I do see the overhead stuff happening, when cornered in crowds. And when people dodge the tracking but the enemy tracks longer than the dodge can counter-act. But yeah, the cc while being swarmed happens a lot, too.
Someone’s feeling spicy. Well, you’re hugely overselling the effectiveness of Bombers in this game. And that’s post-nerf, by the way. They no longer drop live grenades on death, if not primed. I really don’t know what you’re trying to argue.
You can also pay attention to several things at once. Not just the fire or just the overhead strikes or just the disablers.
You make it sound like Darktide is unfathomably straining, almost like you don’t even enjoy the game. You can evade the fire pretty easily with some good positioning. I have a hard time believing you really think it’s the issue that you say it is, but I don’t see your real motive yet why you want Bombers / Fire nerfed so much. I will found out eventually, though.
Also, I did not say that I die to Mauler overheads. I said that’s what I see others downed by on the regular. Among the other stuff.
I wish “Skill Issue” was a reductive non-argument, but regarding the Bombers it definitely has weight. You can hear them, you can see them, their grenade takes a good while to travel and go off. The Bombers themselves have low HP and the same goes for the Flamers. Overall there is just many ways to counter enemies who produce flame. They’re not even all bad, as their fire affects other enemies, too. Helps kill low HP chaff.
I mean, is that wrong? Don’t stay in the fire? Also I don’t have a problem with Ogryn. I said it’s what I see others downed by. Simply put, I see people die to ambience fire grenades from Bombers the least. And when they do die to it, on the occasion, it’s because they were already sandwiched and bullied by other enemies. In which case the fire grenade was just the extra cream on the Nurgle cake, not the main contributor for death.
Of course, personal anecdotes, but that’s what I see.
If Fatshark released stats, I’d be really curious to see what the main contributor for wipes is. My money is on disablers.
It is.
People don’t “stay in fire” because they’re dumb. They are forced in it by the circumstances.
You treat everybody as if they were dumb bricks that could not press the WASD keys ignoring the fact that there is a myriads of reasons why they could not get out of the AoD in time.
People are not saying that current fire is bad because they want to camp in it, but because it gives no escape during combat.
I see. You read these forums certain mindset and take something away that was never stated or implied.
I have never called or even hinted at someone being dumb on these forums, not even once. Nevermind that being good or not good at dodging isn’t related to intellect in the first place. It’s positioning and twitchy dodge skills, nothing more. Just being reactive really.
So even when I say someone needs to improve their dodge game or stop being in the fire (which I definitely have said), I’m not calling you or anyone dumb. I’m saying they need to be more reactive to their environment.
Maybe not what they’d want to hear and earlier I put a comical spin on it. But it’s true, at least for this fire lake dilemma.
Which is not true. It no longer makes you lock up in a stunanimation for starters. And the first tick still causes no damage, further ticks are absorbed by toughness first. With Vet Shout active you can tank a few ticks before it becomes serious. Zealot Prayer Ult is also great at countering it. And you could dodge the incoming grenade before it lands, just after it’s thrown.
Often, Bombers attack from far away, giving the grenade a healthy travel distance.
They are already reacting to the environment, but there are hundreds of bombs thrown and when the less than 1% occurrence happens and they can’t get out of fire on time, telling them they should have is absolutely dumb.
Depending on how low they are in their bleed out state, starting and stopping the revive can give them extra time. Had a guy on the verge of death, and starting the revive, stopping after 2 seconds, then starting again (I initiated a revive 3 times, I think) kept him alive long enough for the flames to fade.
You may not be able to do it every time, but you can force a bomber to whiff his throw. He’ll lead you when throwing, so if you move in a direction where the fire would be wasted (such as over a ledge), he’ll oblige
No, it’s not.
You say they are already reacting to their environment, but clearly they are not.
Because if they did, there couldn’t be hundreds of bombs thrown. Bombers are slow and can be killed.
If they did react to their environment, they also wouldn’t stand in that fire puddle when it goes off.
Both, the grenades being thrown and standing in the fire indicate a strong lack of reactiveness.
Why should the game be altered, because some people just haven’t the reaction time down yet? I am against that. Where does it end, if any challenge is always patched out or nerfed because people are unwilling to learn?
Darktide is demanding, yes. But that is what makes it great.
I do. I’m also talking generally. The more bombs fly, the less reactive a team is - Which happens.
It’s not a problem really, neither is dying to the fire. That can happen in the game. It’s part of losing.
It’s only an issue now because people claim it is an issue. A working game mechanic, making the game more difficult isn’t a broken thing to be fixed.
It’s like saying being thrown off the map is not an issue because you simply have to not ever be caught by a mutant, then the issue will not present itself.
So games having a legitimate failstate is an issue then?
Why even play games then? Do you see where this goes?
It’s a game. You can’t always reliably win. That’s how it is. If that is an issue in people’s book, then they have to learn that losing is part of games. Being occasionally burned by the funky firedude is part of the game that has a funky firedude in it. Where is the problem? Nowhere but with the person who puts too much ego into a low-intensity situation (playing a game in your freetime).
Being burned is a legitimate failstate.
Being thrown off the map is also a legitimate failstate.
If one doesn’t want to trigger failstates, they must improve to the point where they stop triggering them.
That’s how games work.
No joke. I mostly play Psyker and I have always said that Bombers give me the most trouble as the force me to reposition into places I don’t want to be. At least I used to sometimes have a route to safety even if I took some damage along the way. Now, if I get carpet bombed, I am screwed.
I’ve died more in the last 3 days of playing than I have in the last 3 months. It’s not fun.
I said the flamethrower? They received huge buffs to their action speeds, making giant numbers of them hiding behind giant numbers of everything else insane right now. All of my goofy builds that didn’t really dunk maniacs feel completely awful, like the little las pistol that also recieved an unnecessary fire rate nerf (honestly if they’re going to make the auto fire macro for Lucius official they should have done the rest of the game).
That the thing the developers have already said they’re going to fix, is a bug and its going to be fixed. It is really pointless to argue ‘skill issue’ on that, especially coming from the perspective that somehow maulers the only elite in the game with a sound que on their attacks that is environment-based, seriously their axe always revs and chain weapons are hilariously deafening is the source of all wipes in auric damnation.
Keep your pity-potty comments about spiciness to yourself, I mean you opened with everyone has skill issues and the reflex of pox walkers…you dish but don’t take, I get it there’s a lot of sanctimonious passive-aggressive posters who don’t actually realize that their own words are also capable of offending people too. Try not to be so thin-skinned about it, then.
What are you even talking about? People are saying fire is overtuned, what does it even have anything to do with always winning?
Balance is the key of a game.
Instead of addressing the lack of balance you keep telling people they just need to avoid the imbalanced part and if they somehow can’t avoid it it’s their fault and they deserve to lose.
You can dodge out of the fire without taking damage btw, it’s weird to get used to, but as soon as fire drops and I’m stuck in it, dodge spam out. Super annoying, but it’s a consistent way to get out of that hell.
It’s not imbalanced. It’s a 4 by 4 field you can dodge, prevent from spawning altogether and even partially endure.
It’s an easily beaten failstate and some players fail at it, which is fine. It needs no changing.
At this point they’re just rewarding people and training them to demand more nerfs to accomodate their sub-optimal positioning and plays. It’s sad, but it is what it is.
Instead of giving people chances to grow, we take the challenge away so those currently not at the level yet (they’d definitely get there with more playtime) can feel “heard”.
Absolutely nobody said it’s the source of all wipes. I said it’s more of a killer than the easily prevented fire pits from Bombers.
How am I thin-skinned. I’m literally in -the the mode- right now. Which is why I made the “spicy” comment in the first place. It’s not an insult to me. It’s a playful thing. I’m having fun. I see that you don’t now. That’s a shame but also not of my concern.
Yes, when people keep saying that an almost static obstacle (fire on ground) is a problem, despite obstacle being easily dodged, then I eventually conclude that these players need their reflexes a little more trained. And maybe I will voice that in that playful writing style.
It’s not like this is the first anti-fire thread. Maybe if the fire was just as deadly as advertized, I’d take myself it a bit back. But that’s just not the reality. Anything fire related in this game can be countered with awareness and confident reactive moves. There is no grand overtuned fire. Just a number of players not admitting to themselves that this may be one time they messed up.
It’s nothing. You could laugh it off and go for the next round. Yet it’s made out to be this enormous thing in here like a gigantic issue that must be adressed. I don’t see enough self-reflection from players on that front and too many nerf demands, which are unreasonable. Yes, I find such hyperbole coupled with this negative mindset of “woe is me” worthy of mockery.
As for the offense thing, I want to adress that elephant in the room here
You’re constantly taking offense to Fatshark’s in-character usage of “Rejects” in their blogposts, too, right?
I find this to be a contrived attempt at gaining power. I call your bluff! You are not really offended, you just want some high ground. And that simply shouldn’t be rewarded with acknowledgement.
Taking offense to other people does not give you anything of worth and won’t stop people from being creative when it comes to their write-ups.
There, I said it.
What I have to ask is what was so wrong with fire before the change to warrant it? I know people complained because “My 250 toughness is now zero” but why shouldn’t the enemy be able to have an answer to toughness (especially specialists)
With the previous fire mechanic, if you touch the fire, you were immediately put into a vulnerable state (just like any other specialist in the game). Annoying? Kinda, but that’s what they’re designed to do. At the very most (and it’s not something I would necessarily request, but could foresee), the old fire could have that momentary grace period where the flame debuff is filling up.
However, other specialists don’t give you a second chance once you’re grabbed (unless Your Friendly Neighbourhood Mutant comes barrelling through and tackles a dog for you) so I don’t think it makes sense to provide one for fire damage.
EDIT: To be clear, this isn’t me trying to beat the “git gud” drum. I’ve stood in plenty of fire. Sometimes I won, sometimes the fire won
Isnt this discussion kinda pointless.
Fatshark has acknowledged that the fire is overtuned and will adjust it.
Defending the amount of dmg fire is doing now makes me suspect that the person defending it is playing on lower difficultys, where one simply just can dodge out of it.
Also on lower difficulty you almost always have full toughness, that is not the case on higher difficultys.
The penalty for not moving out of fire should be damage, not instant death.
If u get cought by a dog or mutant there is plenty of time to get rescued with minimal damage recived.
With current fire you just die.
Its easy to see, just go watch some of the streamers that has thousands of hours in the game and are quite competent, they die to the new fire all the time.
I don’t know why you’re asking me since I never even talked about fire before the latest change.
Simply put, though, fire is an AoD and it’s meant to force you to move away.
The way an AoD should work is not to immediately deal a ton of damage, but ramp it up the more you ignore it.
IMO it should have never even affect the toughness, it should have always bypassed it and gone directly to health, but the damage should start extremely low and ramp up fast so that even ogryns with 400+ HP would be killed in 5 seconds.
The way the spitter’s damage worked on L4D2 is a good example of a highly damaging AoD effect that would still give you time to save yourself if you got caught in it.
