NEW Topic - CONTINUED discussion - Fatshark needs to LISTEN to customers

Why? Because your enjoyment is only one that is important?

Yes, because them going back on their word, due to malice or incompetence, and you defending their actions and new state of the game are totally separate points. Not relevant to each other at all! /s

And that telling lies to your customers is somehow fair and totally ok to do.

I don’t believe they made a “choice”. And until they make a new statement, that they intentionally wanted to change and alienate part of the playerbase for benefit of another part of the playerbase, the only official intent of FS is to keep the difficulties as close as possible to pre WoM.
Until then your point that Legend difficulty increase is intentional rather than a poor job by FS is not true.

Yeah, I don’t care. For multiple reasons:
1)It requires all 4 people own WoM to play it.
2)As long as it’s called after highest official V1 difficulty it has no place being V2 difficulty.
3)The clear pandering to V1 veterans should go even further and make Cata feel like entirely different game - reduce the spawns, make them as beefy as Beta 1 numbers.
4)Tribuchests will always be superior loot engines to Catavaults.

No. Nightmare difficulty should.

We clearly haven’t played the same game. Outside of FK, who to quite of few was underpowered and didn’t offer that much to the team as others, since damage negation wasn’t as relevant compared to good crowd control and tankiness, none of the rest of “tanks” were useless, just not as important. Because nature of the beast that is Quick Play, game was balanced about being able to beat any mission with whatever motley crew you have assembled.

  • Positioning - nothing new, you got surrounded you were more or less dead then as you’re now, well now you’re dead faster since attacks come faster and your pitiful base regen can’t keep up, so you’d have to build tanky, if you find yourself in such situations often.

  • Map knowledge - what to know more cheese spots? Or you mean due to buggy spawn and tracking system knowing where those bugs would least affect you?

  • Communication - oh yeah:

When using tools of communication is detrimental to your game. What a great design!

There’s way more to the differences. V1 numbers on Nightmare were more akin to Recruit numbers in V2. Trying to recreate same experience as V1 in V2 ain’t happening.

And here we have it. Eh @Rumeht tackles your statements better than I could, I’ll leave it to him.

5 Likes

No, because it has nothing to do with fairness. I’ve explained why they would want to make the gameplay style flow from each difficulty. Your initial point about me saying something unfair is irrelevant.

Also you keep trying to say that it’s about me getting what I wanted and other people losing out. All I’ve done is tried to explain why they may have made the decisions they did. A lot of Fatsharks decisions come from feedback, and lots of people were calling out Legend as being a run-off-solo-fest. The fact that they tried to address it with multiple changes during development is no shock at all.

Anyway, your responses here seem mostly emotional, so I’ll just leave that as my final response into ‘fairness’.

Examples:

Also:

He didn’t address the point you quoted about the reward system.

A lot of people here and on other Fora. Many more people who aren’t so vocal were getting rekt in Legend regularly in 1.6 and it feels like the relative minority who have been vocal about Legend being too easy have got what they wanted at the expense of others.

I completely disagree that something like a red that gives you guaranteed stats boost should be gated behind difficulty. Some Skins&Frames - yes- make them legend/cata only, but keep a lot of the content locked behind difficulty and you risk annoying a lot of your customers.

Virtually ALL of the skins and available at Legend should be available some other way as well at lower difficulties in my opinion, albeit at either a much higher cost to time or something - like the Bonfires frame in the Winter event. As there is so much content locked to Legend, it is fostering some high-brow opinions that people either need to improve themselves or miss out on all that content.

Problem is (on this forum at least) those who can run CATA/ LEGEND are complaining the combat isn’t as engaging or fun.

Not many people are truly happy so the OP posted 2 weeks ago still stands.

4 Likes

:thinking: That’s a 2H hammer. There seems to be some fundamental misunderstanding you have here. So I’ll throw on a song and start working my way from the top to the bottom.

Course not. Which is why my opinion is not reflective of the entire community. On the same token, the way you play is just as little of an indicator of the community as a whole. People have differing playtimes of play levels and playtime they can even dedicate afterall. But you’re saying that the rewards were somehow not dependent on a time investment. And that’s wrong. My friend has played this game significantly less than me. Only about 400 hours. He still has yet to see a red conflag staff. I can’t begin to make assumptions on the many many things that are ticking off people. I have some, and some people share my sentiments. On the other hand, you find things you like and you share their sentiments.

They don’t die if I’m alive. They may get downed from but pokes. But that’s what happens when two people are next to each other or are fighting the same wave from the same angle. But die? I refuse to allow it. Generally outside of them getting antsy and sprinting into the distance for some elite, they’re alive. As I’ve said, I work under the assumption that they will get disabled and adjust accordingly. But to be frank, I was a little mean spirited. Because I was operating under the assumption that you’d have a comment preplanned to try and rip my playstyle apart, so I got an inarguably good player to play alongside.

Why was the BH high? Because he was a good player. Why is his ranged high? Because he knows how to fight in a horde without being side by side to somebody. And by proxy he knows the distance to avoid taking aggro and proc a running attack that I then have to deal with. I can’t QP into a non cata game and make these assumptions of a random.
Pay special attention to our revives. If I’m any distance farther than one that allows me to instantly pick up an ally, that’s a failure on everybodies part.

Back to the scorecard that you’re talking about. The WS doesn’t get to have high ranged presence because we’re doing maps with easy party surrounds and he’s competing directly against the Sienna. The Sienna however did great. As indicated by her damage done and her total kills. For clarity to you and any who are reading this:
Burn damage doesn’t show up under ranged or melee kills
Your assumption that she had to “run around kiting” is incorrect.

Have another one while we’re at it
Where was the safest play in the finale of Horn of Magnus? Near me but not on top of me. Because hits I dodge are hits they take. And when they take these hits I then have to go pick them up. What was the safest place to be when the CW’s dropped? Near me. Because axes stagger them as they have no functional poise and that heavy stagger let’s everybodies stagger talents burn them down.

Next up

  1. I imagine your games also still take forever if in every stress point you just wall up and not budge a bit, while being highly susceptible to oolos gas, max distance oot storms, and double banners.
    However that’s mostly inconsequential
  2. It’s not my job to play a certain way and have certain weapons just because my team is composed of certain individuals. To begin with. When you QP into games, you are almost certainly at risk of being sucked straight into the mission. Let’s say I’m running 2h axe and pickaxe. There’s no way I’m front lining for anybody. Least of all because I’d probably be running barge if I’m using pickaxe to cleave for… various reasons related to the consistency of Grimnirs Focus

Next up

You goofy goober. 36 ranged kills. 24 specials. Throwing axes pierce. An axe or two (counting misses) for a special that may cleave. Don’t be silly.
I’m not running around with axes out. For one they don’t benefit from focus. For two they don’t provide temp.

Good grief

The entire point, which I’m glad you’ve picked up is that Legend teaches no tools for teamplay. The highest success method of winning requires playing into yourself. These lessons are not true for cata. In which I now have to play to my allies because of the inflated health and damage values.


Next, as I’ve mentioned at length which you’ve glossed over intentionally it seems, it was more than possible to introduce two difficulty modes. One paid, one not. That served to branch up to the current tier (but a little harder because current Legend is a relative joke when you start abusing the game) and from that current tier into Cata. Recruit to Legend remains the same. Offical Legend+ we’ll call it, serves as a teacher. Cata is the capstone. One paid. One not. Great idea? Yeah I know Hooray me.

Oh and this song is over. One moment.

Moving on again.

Good for you. And I sincerely mean that.

B

This is what new Legend is like*
The only reason I keep the other guys alive is because I MIGHT get pounced. And I need them to escape from that.

Finally

Firmly disagree. I think temp hp should be further reduced across the board. If you want to invoke more teamplay you either use the suggestions of my post or you put health to such a degree that hits of any sort are now things the team can’t take. This provides more value to Merc and Bomb Balm as well as makes heal share a desirable trait and let’s NB be competitive again.
These should be relative.

You’re playing a glass cannon career? Then you’re glass cannon. Period.

So in conclusion:

  • Not fighting side by side to somebody isn’t the same as not fighting near anybody.
  • Good players are good players and less than good players have absolutely no impact on a Legend clear
  • Legend in its current form teaches nothing and is in many ways a worse gameplay experience than previous Legend (Cata is great though)
  • I don’t like this iteration and that’s fine
  • You like this iteration and that’s also fine

Not trying to change anybody’s mind here :stuck_out_tongue:

3 Likes

That’s because the learning curve didn’t represent the harder difficulties and give a similar feeling throughout the game. On V1, our group didn’t move to Nightmare until we had learned all of the maps and increased our skill enough, then we played on Nightmare an lost 90% of our matches until we improved. The playstyle was similar on each difficulty, but more intense.

This couldn’t be said of V2. The teamplay learning curve didn’t exist beyond high end deeds, and even they could be similar to Legend at the time. Legend now teaches you to play more like Cata. I haven’t seen if they succeeded in doing this with the lower difficulties, but I hope so.

And it doesn’t matter if you’re not going to play Cata. What matters is consistancy in gameplay. There’s no point in having 5 difficulties which all feel like a completely different game.

Rewards:
In the last game reds took forever to farm, I think I only ended up with one or two, and I was happy with that. I’m not against giving high stats for gameplays sake, but the reward system has been moot for a while. When you’re sitting with 100 Emperor’s chests and w/e else, and can’t even be bothered to open them, doesn’t that tell you something?

There’s no point in having rarity at all if the reds are pretty much given to you. Just have reds and be done with it.

Now, I prefer long term rewards to be tangible in gameplay, but some people don’t mind. So in terms of cosmetics vs stats, I’m willing to take a long term cosmetic reward if they don’t want to do stats. My problem is that the cosmetic store they were planning on down the line may have better looking stuff than the thing you’re going to farm.

But the main point is to give ANY long term reward at all. Not have the highest tier of reward be in every other Emp chest.

I’m not responding to you when you’re being so emotional. sorry.

Not really worth my time.

What? You just skimmed the post you goober.

Read the TL;DR.
Though, actually it’s not necessary. I was correcting misguided assumption. But, I’ll gladly take an out when ones presented to me : P

Hmm… I don’t think this works the way you think this works.

Ah, @Rumeht , we mere peasants are unworthy of someone who interprets wisdom or creators!

3 Likes

As I’ve said. I’m not one to turn down an out. I’m a bit overdue to pen up a RV super-post but (I think I’d rather wait another 10 minutes in this cata queue and see if I get two more people)

Sides. My late night post sure was emotional. I get emotional sometimes so, maybe they’re right? :hugs:

ôO How so ? Commendation chests gives nearly no red ? Did he spend 500 hours on recruit ?

Commendation chests and chests to complete daily missions, and good luck!

Don’t believe it at all, sorry. The Commendation Chest chance for Veteran items is so low that he’d have to play double the hours or more in order to get full Veteran items for one character compared to just doing it from Legend Vaults.

Yeah, forget it.

A new hero or careers will not bring any form of sustainability to the current game.

It is a broken game with more bugs than any other I’ve encountered, its time to step up and actually perform QoL fixes on features in the game that spit in players faces and say “waste your time rerolling MORE!”

2 Likes

I completely agree with you.

The main complaint is they changed the core mechanics. I was looking forward to this expansion but it has been a great disappointment for me, not that they didn’t add enough content but because they changed too much and made it less fun for me.

VT2 is the only game i played over the last year. But at the current state of the game i will not bother wasting my time with it. I’ll keep an eye on patch notes and might be back in a few month if FS finally listened and fixed this mess.

5 Likes

Red’s might be considered reward but they are also progress. They are the unlocking of top tier stats. It has been is and will likely continue to be a sore point for people who like the game but have no expectation of this being fixed.

It’s MMO game design and its poor form at this point.

1 Like

Great post

I like many of your ideas on how to make the game more difficult.

This topic was automatically closed 7 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.