Oygrn Heavy Hitter not working with Haymaker, Thrust and Savage sweep

[SirLoinOfBeef]

Issue Type (Required):

Blessings

Issue Description (Required):

I’m trying to do the Penance “Onslaught” and was using a Mk 3b bully club with level 4 Haymaker, level 3 thrust and found that heavy attacks/kills didn’t count towards Heavy Hitter including the Ripper gun bayonet attack kills. I found this after starting a mission with 766 kills towards it and ended with the same number even after going most of the round in melee

I went into Meat Grinder to try and figure out what happening and found if a melee weapon had level 4 Haymaker, worked with level 2, level 3 thrust or one of the knives with Savage Sweep it doesn’t count those kills, all of my other weapons that do not have those blessings worked and gave me stacks of Heavy Hitter

I don’t know what level it bugs out with Haymaker since I have only tried it with Level 4 and 2 and level 2 worked fine, Thrust was only tried on level 3 and Savage sweep was all 4 levels and bugged out .

I noticed a difference when using weapons that were not bugged and gave me the buffs from Heavy Hitter compared to the ones that bugged it

Steps to Reproduce (Required):

1. unlock Heavy Hitter Keystone
2. equip any melee weapon with Haymaker level 3+, Thrust or Savage sweep
3. Kill enemies with heavy attacks the icons in the corner next to the coherency one will bug out and not count Heavy hitter attacks and they will not count towards Onslaught Penance

[PC] Do You Use Mods? (Optional):

No, I don’t use mods

Reproduction Rate (Required):

Constant (100%)

Platform (Required):

PC - Steam

[Apoptosine]

Want to second this post with my own issues with the Penance and particularly Heavy Hitter:

I want to put my contribution as to what is going on with heavy hitter also, I too am pursuing ‘Onslaught’ Penance and have been for about the last week, I am getting really frustrated, not because of the number requirement, but to find out something is amiss with heavy Hitter.

My build each game is a nearly “Pure” left column Skullbreaker build–I haven’t noticed any difference in the blessings on the weapons having a discernible difference though. I played many games and always in Pubs, I’ve used BB, Kourk 4/6, all clubs–IIIb in particular(Skullcrusher/thunderous), all 3 shovels–I went through a phase of seeing if there is any difference/pattern. I mainly have used Krourk 4 and BB for honest “numbers” attempts. My main Kourk 4 ahd 6 have Thrust, my favorite BB does not (Savage sweep/slaughterer).

–I don’t use mods
–The pattern or “non pattern”(see below) is constant as I have player well over 20-30 games with this happening, in many difference circumstances.
–PC Steam, standard proprietary G5 5000 Dell

Problem: I rarely see the heavy hitter indicator for stacks on heavy/charged swings that “appear to hit” even in crowds I have islolated, I’d say the indicator /stacks appear 15% of the time and can be “streaky.” I mean that I will see the indicator/stack(s) about 15% of the times that per the description “on heavy attack hit,” it should appear/stack AND when it goes away I can be laying heavies into a crowd of mobs even in the Psykanium and it might not appear for a while–in fact when it disappears it might not come back for a good while. I will cool off as if it had appeared and timed out “7.5 seconds” and go at it again and it will not appear. Maybe I’m getting the damage buff and maybe not? But if I am the numbers certainly aren’t counting toward Onslaught Pennance.

For a clearer view, if I am not buffed at all and HH a single mob like a solo scab mob, twice I can usually see the buff indicator and a second stack appear, but not each and every time. I will be at 2-3 stacks with the indicator and HH into a crowd hitting 3+ enemies and sometimes not even get a stack it’s like I did a light attack(Brutish Momentum) or whiffed. I will watch the stacks as indicated get to 5 (which almost always requires at least 6 heavy swings into a an opponent(s) and I’ll practically solo 2-3 hordes and come out with like 5-20 kills under the Pennance. I can’t isolate the cause other than maybe it’s hits not registering or something, I really can’t tell see a pattern.

By “experience,” I should be coming out of some missions with 100-200 kills under 5 stacks but it has never happenned, I think the best I was able to get was 80-90, I may have broke over 100 on one game.

I’m inclined to think that the keystone ability is definitely not working as described-- something is wonky and I am sorry I can’t have closer observation other than than this.

Almost forgot:

–Steps to reproduce:

On PC–(however an earlier post was made by a console user and poo poo’d off as just a buff not appearing)

–Equip any melee weapon with Ogryn and build below, also an Ogryn without the “Onslaught” Penance done so that kills can be tallied or not and compared to actions in game. Enter Tier 4/5 or Auric public games, multiple games preferred–as earlier posts that Veteran Counter fire was causing Heavy Hitter not to work for example of speculation. Take notes of blessings if it is felt necessary, and observe if buff actually works.

My religious build:

[Lt.DavinFelth]

Since we are at it (Ogryn heavy attacks), have anyone noticed that Thrust charges slower in actual match than in Psykhanium?
Also, sometimes heavy attack stay “charged” even when it should have been released.

Am I experiencing different time flow or something is really off?

[Apoptosine]

I don’t take Psykanium to be the same as game, and I’ve heard comments about there being real differences. We’re talking about what seems to be an issue with Heavy Hitter, and the non registering of kills making it seem pretty evident there is an issue–buff marker aside.

Not sure what the Psykanium aims to do exactly because with/without mods it’s a moderate reflection of how performance will be in a game typically.

[kuli]

@Apoptosine

My build each game is a nearly “Pure” left column Skullbreaker build

[…]

I will watch the stacks as indicated get to 5 (which almost always requires at least 6 heavy swings into a an opponent(s) and I’ll practically solo 2-3 hordes and come out with like 5-20 kills under the Pennance.

Enemies dying to bleeds (Batter) do not count towards the penance.

And as far as OP is concerned: Haymaker instakills don’t count for the penance either, arguably for the same reason why they don’t proc certain talents: They’re not considered (heavy attack) melee kills.

[Apoptosine]

Yeah hadn’t considered the bleed, and had considered in a lot of cases team mate contributions of all kinds and situations. A very good point though! But here is the case where I might try to address this as not a full explanation: I have literally and on multiple occasions specifically used my Bull Butcher (and btw I don’t use haymaker except on GunLugger Mk IIIb or whatnot), and established the following conditions: A solid 5 stacks of HH, with the buff marker showing–it’s not too hard to keep up as lights refresh it, then of course in many a field of hordes used lights to rapid clear large numbers. I do this where I am isolated from team contributions, at least as far as direct damage to them (and not buffs on me etc).

It would be reasonable to check the penance progress during or after and see, 10, 15, 20, 40 point jumps and I sometimes do! Sometimes not. THEN when I do the same thing, but instead of getting a buff indicator and stacks showing–which shouldn’t be happening in theory–by landing a heavy hit on opponents and refreshing lights within 7.5 seconds to hopefully ensure I have HH5 or HH at least building up(since I can’t see the buff even when they clear up) and I repeat the conditions already mentioned: Nada, or maybe 1-3.

I go heavy into the combats and can’t always maintain the “testing” in pubs at all times, but I literally will complete a Hab Dreyko with only 20-40 penance progress, which is just plain gumbo.

What you mention i think is possibly the best explanation of what might be amiss with penance credits, but it lays aside that the buff, when not showing seems to be telling the truth, and that’s that the Keystone ability just isn’t operating as described, and I’d estimate it’s at least 2/3 to 3/4 of the time during any match, on average, just from experience. In truth I’ve gotten into the habit of looking for the buff most very time I think it should proc and show up, and I am finding it can be really scarce.

I’ve had my highest humber of penance credits, and likely most “uptime” on HH5 in matches where I have had 2-3 psykers on the team. There may be some merit to a posting I saw suggesting that the Vet abilities maybe be hanging it up. This suggests to me that yes there may be some interference on the interactions when other buffs are present regardless.

[kuli]

@Apoptosine

A solid 5 stacks of HH, with the buff marker showing–it’s not too hard to keep up as lights refresh it, then of course in many a field of hordes used lights to rapid clear large numbers.

You are aware that the conditions for the penance are: Being at max stacks of Heavy hitter, and heavy attack melee kills only?

[SirLoinOfBeef]

Played a few games without Haymaker, one with a bully club with just thrust level 3 and it didn’t count towards stacks of Heavy Hitter same with a cleaver with savage sweep the last game with a Mk2 bully club without thrust or haymaker got me stacks of heavy hitter unless I was in coherency with our psyker that had seers presence, if I had at least one stack of Heavy Hitter I wouldn’t get the seers presence buff or if I was getting it, it wasn’t showing it and acted like I wasn’t in coherency at all so Heavy Hitter is probably effected by a lot of other buffs

And I’m talking about just getting stacks of Heavy Hitter which don’t require kills just hitting an enemy with a heavy attack any of the buffs listed above bug out the keystone and it seems other abilites from other classes can too

[Apoptosine]

This may well become a game log but it’s been “acknowledge,” so yay! I wanted to log my most recent game as I am paying much more attention to the various factors:

I was using the Mk III shovel with Brutal Momentum and Thrust, map: Warren 6-19. On arrival to game in progress with 3 veterans I saw no uptime or buff marker for HH at all on any heavy swings i did for like half the map(I joined near the beginning, past the walk-to). Things were looking weak and about 2/3 through one or two vets quit and we got another Ogryn and a Zealot after about the second or mid event, the darker room with the auspec, I started to see the buff and nurtured it at 5 easily, it then appeared about 1/4 of the time on HHs, and I tried to pay attention to where I was with regard to the veteran–I don’t know what skills he was using. I nurtured a buff showing HH5 through the last fight and took some “side” time to clear out as many creeps as i could on the exit, racked up over 100 kills I think from the Penance Tally. From this one game things are pointing me to suspect it might be only some Vet aura or buff I don’ t know, because I shouldn’t be seeing as much downtime (HH not appearing to work at all) if it were just some effect that comes and goes on the Veteran.

The map was Hi Intensity so there was plenty of time to try and proc an HH at nearly any given location or time, and I was trying and looking. Near the end of the map we got a little more spread out and I would see the buff come up more often. I think I racked up over 100 for the penance? Yay!

This would mean that under the current circumstances I’d need to play at least 50 games the same way to get the penance…Corny. If I got over 100 that game it was one of the better ones for sure.

Anyhow I hope that by “acknowledged,” it means someone at FatShark is looking into it. The issue probably has some compounding factors as to how the game is programmed, but there really seems to be an issue with the Keystone working as intended under some fairly common circumstances to “most of the time” circumstances–at least as far as how I play.

[Apoptosine]

Thanks for pointing this out. No I really wasn’t thinking on that assumption, I have read the penance over. What seems to be boiling over is the Keystone HH isn’t functioning as described, Thanks for pointing that out to me as I brushed passed that even rereading it before. As far as the penance I’ll keep it in mind and it explains probably why I got a much higher score–when HH was actually working in the game I described above as I was using the heavies on the Mk III a LOT more.

Outside of the penance, which within the pursuit of it, users like me and other casual players came to the forums because something’s wonky. Outside of the penance and my distorted analysis of what should be happening with lights there is a much bigger impact to the Keystone likely not even functioning I haven’t mentioned, as this post began around the penance.

First it appears HH may not be activating as intended. Even I sort of shrugged off not seeing the buff all the time. Secondly one doesn’t get the damage bonuses to heavies when this happens, nor the +100% melee kill toughness replenish or the Attack speed (Unstoppable/Just getting Started respectfully). Unstoppable is really handy when trading vulnerability to both melee and ranged aggro in the middle of a mixed ocean of critters, the damage is really handy in hopefully staying alive/non disabled and getting out of such jams.

In any event, yes I was thinking the penance only applied to having the HH5 up on any sort of melee last hits, thanks for paying your attention!

[Apoptosine]

SO ON THE NOTE towards the thread heading, aside from anything that might be wonky with HH, for getting the penance I highly recommend using Mk III Latrine shovel or Krourk Mk VI for the best results per game. Maybe the shovel is better as it hits with more distance. I was totally off the mark with the Bull Butcher.

Also on a side note, entered a game with bots and Krourk VI using heavies all the way and never saw the buff appear once, another player joined about 5 minutes in and still no sign of it as long as the next 5 minutes lasted in the game–Nurgle napped on with 6 Crushers and a dog. Doesn’t mean it’s not working in a sort of “Ghost mode,” haven’t been able to parse that.

[SilverJack]

It’s the Bleed node causing you not to progress the HH penance. It steals the kills. Why this exists at all, only FatShark could know.

[Apoptosine]

Thanks Silverjack, it does sort of make sense bleeding out might no count on the penance, frankly I cold lean either way on that. I don’t think I’ll start any new threads on what might still be maintained as the main issue that seems to be afoot, which is how, when and most importantly “IF” the heavy hits register to begin stacking for Heavy Hitter keystone.

Much of the discussion to this point has been a sort of collective quasi data from users experiencing this, with or without pursuing the penance actively. When I first searched for issues around HH appearing in the buff display or triggering properly the results seem to show some responses as issues with the platform, and other professions/abilities seeming to interfere with it, so I kept posting here and following up with my own journey.

Regardless of penance credits tallying this way or that the main issue emerges as what seems to be an issue of whether heavy hits are working in game toward ‘Heavy Hitter’ keystone as described, and to a lesser extent if the buff display for it is accurate or working properly.