this being a problem on veteran for some builds
your abilities don’t help you much, veteran’s ant range is basically, kill them before they kill you
or take a plasma rife and wall hacks, then just shoot them through walls
ogren? i don’t really play organ but that have a charge like the zealot and a slab shield, and a bunch of health? idk i haven’t leveled up organ yet
range defiantly is an issue, and it is something you as the player should be finding a way to deal with on any character, and if you can’t find a way to deal with it. well. google it someone will know how to deal with X problem on X character 9 times out of 10 their is a solution to all the problems, and you can take the solutions into the game with you
hell if their are allot of gunners maybe just throw a grenade at them more gunners = more grenade kills, just a thought
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It is unfair to everyone. They literally ignore the mechanics the TUTORIAL tells you about. The tutorial teaches the player that entering melee range with ranged units will force them to either run away or engage you in melee.
This is true for shooters and stalkers and even those scumbag shotgunners that get stuck in the shooting animation and shoot you point-blank before changing to gun-bashing you. It isn’t always true of reapers because they have the uncanny ability to move and shoot and sometimes choose to walk backwards in order to keep shooting at you, but I mean they are literally unyielding-class enemies so that’s fine.
This is not true for gunners. At all. They will shoot at you as you close on them, ducking and dodging to not get shredded then when you are literally 1 meter in front of them they will just keep shooting as you go for a swing. If that swing does not stagger them they will keep shooting for a solid second for a total ignoring the engagement mechanic time of about 2-3 seconds. All other ranged units at most have a 1 second delay from the time you enter engagement range.
It isn’t unfair because of the damage potential, it is unfair because it literally should not be happening and because of the increase to elite spawn numbers and HP it is happening more often and is harder to deal with. Dreg gunners are particularly at-fault because they have a frankly stupid amount of HP and still have that wonky head hitbox that clips with their shoulders leading to unreliable one-shots on them, unlike scab gunners which not only have less HP but are uniformly armored and are easy to one-shot.
As to why I bring this up when the topic was about how they don’t seem to reload any more, simple: The above problem would be solved by them having less ammo before needing to reload. They always had this engagement ignore bug, but they used to have less ammo before reload (they used to only be able to fire continuously for about 5 seconds, now I have had instances of them shooting at me while I take cover for a solid 10-15 seconds. This is then made even worse if you get downed in their line of sight because they will quickly eat up your bleed-out timer by unloading into you.
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your not wrong, they can be tricky to deal with sometimes, and sometimes you can get stun locked by having a bunch of them shoot you into a corner unable to escape
sometimes they even manage to cancel my zealot dash when their is a bunch of them all recoiling you at the same time, like. it doesn’t happen that often but recoil from being shot does exist in the game
honestly the recoil is probably a large portion of the issue here, but even with that. i still don’t really see them as a problem, each class has a way to deal with pretty much everything in the game as it stands
i personally don’t feel robbed when i die on zealot of psykter. i feel like i always had a fair chance at surviving, and half the time that stuff only happens when your the last person alive and you are just completely overwhelmed with mobs, this game is all about team play after all, keeping your team alive, helping them, taking out things they cant deal with as well
it’s the reason i take krak grenades and get TF up shout on veteran with toughness regen for everyone
or why i play a front lining tank build on zealot, tanking all the damage and being a big, fast dodgy, toughness regen target to soak up all the damage so my squishy psykter/ vet don’t have to
or why i pretty much only run bubble lightning hands psyker to help protect my team from hoards of dogs and any gunfire
with that being said however. i get that while these builds are very good at helping you team, and winning missions. at the end of the day, other builds do exist, and it would be unreasonable if taking these builds. was the only way to play the game and have a fair chance at winning
i feel like. what we need to do. is take a look at the various builds, what they are strong against, what might counter them. what possible team combinations might be at play. and then try to balance the game that way
honestly. it would be allot of work to do such a thing. not something I’m really interested in doing. but it would be nice to see all the builds and their strengths and weaknesses
Tried putting some gunner resist on your curios? Wont help with getting stun locked, but it does help against getting evaporated the second a squad of gunners starts looking your way.
Them refusing to engage in melee does seem a problem. I don’t mind enemies being pereistent about wanting to shoot me but it does feel like gunners in particular should be vulnerable to this mechanic and instead they ignore it.
Yeah like I am fine with them shooting me as I run at them but when I am right next to them (much less have actually hit them) they shouldn’t just keep shooting.
My bet? it is an animation error. Since as soon as you stagger them(thus stopping their shooting animation) they immediately run.
I have noticed they also continue to shoot the cover you are hiding behind rather than change targets for a much longer time. Yeah, they should suppress you, makes sense, but them ignoring the guy standing 3m away from you in the open to do so… that feels off. Gonna go out on a limb here and say them allowing the AI director the ability to spawn more elites has bugged the targeting of said elites when they hit a critical mass, would not surprise me due to them having notoriously spaghetti-ed code.
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What on earth are you going on about.
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how about instead of just saying random words. you use your big boy brain and tell me what your talking about? rather then just saying “HURRR DUUR BLEER BLEER”
Veteran? That has access to suppression immunity, instant full toughness rigen, invisibility, increased ranged damage, better aim and an armory of versatile rangend weapons.
I think he’s got it covered.
Speaking like the Ogryn doesn’t exist, Darktide as usual lmao
don’t take my words out of context. my veteran is only level 21 and my organ is level 2 I’m sure they have things to compensate, I’m just not there yet
I’m a zealot main but i love psykter as well which is why i know more about them shrugs sue me
yeah that’s basically what i said, kill them before they kill you. shoot at them before they kill you, suppress whatever, which is why i said some builds may struggle, you don’t take surpassing on all builds. and killing them before they kill you, suppressing or whatever is the only way to counter them for veteran as far as i can see
and yes lobbing a grenade is killing them before they kill you. its kind of funny how even tho you explained to me what the counter is. you just explained exactly what i was already saying
i don’t understand how to talk to people online half the time, it makes no sense. i feel like I’m just talking to a brick wall half the time because things i say seem to just, fly right over peoples heads
it’s mainly an issue when their are multiple truths
here’s a truth
gunners are hard to deal with on SOME builds
here’s another truth
gunners have many counters to them
ok so we have 2 truths that seem to contradict each other, this stuff sends the internet crazy, expecting you to take sides or something, no its not as black and white as “gunner nerf or gunner buff”
this is a wider conversations that needs to be had
if your so simply minded just to say “gunners are a non issue because i play this one very specific build, and in this one very specific build they are a non issue” well, what about all the other builds you COULD be playing?
at some point it just becomes a question of "why bother giving the players a choice in the first place if they NEED to play a specific build in order to counter something
on the other hand. if your so simple minded to just say “gunners are too strong i have trouble with them” well, YES your probably right, the build your playing may not have a good couther to gunners, so that brings up the question, what’s the solution to that? can the build be changed? are you just going to rely on your team? what if no one on the team is build to deal with X thing in the game is that an issue we need to address?
see the problem here, the argument is 2 sided and both sides are correct, so miss me with this “what are you talking about your wrong I’m right” BS and take a wider view of the overall problem, stop being so small and close minded all the time, then maybe we can get down to the issue
honestly the issue is so hard to figure out in the first place if it even is an issue or not that, talking about it, probably wont help anything, theirs no right or wrong answer here their may or may not even be a problem here, or the problem just may only appear in very specific rare circumstances and we have to decide. is it even worth caring about when the circumstance is so rare?
Probably because you explain yourself bad…
To struggle, means “having a hard time” which is the oppoiste of what vet does against gunners, basically on any build.
comparatively speaking vet has a harder time against gunners compared to psykers and zealots because of the lack of abilities to, help kill them in any meaningful way
if your going to argue that “vet has grenades” well um, yeah all classes have grenades
if your going to argue “vet has guns” um… yeah all classes have guns
if your going to argue that “vet can highlight targets” um… big woop, the gunners go burr with giant muzzle flashy. if your struggling to target them your doing something wrong
if your going to argue that “vet has good range damage” well. um news flash, gunners don’t have much health to begin with, the increased damage is good for ogrens bosses etc but, at the end of the day. you still need to aim down your sights, while a gunner is shooting at you. and then shoot the gunner
comparatively speaking vet has a harder time against gunners then most other classes
on a zealot you can simply dash directly towards them if you want, because your a zealot, and you don’t care, zealots also have perks that make them always count as dodging bullets even when your stamina is depleted, zealots also don’t need stamina to keep on running fast their lack of stamina penalty is minimal at best. i couldn’t care less if i have stamina or not as a zealot because it makes barely any difference
on a psykter you just hold a button and they get deleted, or left click with a crystal and they get deleted, or zap the entire crowd of gunners and then they get deleted, or use a long range staff as much as they want whiteout ammo concerns and then they get deleted, or put up a barrier and shoot them with a gun, without them being able to shoot the psyker because the psyker is strong AF and then the gunners get deleted
with orgren you, idk i don’t play organ yet but I’m assuming you have a shield and a charge they will figure it out
unless you can, say words that prove that the vet “actually is the best at taking down gunners” by saying more then just “the vet is the best at taking down gunners” i wont have anything more to say to you, because your just giving your personal option/ experience and not analyzing the facts
if you want my personal opinion, i have no problem with the gunners the way they are
if your going to argue person opinion with me, then your arguing against your own opinion because we are of like mind already
Basically your post can be summarised in: “I’m still not experienced with my veteran and i struggle a bit in dealing with gunners”.
I’m not sure what the topic has turned into, but I just thought it would be more fun for gunners to have to reload often. Wait for those gaps in bullet storms and then rush and cover. It would make melee viable and more interesting against gunners.
I was just in a mission with what felt like 8 gunners all spawning on the street and balconies, and we nearly wiped because they focused fired with no gaps in their bullet torrents. It’s not really fun to play stuff like that.
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