attractive like all of our very handsome lads that is
preface/justification: once fatshark does fatshark things and realize 90% of ogryns are using Feel No Pain instead of the alternatives, we’re going to be stuck using actually bad keystones for what they want to accomplish. I know, I know, it’s a subjective opinion and all but the ramp up on heavy hitter doesn’t add much (heavy attacks already bop) and burst limiter override only adds value to one set of guns, something fatshark said was what they wanted to avoid with the veteran keystones so they took them out and look at where that got everyone.
Burst Limiter Override removed and added to gun lugger aura option. Giving teammates 8% chance in coherency (and yourself) a free bullet. Gives an additional ammo based aura to teams to reduce reliance on Vet Ammo Aura and adds that wonderful bit of ogryn luck to the party.
BLO replaced with Lucky Pockets. Every 10-30 seconds your next shot/burst is free and automatically loaded into the gun. This gives rumbler/kickback/grenade gauntlets that sort of punchy “i can switch to this mid fight and cause chaos” feeling, like having a second rock timer.
Either that or every time a teammate picks up ammo, the ogryn gets a free % of it (cause they’re helping the big man load his gun or something in rp)
For Heavy Hitter, I’m taking inspiration from City of Heroes’ brute class. It should be replaced with Fury/Berserk/some thematic name like that. Give the Ogryn a stack or bar. It fills up and he takes less damage and does more damage. Maybe he attacks faster. Maybe at a certain point of the stacks/bar light attacks become heavy attacks and they attack faster without having to charge up. Maybe they move faster. Maybe power goes up so everything cleaves even more. Maybe it adds rending. Maybe if a teammate goes down the ogryn gets a baseline 20% rage per teammate incapacitated.
If the zealot focuses on personal buffs to attack speed and increased damage (sustained assault, punishment, disdain, etc), then I think the ogryn should focus on debuffing targets instead of boosting personal dps. Attacking faster and beating things down with a fury mode would add brittleness/rending/fire/skullcrusher type +damage just to make a distinction and feed into that, like with soften them up.
While I agree that BLO needs some first aid care immediately and is debatedly the worst keystone in the game, Heavy Hitter is absolutely amazing as it is and doesn’t really need a change. I do like your idea but that would hurt melee Ogryn’s overall DPS, and I think that powering up through heavies, and than being able to keep your full buff up during a fight with heavies or lights is better than a temporary buff.
I think for BLO something like “Crits with ranged weapons cost 0 ammo, +5% ranged critical chance” for a base keystone could be good and change Good Shootin’ to something else. Maybe after every X enemies hit by ranged attacks guarantee a Critical, so the kickback and rumbler aren’t left to dry.
I’ve been running BLO and Charmed Reload for my Heavy (light) Stubber Ogryn and it has provided me endless Dakka and is great, I would be very sad to see that go
That said I do agree with its current form it mostly only benefits stubbers and maaaaaybe ripper guns.
My smoothest (and simplest) solution would make BLO % for lucky bullet based on the weapon used.
So Stubbers/Rippers have a 5% chance and Kickback/Rumbler/Grenade Gauntlet has a 10-15% chance to trigger.
Also:
This would be great for those guns, but absolutely useless for Stubbers, I currently prog lucky bullet way more often with Stubbers than a 10-second timer would give me. So it would just reverse the situation of the keystone becomes only viable for the other group of weapons.
If we should do a complete changeover of BLO I would go full Ogre magi, so instead of lucky bullets it is: “Whenever a ranged weapon triggers a blessing, X% chance for that blessing is triggered twice, if the trigger is a stack/timed the second trigger is its own instance. When triggered, BLO goes on a Y seconds cooldown.”
Dunno how many blessings it would make absolutely busted, but it moves the keystone away from favoring one weapon over another based on fire rate and bullet capacity alone.
And by this you mean Charmed Reload has provided with endless dakka, the gain from using Burst Limiter Override is so small that I’m amazed that people can tell the difference when using the keystone or not.
I don’t hate this idea, but I think that overall it’ll be worse, since not all ranged weapons have good blessings to start with and unsure on how all the interactions with this keystone and blessing would be.
Unsure if this should be the way to go about changing it. Increasing the base chance a good amount, or perhaps as some has said making it crit chance based instead. I’d like to see the Keystone modifiers to be changed aswell, one into more ranged damage and not just crit chance from Good Shootin’ and More Burst Limiter Overrides! could be changed into giving toughness damage reduction and/or giving back toughness, to soak ranged fire without using Feel No Pain keystone. Does this need to be a big increase? Not really, perhaps 10% for each on proc, lasting 3~5 seconds and stacking two times.
Short answer here would be that it is mostly fine, and is not in need of change.
I like this, but then you’d need to make the Keystone crit based. Most likely you’d need to lower the damage from the current aura, even though it’s effect looks way better then what it actually provides if you consider suppression immunity and resistance.
Always nice to read ideas for Ogryn and not just another thread about Veterans.
BLO is undoubtedly the worst keystone, brings very little value and, while I don’t agree with OP specific suggestion, I agree that it should be changed somehow.
Heavy hitter is perfect as it is, right now I use it in 90% of my builds, it’s si helpful in reaching breakpoints, especially for horde clear, very hard to pass it up.
Actually didn’t have Charmed Reload for the longest time, so I sure felt the extra bullet or so from BLO too And it is about all the smaller parts adding up. Little extra crit chance, charmed reload (which currently is bugged and only provide half the value ) and Lucky Bullets.
Sure, but but it might also enable some lesser blessings into viability as they can trigger more.
And for how it interact with keystones and blessings would be quite the task to clean out for sure haha.
Exchange the last node in BLO for two, one that in increases the chance for lucky bullet (base chance should be raised, though) by 1% for every X% of magazine spent (for the rumblers) and another one that benefits small magazine weapons instead, like increased chance over time while not shooting, or guaranteed once every 30 seconds, or increased chance on the last round in the magazine.
The keystone is currently a bit underwhelming, but mostly it’s boring.
Heavy Hitter is perfectly fine, I believe. I’d love to have more options to increase attack speed, though. Ogryn is just SO slow.
Heavy hitter is fine. I really feel BLO is conceptually fine too, I’d just number buff it to relevance personally. Like 10% base chance 15% with final node seem like reasonable amounts (probably a little conservative but have to consider the case of BLO + survivalist Vet). If I just want to shoot a lot and make shooting as strong as possible I’d strongly consider it at those values.
I agree and disagree with the BLO take. I think thay first of all it would be a huge improvement and actually make ot viable. However I problem I have with full gunlugger builds is that they don’t have sustain. What I mean is that if for example you get to an end mission event without an ammo crate, and run out of ammo, you’re practically dead weight to the team. I would like to see Luggers be able to generate very small amounts of ammo, preferably part of the BLO keystone, so that all of their buffs would still relevant for the whole game.
I mean what’s the functional difference between ammo generation and free shots? They’re both effectively just max ammo increases, but free shots also functions as an effective mag size increase. I think either one requires the numbers to be tuned correctly so as to be felt without giving too much effective ammo. As I said the numbers I gave are a little conservative but that’s just because it’s functionally +extra ammo, +mag size, and +crit chance all in one.
Extra ammo is better in long engagments after you’ve run out, so it has better sustain because it can activate when you’re out of ammo unlike free shots.
It shouldn’t be enough free ammo to replace Vet survuvalist aura, and I don’t think it should replace BLO’s effects but be an additional, small effect. Because like I said early it sucks investing in full lugger right now unless you have a pocket vet feeding you ammo.
